fEARful?

[ThisBass]

May be I'm expecting to much in this regard.

For example there are different "free" plans available which provide more of "essential" data.
I think the most popular "free" plans in this field are TL606 and TL806 published by Electro Voice.
Besides net volume and two possible tunings there is additional "essential" information like the impdance curve.
Then there is additional ees (engineering data sheet) available how the 12L performs in these cabinets.

All of these data given are helpfull to consider suitability with tube heads. As the 12L provides a lowish moving mass that is at the lowish end of scala within the field of Low/Mid woofers there is (mostly) no concerne even with lowish overall negative feeback control to the driver. The impedance peak seems rather moderate so unwanted/unexpected coloring to the sound should be rather small.

If I'd like to load a different driver into the cab the "free" EV DIY plans provide all of informations neccessary to check suitaibilty for this cab design and it's also possible to check "roughly" suitability if powered by a tube head in question.

Unless I don't do a reingineering to the free DIY fearXYZ plans it's not possible to check suitability (personal needs) with an "average" tube head.
The moving mass of the loaded Low-drivers is rather big, so if I would intend to power these cabs with an "average" tube power amp (phase splitter drives pentodes dirctly) I would at least like to see/modell the cabinet low-response to roughly estimate system Qtc. And as mentioned above the impedance curve respectively peak number helps to roughly estimate low/mid emphasis.


My first impression when I read at the Greenboy (DIY) website was somewhat disapointing .
The data I was looking for were not published so I thought by myself, hey what a strange thing, it's a website meant for DIY but essential parameters are totally missing.

 

[Passinwind]

The fEARful cabinet design was a community project insofar as it was vetted by those with an interest, myself included. However, I have never had the impression that the fEARful cabinet was an open design.

Right, IIRC both you and I contributed crossover design input in the early days that probably helped Dave some, and some other things. In the end it's always been Dave's baby though, although he's offered plenty of customization tips along the way and has blessed a few tangents like the T3W crossover as well, even though he doesn't prefer it for his own playing situations.

 

[wcriley]

...published by Electro Voice.

Are you seriously comparing the engineering department at Electro Voice to some guy who designed a cabinet for HIS OWN PERSONAL USE, then foolishly not only released the plans into the public domain, but also refined, designed and released plans for other configurations based around that initial design?

 

[Passinwind]

My first impression when I read at the Greenboy (DIY) website was somewhat disappointing .
The data I was looking for were not published so I thought by myself, hey what a strange thing, it's a website meant for DIY but essential parameters are totally missing.

What part of Do It Yourself don't you understand?

But seriously, all this stuff was hashed out on Talkbass in the earliest threads, and in PMs, and then Dave simply lost interest in arguing with numerous (hundreds!) of people who had some different needs and tonal visions. Plenty of people have run tube heads with fEARfuls with no issues ever reported, but you can always just ask for input on Dave's forum if you need more specifics. Talkbass is not an official support channel, and hasn't been for a few years now.

 

[ThisBass]

The fEARful cabinet design was a community project insofar as it was vetted by those with an interest, myself included.

Correct,
all the more I woudld expect to read further information on the webpage directed to the DIYer.
like considerations about net volume versus tuning or system Qtc (filter alignment).
May be that most of all DIYer are not interested in these data anyway, but it would also not hurt doing it.

May be I'm expecting to much!

 

[carl h.]

Correct,
all the more I woudld expect to read further information on the webpage directed to the DIYer.
like considerations about net volume versus tuning or system Qtc (filter alignment).
May be that most of all DIYer are not interested in these data anyway, but it would also not hurt doing it.

May be I'm expecting to much!

It's not for you, move along.

 

[CL400Peavey]

May be I'm expecting to much in this regard.

For example there are different "free" plans available which provide more of "essential" data.
I think the most popular "free" plans in this field are TL606 and TL806 published by Electro Voice.
Besides net volume and two possible tunings there is additional "essential" information like the impdance curve.
Then there is additional ees (engineering data sheet) available how the 12L performs in these cabinets.

