G&L Club Part 7

[nabilhuakbar]

Man, I wish there was a whole Cookbook of Tone Recipes, for all kinds of basses and amps! Somebody should start a thread...

Honestly...could you imagine? That could be a seriously ass-kicking sticky thread.

 

[richwag]

I've posted this before; years ago did extensive testing on RF shielding materials.
Copper tape is MUCH better than even the most expensive shielding coatings.
We could get an easy 100 dB of attenuation from the low mHz range to 10 gHz.
Even the paint with silver (well over $100 a pint even in 1990's dollars) was not nearly as good.
Expectations of the inexpensive coatings sold by guitar shops should no be that high IMO.
The paint is so much quicker to apply though.
Also, copper tape with conductive adhesive is not really necessary so long as you use an overlap condition and burnish the joint with a Popsicle stick.

Great info. This is the second G&L I've added copper shielding too and it's really pretty easy. I have the sticky tape and it probably took me less than an hour from start to finish. Precision isn't important. Just cover it all and the back plate and boom. It does look super cool too. A bit like the old lunar landers.

I didn't do the pickup cavities like I did with my MJ-4 because I don't have any RF noise on the M2500.

 

[nabilhuakbar]

I just wanna share something -- I'm kinda floored this worked as well as it did.

I think I've gotten really close to Justin Chancellor Wal Tone. Not perfect, but pretty damn decent if I do say so myself.

Left audio channel is my bass track -- forgive my "meh"-tier playing, I just wanted to lay this down in one go as a proof of concept.



Bass is set up as follows:
Both Pickups
Series Mode
Treble Boost
Bass Knob ~50%
Treble Knob ~90%

Then my effects chain is
Noise Gate >
Compressor (Behringer CS400, clone of a Boss CS-3)> Level at 1 o'clock, Tone at 2:30, Attack at 2:30, Sustain at 1 >
Behringer BDI21 (clone of a Sansamp) > Drive at 1 o'clock, Treble at 4 o'clock, Bass at 1o'clock, Level at 2 o'clock, Presence at noon, Blend at 2:30
>
Boss GT-1B
Tool Time custom patch
Uses a high-band OD
Mid scooping GEQ (could probably add a bit more here now that I've got my Sansamp clone)
Gallen-Kruger clone preamp with Gain at 11 o'clock, 8x10 speaker simulator, and bass/mids/treb all at 1-2 o'clock

 

[jfh2424]

The LB-100 sounds awesome with overdrive

Great work as always, Iv@n! Informative, clear, insightful and practical.

Are you keeping any of these G&Ls?

 

[IvanBassist]

Great work as always, Iv@n! Informative, clear, insightful and practical.

Are you keeping any of these G&Ls?

I just placed an order for a Matador
Hmm, i'm not sure if G&L Germany is gonna let me keep the LB and JB after the Matador arrives, but I'd definitely like to keep them

 

[richwag]

I just placed an order for a Matador
Hmm, i'm not sure if G&L Germany is gonna let me keep the LB and JB after the Matador arrives, but I'd definitely like to keep them

What an awesome bass. I didn't know at first that they were using the MFDs. I thought it was the alnico pickups in the LB100. Those split MFDs in the bridge position must be killer. Enjoy!

 

[Blues Bass 2]

A couple days ago shielding for G&Ls was being discussed . I bought a JB a few weeks ago and had run a ground wire to the bridge pickup route and screwed it to the conductive paint there . I put a strip of copper tape between the control plate and pickguard into the cavity and screwed the ground wire to to copper tape . I figured I should be good but then read this '

With G&L, even if you think the cavity is shielded with conductive paint, it's usually only one coat—not nearly enough to really produce the Faraday cage effect. When I've seen this and taken an ohmmeter to it, there was a ridiculously high resistance between any two points on the coated surface or between the coating and say a pot ground. With that stuff, it takes a minimum of three good coats to get high enough conductance to effectively shield a cavity—and as we know, G&L's shielding motivation could use some upgrading.

I hadn't tested the grounds or the paint but when I did I couldn't get any conductivity at all to the paint with my meter . I was good from the bridge and strings to the control plate . I had some copper tape , enough to do the bridge pickup so I did that today , worked great . I ordered some copper tape for the control cavity and the neck pickup cavity and it will get here in a few days . Already did the pickguard too . I didn't expect this from a bass as great as this JB but I've done shielding a lot and like projects . I'm glad I read what you guys were saying and checked , thank you ! I really can't get over how great this bass plays and sounds .

