EQ going to the sound system

[Kerry Brown]

The last thing on my pedal board is a Radial JDI. I set my tone with the pedal board. It's a pretty clean tone. The XLR out from the JDI goes to FOH. The through out goes to my amp. After the sound check, where I may tweak my pedals a bit at the direction of the sound tech, nothing changes except my amp for stage sound.

 

[Altitude]

I am getting the idea you don't think there is any mutual benefit to people helping each other.

Not at all, and that wasn’t the essence of Zbysek’s post, either. That post implied that if you don’t do what the sound man says, he’ll turn up the suck knob, so best comply.

I’m getting the idea you have your hand on the suck knob.

 

[Wasnex]

That post implied that if you don’t do what the sound man says, he’ll turn up the suck knob, so best comply.

I don't read that all. IMHO if you make it easy for the audio tech, sound check tends to go faster, which is good for everyone.

I’m getting the idea you have your hand on the suck knob.

Nope...I always do my best, unless it gets to the point where I have to walk.

Which is what I am going to do now.

Have nice day.

 

[Altitude]

I don't read that all. IMHO if you make it easy for the audio tech, sound check tends to go faster, which is good for everyone.



Nope...I always do my best, unless it gets to the point where I have to walk.

Which is what I am going to do now.

Have nice day.

We should probably stop, I agree. Tomorrow is another day.

 

[Lammchop93]

Depends how good the “sound engineer” is.

good= pre EQ
Bad= post EQ

 

[jdjk7]

Not trying to be combative or difficult here.. but..
How would you know ??
By that I mean.. different speakers (PA vs bass cab), room reflections, dynamics, back wall bounce, listening position (on stage vs out front), etc.
Out front, you are probably hearing stage wash combined w/ PA, room acoustics. It won't sound like what's coming out of your amp - even tho it's the SAME signal source!

I know for a fact (and from experience) that a clean, unaffected, flat EQ'd sound you send to FOH and hear on stage (with flat EQ on FOH console) CAN [and very often] sounds different thru the PA, both FROM the stage and out front. I'm pretty sure that @Wasnex and @4Mal will confirm that!

Again... my setup is designed to minimize the difference. My cabinets are very flat response, and if there's any cab color, it's in cab simulation that also gets sent to FOH. It's not perfect, but it works.

As far as out in the room and the room acoustics, it helps to have access to a wireless system so that I can check out a bit how the room behaves during sound check. But even so, live sound is always a mess, and I can only do my best to ensure that BOTH a) my sound is the way I want it and b) my sound is working in the room. If the sound guy has to make minor corrections, it's whatever. But I don't personally like my tonal considerations becoming an afterthought when I plug into the DI. I recognize that a lot of bass players don't care, and I envy that they don't have to care... but I am not one of those.

 

[Zbysek]

Sounds like the sound guy making your job harder.

Not at all

 

[Zbysek]

Not at all, and that wasn’t the essence of Zbysek’s post, either. That post implied that if you don’t do what the sound man says, he’ll turn up the suck knob, so best comply.

not at all

in my post, I implied that cooperative approach is the best way to achieve the mutual goal: good product for the audience

 

[Savage_Dreams]

Bands “give up complete control of their tone to the engineer” when FOH is used.. be that to your bands engineer or someone else.
Realizing and accepting it will make it much easier to work with FOH to get what you want. YMMV

only If your soundguy sucks do you give up complete control. a good one translates what you give them to the audience. Theres a big difference.

Do you think people like Entwistle, Sheehan, Bootsy, claypool, Geddy.... any players with a super identifiable tone, run the rigs they do and just gives the FOH a signal straight from the bass? of course not.

If youre happy with whatever bland tone a engineer gives, more power to you. some of us want our own tone.

 

[Wasnex]

Do you think people like Entwistle, Sheehan, Bootsy, claypool, Geddy.... any players with a super identifiable tone, run the rigs they do and just gives the FOH a signal straight from the bass? of course not.