All of these data given are helpfull to consider suitability with tube heads. As the 12L provides a lowish moving mass that is at the lowish end of scala within the field of Low/Mid woofers there is (mostly) no concerne even with lowish overall negative feeback control to the driver. The impedance peak seems rather moderate so unwanted/unexpected coloring to the sound should be rather small.

If I'd like to load a different driver into the cab the "free" EV DIY plans provide all of informations neccessary to check suitaibilty for this cab design and it's also possible to check "roughly" suitability if powered by a tube head in question.

Unless I don't do a reingineering to the free DIY fearXYZ plans it's not possible to check suitability (personal needs) with an "average" tube head.
The moving mass of the loaded Low-drivers is rather big, so if I would intend to power these cabs with an "average" tube power amp (phase splitter drives pentodes dirctly) I would at least like to see/modell the cabinet low-response to roughly estimate system Qtc. And as mentioned above the impedance curve respectively peak number helps to roughly estimate low/mid emphasis.


My first impression when I read at the Greenboy (DIY) website was somewhat disapointing .
The data I was looking for were not published so I thought by myself, hey what a strange thing, it's a website meant for DIY but essential parameters are totally missing.

ElectroVoice released plans, and have data, around their drivers. THAT THEY SELL AND MAKE MONEY OFF OF. Pretty smart marketing on their part. You pay for the driver, and the distribution. Then spend the time and money building the cab yourself. Their profits are probably better on the raw drivers than the cab itself.

Dave Green makes nothing off of the sale of drivers, or the ply wood, or any of the other bits. If there is some more information you want off of a free set of plans, change the drivers or what ever, have at the R&D experience yourself.

I think you are confusing your goals with someone else's. You have repeatedly slandered greenboy recently about the information provided. Talking about the designers motives when he has no presence here on TB any more is pretty low. He doesn't sell the cabs. He doesnt market them himself. He doesnt post here or answer questions here. Feel free to dig to thousands of posts and threads here on TB to find all the answers to your questions that may have been posted in the past. Not doing so, then alluding to what you think the designers motives were on a free DIY set of plans is pretty low.

But enough about you, as your relevance to the actual discussion is zero.

Ok, so we all know TalkBass is super trendy, one of us sees another buy something and reads some testimonial " this amp/cab is great bla bla" and run out to buy/order said cab. We all have GAS. What is the deal with this fEARful stuff I keep seeing lately? I'd be lying if I said I wasn't intrigued. I don't buy anything unless I play through it though, and with Marc Serio kind of shenanigans, I'm apprehensive about ordering custom cabs online.
Can someone please elaborate on why these cabs seem to be trending around here?
Thanks!

@brianvp as others have said, these cabs are not new. They have been around here on TB for some time. There are literally thousands of posts about the design and build process if you dig through the old threads. There is also the greenboy forums which have a lot of information as well.

 

[ThisBass]

It's not for you, move along.

understood

 

[wcriley]

Geez...I thought all the bickering and negativity about fEARful and greenboy ended years ago.
I'm outa' here.

 

[eKay]

I don't know the net volume of my GK cab. Since it's essential to know that, I guess I better cancel my gig on Wednesday night.

But seriously, I'm curious what the refinements are in the Fearless cabs over the fEARful DIY designs.

I was also very curious about... well, someone back there.. said he could hear himself much better with a 12/6. It looks smaller than my 2x12 (shorter) so I'm not sure how that would help me hear myself if I have to be right in front of my rig.

 

[CL400Peavey]

But seriously, I'm curious what the refinements are in the Fearless cabs over the fEARful DIY designs.

Different internal volume/porting, different cross over, different mid driver. The fearless driver is smoother in its response.

I was also very curious about... well, someone back there.. said he could hear himself much better with a 12/6. It looks smaller than my 2x12 (shorter) so I'm not sure how that would help me hear myself if I have to be right in front of my rig.

