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Finally Played One and It Was Terrifying. ;)

On another note...

I just finished my 12/6 (still needs aesthetic stuff) and paired it up with my 12sub last night at rehearsal.

Whoa, did that ever sound good. Very full and loud with my mb800.

BASSIST, would really value your thoughts: Just discovered these cabs and considering building a 12sub myself as a compact 12" for rehearsals and small gigs. How would you say the 12 sub compares to the 12/6? I read somewhere that you thought the 12 sub wasn't good as a stand alone cab? Is that right? I'm not after anything hi-fi, i like the old school tone i get from my 30w Ashdown valve head. You think the 12 sub could be good for this or is a lot of the ff tone in the 2 or 3 way?
 
The 12sub is *definitely* not appropriate as a stand alone from my experience. I am the kind of guy who likes the tone of 8 year old flats and the tone pot rolled off completely and even with that in mind, the 12sub does not have enough mids or highs. The mid driver is essential IMO/IME.
 
Torin, you know how I feel about the fEARful stuff, and that the REAL magic happens when you have either a 2 woofer or 2 cabinet setup. The 12/6 or 15/6 are great cabs, they can go loud, they're clear and clean and wide. But when I've chosen to go with just one I find myself missing the second cab ALWAYS. Its not that a 15/6 won't be loud, it will (somewhere north of a 4x10 but south of a 8x10)...but having that sub underneath really moves me.

I've played a bunch of cabs over the years and had more than that provided as occasional backline, but the fEARfuls are the only ones where I didn't have to 'compromise' with the speakers to get what I wanted from them yet still play within what they could produce/handle.
 
So speaking roughly... a pair of 12/6 cabs could probably match the volume of a good 610 cab. Roughly. And a pair of 15/6 cabs could probably be even louder than an 810 cab. Does it stand to reason, then, that a 12/6 and a 15/6 together might be about as loud as an 810 cab? Roughly speaking?

And if you mis-matched this way, there's only one downside that I see. Because the 15/6 can handle more input, you might risk blowing something in the 12/6 when trying to get everything you can out of the 15/6. But people with ears probably won't do that, as the 12 will likely be on top and you'll hear it struggling, amirite?

The benefit that I see is, you get three distinct rigs. You get the 12/6 mini (310 equiv), the 15/6 regular (610 equiv) and the 12/6-15/6 stack of doom (810 equiv).

That's quite a range covered.
 
So speaking roughly... a pair of 12/6 cabs could probably match the volume of a good 610 cab. Roughly. And a pair of 15/6 cabs could probably be even louder than an 810 cab. Does it stand to reason, then, that a 12/6 and a 15/6 together might be about as loud as an 810 cab? Roughly speaking?

And if you mis-matched this way, there's only one downside that I see. Because the 15/6 can handle more input, you might risk blowing something in the 12/6 when trying to get everything you can out of the 15/6. But people with ears probably won't do that, as the 12 will likely be on top and you'll hear it struggling, amirite?

The benefit that I see is, you get three distinct rigs. You get the 12/6 mini (310 equiv), the 15/6 regular (610 equiv) and the 12/6-15/6 stack of doom (810 equiv).

That's quite a range covered.

The mismatch using a 12/6 and a 15/6 together is only in power handling...Provided you use a reverse baffle on the 12/6 and align the mids together when both are in use at the same time.

Yes, a 15/6 can handle more power, but really if you are pushing so much power as to blow the 12/6 (when used with a 15/6), you are already to the point of going deaf anyway, so I seriously doubt you'd push the 12/6+15/6 combo that hard.
 
True. And now I've seen at least two mismatched fF stacks, including Tom Bowlus' one on greenboy's site and one in this thread

http://www.talkbass.com/forum/f15/help-required-chosing-fearful-design-927042/index5.html

I guess the reason I'm nit-picking is because I'm in love with the power of the 15/6 and also in love with the size/weight of the 12/6. If you use a 12/6 cube atop a 15/6, you get a little bit of both. And clearly some others think this is a valid stack choice.
 