Do you think you can sound like one of these players by simply using post DI? ...I think it's probably a bit more complicated and involved.

Here's a rundown of one of Geddy's signal paths.


This is not the type of setup I would recommend using with a random audio tech. Probably works great with an A-list audio tech who has had time to work with Geddy to learn how and when to combine all of the signals to produce specific tones at specific parts of the show.

IMHO, All of the required combinations should be checked and updated at every soundcheck. There is high probability that the required mixer settings are saved in various scenes or presets in the mixing console that are recalled during the show.

Totally reasonable for an A-lister.

 

[seamonkey]

Give them all the processed sound, effects, at the end of your chain, so they have the best chance to convey your tone to the audience. They may EQ for the house, but ...
Say you're playing your bass near the bridge for part of a song where it's just you and the soloist. You wouldn't want them to try and EQ that for full thunderous bass, as you're playing near the bridge to articulate a sound fits that part of the song. They have to know what you're trying to sound like.

 

[musicman7722]

post eq, post effects, post (almost) everything.

I will never understand why so many bassists are willing to give up complete control of their tone to the engineer when guitarists are never forced to do this.

You are missing a lot of the conversation here. Guitar is easy to mix, bass isn't, period

 

[musicman7722]

only If your soundguy sucks do you give up complete control. a good one translates what you give them to the audience. Theres a big difference.

Do you think people like Entwistle, Sheehan, Bootsy, claypool, Geddy.... any players with a super identifiable tone, run the rigs they do and just gives the FOH a signal straight from the bass? of course not.

If you're happy with whatever bland tone a engineer gives, more power to you. some of us want our own tone.

I did not know we were talking about real pro's here more just the garden variety bass player, like myself. Those stars are in a whole difference universe and even then sometimes they wind up sounding like "poop"

 

[Savage_Dreams]

Do you think you can sound like one of these players by simply using post DI?

Its not about sounding like them. its about sounding like yourself, whatever that may be.

 

[Savage_Dreams]

You are missing a lot of the conversation here. Guitar is easy to mix, bass isn't, period

Where did I say it was easy? still doesn mean every bassist just give a signal direct from the bass and call it good.

 

[Savage_Dreams]

I did not know we were talking about real pro's here more just the garden variety bass player, like myself. Those stars are in a whole difference universe and even then sometimes they wind up sounding like "poop"

Pardon me for having enough confidence to believe I, and my tone, dont deserve any less.

 

[Wasnex]

Pardon me for having enough confidence to believe I, and my tone, dont deserve any less.

Pretty sure those stars pay for what they get...so it's not a matter of what you deserve.

I will say again: If you don't like the way an audio tech mixes, hire someone else. If you are paying the bills then you call the shots. Otherwise, you can certainly advocate for what you want, but you are not entitled to anything IMHO.

 

[Swizzledoop]

I accidently left the switch on POST at a recent gig. Woopsie daisies!

Only realized much afterwards why I was getting the side-eye.

 

[s0c9]

I accidently left the switch on POST at a recent gig. Woopsie daisies!

Only realized much afterwards why I was getting the side-eye.

to be honest - the soundguy in me doesn't [really] have a problem with POST per se - as long as:
1. it's usable in the mix
2. doesn't change every other minute cuz the bass player adjusts their "stage sound"
3. the source appears to have some conception of "bass in the mix".

 

[Marko 1]

I'm the "Sound Tech" (half-ass PA guy) for the band, so when I do put myself in the PA (typically not indoors) I send post-EQ,

but my tone is pretty clean, never boomy, probably nothing a real Sound Tech would have a problem with.

Edit to add: I keep it consistent all night, no changes to speak of.

The more I read (if Sound was provided) the more I would just go with pre instead of explaining to the guy/gal what my post would sound like...

and the more I feel like the techs in this thread are being very kind, 'cause I want to cuss some bass players out myself.