What 212 do you have? The fEARful cabs have pretty good dispersion.

 

[PaulReside]

I don't know squat about all the Tec speak stuff I'm just a bass player that likes to tinker. I bought a flatpack (pre cut) from Lealand at Speaker Hardware and got to it. I am a good carpenter but not so good with electronics but decided to assemble my own 3-way cross over for my 12/6/1. I was terrified I would mess up and cause the magic smoke to come out of my amp but guess what, it didn't . I had some trouble, but the users forum was so good and examples of proper cross over layout were so easy to find that I got the whole cab done over the course of two weekends. As someone else said if you can assemble an IKEA bookshelf the wood part of this is only about 2x as hard. Oh and it's a total GAS killer, unless you want another fEARful to go with the first.

 

[Jim Carr]

...As for performance, when people come up after and say "The bass sounded good!" believe me it's not because of my ability, especially my genre, which is guitar/ukulele/vocal centric.

...we have a couple fEARfuls now, and I heard there's a fearless on the island...

Yes! There is my 15/6/1 in Kaneohe (above), and also @hintz (Hi Andy!) , built a 1212/6 and is somewhere out near Wahiawa. My genre is also vocal centric (3 part), with ukulele, guitar, bass, and drums (Aloha and Friends from Waimanalo)—mostly Hawaiian Reggae. My fEARful has been pretty great, though I have had amplification issues with assorted pedals as preamps for a Prolite 3.0.

 

[eKay]

Different internal volume/porting, different cross over, different mid driver. The fearless driver is smoother in its response.



What 212 do you have? The fEARful cabs have pretty good dispersion.

It's a GK Neo 212 with Mesa speakers.

 

[CL400Peavey]

I was also very curious about... well, someone back there.. said he could hear himself much better with a 12/6. It looks smaller than my 2x12 (shorter) so I'm not sure how that would help me hear myself if I have to be right in front of my rig.

It's a GK Neo 212 with Mesa speakers.

Well for starters the F112 is a kick back design so that puts more sound towards your ear. Secondly with a smaller diameter mid driver the dispersion is increased, meaning you will hear more of the nuances of your playing and tone. You also have to consider than a signle 3012LF has more output than one of the mesa 12's you are using now.

 

[eKay]

Well for starters the F112 is a kick back design so that puts more sound towards your ear. Secondly with a smaller diameter mid driver the dispersion is increased, meaning you will hear more of the nuances of your playing and tone. You also have to consider than a signle 3012LF has more output than one of the mesa 12's you are using now.

Ah gotcha. I was seriously considering building one (or more) fEARful cabs before this 2x12 came my way. Sounds like it would make a good alternative for smaller venues and a good addition for larger ones. GAS mode activated.

 

[wisconsindead]

Pictures?

Nice! I would love to test drive that rig!

 

[kekani]

Yes! There is my 15/6/1 in Kaneohe (above), and also @hintz (Hi Andy!) , built a 1212/6 and is somewhere out near Wahiawa. My genre is also vocal centric (3 part), with ukulele, guitar, bass, and drums (Aloha and Friends from Waimanalo)—mostly Hawaiian Reggae. My fEARful has been pretty great, though I have had amplification issues with assorted pedals as preamps for a Prolite 3.0.

Yup, I'm VERY familiar with Andrew's 1212/6. Probably because its been on my bench. . .

And my first 12/6 Koa is now in Kona.
My 12/6 cube made with 3/8" BB isn't going anywhere.

 

[popgadget]

Sounds like it would make a good alternative for smaller venues and a good addition for larger ones. GAS mode activated.

I would expect that it would be a replacement rather than an addition.....

 

[Laklandfan]

. Plenty of people have run tube heads with fEARfuls with no issues ever reported.

I myself am heavily contemplating a Tube head for my F115, I can only imagine how loud and clear it would sound.