True. And now I've seen at least two mismatched fF stacks, including Tom Bowlus' one on greenboy's site and one in this thread

http://www.talkbass.com/forum/f15/help-required-chosing-fearful-design-927042/index5.html

I guess the reason I'm nit-picking is because I'm in love with the power of the 15/6 and also in love with the size/weight of the 12/6. If you use a 12/6 cube atop a 15/6, you get a little bit of both. And clearly some others think this is a valid stack choice.

I think its a completely valid choice. And I know Greenboy himself has highlighted it as the most 'modular' of rigs, from one 12/6 for smaller gigs to the 15/6 for slightly bigger then both when you need more muscle. I happen to like the 15/6-15sub because its a really BIG presence on stage and in the room and I don't find moving it to be a problem. The 15sub is surprisingly light too.
 
True. And now I've seen at least two mismatched fF stacks, including Tom Bowlus' one on greenboy's site and one in this thread

http://www.talkbass.com/forum/f15/help-required-chosing-fearful-design-927042/index5.html

I guess the reason I'm nit-picking is because I'm in love with the power of the 15/6 and also in love with the size/weight of the 12/6. If you use a 12/6 cube atop a 15/6, you get a little bit of both. And clearly some others think this is a valid stack choice.

I'm on the fence about an additional fEARful choice as well (to go with my 15/6). I either want to build a 1515/6 (I don't need more mids/highs than that), or a 15Sub, or a 12/6 Cube.

The reason being is that I play in four different bands, all with different tone/volume requirements. I can see how the 12/6 would be awesome for one or two bands I'm in.

I can't leave my rig at any one band's rehearsal space and even though the 15/6 isn't all that heavy (mine's 47 lbs.) bringing a 12/6 all over for rehearsals and some gigs would be even nicer. Bringing both a 12/6 and 15/6 to other high volume gigs would be brutally cool and still allow me some choices for the many different projects.

Decisions...
 
I have an LDS 15/6 I love, so I ordered a 12/6 with the baffle reversed to stack........in the end I sold the 12/6 because it wasn't much smaller or lighter than the 15/6 and the stack was complete, thorough, redundant and superfluous overkill:D:bassist::bassist::bassist: since the 15/6 easily fills a medium sized bar (in a too loud rock context) without PA, without even being pushed........


....which may be exactly what some folks want:p


As far as some feeling that >1 driver leads to more bass bliss.....well I guess that's almost always the case.







True. And now I've seen at least two mismatched fF stacks, including Tom Bowlus' one on greenboy's site and one in this thread

http://www.talkbass.com/forum/f15/help-required-chosing-fearful-design-927042/index5.html

I guess the reason I'm nit-picking is because I'm in love with the power of the 15/6 and also in love with the size/weight of the 12/6. If you use a 12/6 cube atop a 15/6, you get a little bit of both. And clearly some others think this is a valid stack choice.
 
So speaking roughly... a pair of 12/6 cabs could probably match the volume of a good 610 cab. Roughly. And a pair of 15/6 cabs could probably be even louder than an 810 cab. Does it stand to reason, then, that a 12/6 and a 15/6 together might be about as loud as an 810 cab? Roughly speaking?

I quote myself ^

Upon reflection, I think my logic is sketchy here. The mismatched stack would have a bit less output than I am imagining above, since the 15/6 wouldn't be able to reach its full output potential. You could only turn the volume knob as far as the 12/6 could stand, thereby limiting the 15/6 somewhat.

But still, it would be louder than a straight pair of 12/6 right? I think it would.

Wouldn't it?
 
yes, much


I quote myself ^

Upon reflection, I think my logic is sketchy here. The mismatched stack would have a bit less output than I am imagining above, since the 15/6 wouldn't be able to reach its full output potential. You could only turn the volume knob as far as the 12/6 could stand, thereby limiting the 15/6 somewhat.

But still, it would be louder than a straight pair of 12/6 right? I think it would.

Wouldn't it?
 
The 12/6 cube paired with the 15/6/1 does an awesome job. I built a 15/6/1 to start, followed by a 12/6 cube, and another 15/6/1. What can I say? These things are a fun project, and you end up with super high end performance.

I contemplated a 15 sub, and decided to go ahead with the full 15/6/1 for a couple reasons. First, the sub alone is not a viable cab. I actually went as far as testing the 3015LF with the low pass filter in a TL-606 cab. I really liked what it did with the 15/6/1, but by itself, the sub was not going to act as a "spare cab" something you might play through by itself. There is nothing going on in the mid range. If you go with a sub you will always carry two cabs. Or you might not feel like dragging two cabs out to play and the sub will sit home.

Now, for slightly more dough than a dedicated sub, you could build a 12/6 cube with the much less expensive Alpha mid, and the simple crossover. Mine quickly became my favorite cab. It covers just about any room we play with or without PA support for the bass. It fits in the trunk of the corolla, I can carry it a fair distance with one hand, and it just plain kicks butt.

I did the reverse baffle so it matches up with the 15/6/1. Paired up this lets my GK 1001 run at four ohms, and I have the high circuit running the horn. The rig stands 5' high. I ask the sound guy to leave me out, because my rig will sound better without the PA mudding the water.

The pair of 15/6/1's have yet to go out together, that's just plain overkill, and to much to carry. I'd say 90% of the time I take the just 12/6 and call it good.

The 15/6/1 are great cabs, but the practical logistics of moving stuff up and down stairs, in and out of the car and clubs, and the volume required at most of the gigs I do, makes the 12/6 my most used cab. If I was to go at it again, I'd build a pair of 12/6 cubes, with the alpha mids. Get a good deal on the 3012LF's and the alpha mids, you might get project done for about the cost of one 15/6/1.
 
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Wait, we need a picture!

Here we have the 12/6 cube and 15/6/1 with the Carvin HD 1500 running one per side: 300 watts at 8 ohm each. Input from my little Yamaha mixer, bass through the MXR M-80 bass di +, Roland drum machine. This gets stupid loud. Small animals flee for their lives.

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Next up, the pair of 15/6/1. You gotta ask your self, "Do I really want to carry that up the stairs?"

The Carvin can run the pair bridged at 4 ohms for 1500 watts. I just don't see needing it unless I get the call to sub for an AC/DC tribute band.

I'm using the 15/6/1's more like PA cabs at the moment.

I can't say enough good things about the 12/6. It has earned the title: biggest bang for the buck, best cab build yet!
 
I'm on the fence about an additional fEARful choice as well (to go with my 15/6). I either want to build a 1515/6 (I don't need more mids/highs than that), or a 15Sub, or a 12/6 Cube.

The reason being is that I play in four different bands, all with different tone/volume requirements. I can see how the 12/6 would be awesome for one or two bands I'm in.

I can't leave my rig at any one band's rehearsal space and even though the 15/6 isn't all that heavy (mine's 47 lbs.) bringing a 12/6 all over for rehearsals and some gigs would be even nicer. Bringing both a 12/6 and 15/6 to other high volume gigs would be brutally cool and still allow me some choices for the many different projects.

Decisions...
I use a 1515/66 for Reggae and I tell you that it's a great cabinet. It's about 102 pounds and easy to move because it's about 4 feet tall and I can tip it into the vehicle.
 
Maybe I should just get a pair of 12/6 (when I have some money again, who knows). But when I get new cabs they're bloody well going to be the last ones I ever buy, the end. I'd hate to get a pair of 12/6 and one day wish I had a little bit more...

That's why I built a fEARful. I had been designing my own cabs for years when I had talks with Greenboy about his designs. Aside from wanting another fEARful I have no GAS for any other cab.
 
Maybe I should just get a pair of 12/6 (when I have some money again, who knows). But when I get new cabs they're bloody well going to be the last ones I ever buy, the end. I'd hate to get a pair of 12/6 and one day wish I had a little bit more...

We sold a 12/6cube to a great DC area bassist named Jason Mattis about 6 months ago. He was certain he'd have to save up and buy a 12sub or an additional cube ASAP, but one was all he wanted to afford at that moment. So far he still hasn't ordered a sub. He said it would be nice, but not really 'needed' so much as 'wanted.' He did outdoor fests all summer with a loud drummer, super loud blues rock guitarist, B3 player. Using an Mesa M9 he's never been at a loss to hear himself yet. It's so hard to convince people how much they can get out of that one amazing cab, because of it's size...heck, I wouldn't have believed it either.

The 12/6 or 12/6cube is the best sound per pound cab out there, IMO...I prefer them with the Alphalites, personally, which makes them even more affordable, too!