 

[jmlee]

A couple days ago shielding for G&Ls was being discussed . I bought a JB a few weeks ago and had run a ground wire to the bridge pickup route and screwed it to the conductive paint there . I put a strip of copper tape between the control plate and pickguard into the cavity and screwed the ground wire to to copper tape . I figured I should be good but then read this '

I hadn't tested the grounds or the paint but when I did I couldn't get any conductivity at all to the paint with my meter . I was good from the bridge and strings to the control plate . I had some copper tape , enough to do the bridge pickup so I did that today , worked great . I ordered some copper tape for the control cavity and the neck pickup cavity and it will get here in a few days . Already did the pickguard too . I didn't expect this from a bass as great as this JB but I've done shielding a lot and like projects . I'm glad I read what you guys were saying and checked , thank you ! I really can't get over how great this bass plays and sounds .

Glad to be of help—I think we all hope that the discussions on TB will save us time, money, and frustration while increasing our general bass joy. Without belaboring this particular issue, I think we've just got to accept that any new G&L we purchase needs to be opened up and shielded because—gosh darnit—the company has absolutely no interest in participating in the work.

 

[IvanBassist]

What an awesome bass. I didn't know at first that they were using the MFDs. I thought it was the alnico pickups in the LB100. Those split MFDs in the bridge position must be killer. Enjoy!

Hmm I'm not sure what the "standard"'pickups for the Matador are, but I requested the Alnico version. I really like how the LB-100 sounds and i wanted more of that

These are my specs:
Swamp ash natural frost top
Maple clear satin neck
Maple fingerboard
1.5" nut
SS frets
Black pickguard

 

[bdgotoh]

Hmm I'm not sure what the "standard"'pickups for the Matador are, but I requested the Alnico version. I really like how the LB-100 sounds and i wanted more of that

These are my specs:
Swamp ash natural frost top
Maple clear satin neck
Maple fingerboard
1.5" nut
SS frets
Black pickguard

I think you'll love that Matador! I have an ash/maple Matador with the alnico LB-100 pickups and I love the tone.

 

[IvanBassist]

I think you'll love that Matador! I have an ash/maple Matador with the alnico LB-100 pickups and I love the tone.

Awesome! Do you have pictures?

 

[Beersurgeon]

An update on my L2500. After replacing the pre-amp and the treble pot, my bass is back! She played like dream and with a professional setup to boot! I will now take all my basses in for a professional setup because they do it much better than I can.

Thanks for all the help on getting this problem fixed!

 

[RocketMusic]

A couple days ago shielding for G&Ls was being discussed . I bought a JB a few weeks ago and had run a ground wire to the bridge pickup route and screwed it to the conductive paint there . I put a strip of copper tape between the control plate and pickguard into the cavity and screwed the ground wire to to copper tape . I figured I should be good but then read this '



I hadn't tested the grounds or the paint but when I did I couldn't get any conductivity at all to the paint with my meter . I was good from the bridge and strings to the control plate . I had some copper tape , enough to do the bridge pickup so I did that today , worked great . I ordered some copper tape for the control cavity and the neck pickup cavity and it will get here in a few days . Already did the pickguard too . I didn't expect this from a bass as great as this JB but I've done shielding a lot and like projects . I'm glad I read what you guys were saying and checked , thank you ! I really can't get over how great this bass plays and sounds .

Don't quote me on this, but I'm pretty sure the conductive paints aren't very conductive on the surface once the paint dries. If you want to run a ground wire from the paint, you need to put the wire into the paint while it's still wet... which is hard to do after the fact.

I recall Mike Lull used to put a small bare metal plate in the paint while it was still wet, and there was a screw into that plate that would allow you to connect a ground wire anytime after the paint had dried.

 

[jmlee]

Don't quote me on this, but I'm pretty sure the conductive paints aren't very conductive on the surface once the paint dries. If you want to run a ground wire from the paint, you need to put the wire into the paint while it's still wet... which is hard to do after the fact.

I recall Mike Lull used to put a small bare metal plate in the paint while it was still wet, and there was a screw into that plate that would allow you to connect a ground wire anytime after the paint had dried.

While not quoting Greg, it would be *very* surprising if the surface of electrically conductive paint were non-conducting. It's simply a (colloidal) suspension of conductive particles in some solvent which then forms a continuous, conducting sheet as it dries. The conductivity will depend on that of the individual particles and the degree of connectivity between them. Such paints are used to create touch sensors etc., so have to be surface-conducting. We also use them in the lab to drain surface static charge to ground. On a more practical level, I've measured surface conductivity while applying sequential coats of the carbon variety and, as expected, conductivity goes up (resistance goes down) with increasing coating thickness, consistent with greater amounts of conducting particles per sq cm of coated area.

[Invalid or Expired Link Removed]

 

[TinIndian]

Don't quote me on this, but I'm pretty sure the conductive paints aren't very conductive on the surface once the paint dries. If you want to run a ground wire from the paint, you need to put the wire into the paint while it's still wet... which is hard to do after the fact.

I recall Mike Lull used to put a small bare metal plate in the paint while it was still wet, and there was a screw into that plate that would allow you to connect a ground wire anytime after the paint had dried.

When I've used it before I used a External Tooth Lock Washer underneath the lug and screw to make sure it bit into the conductive paint. Works very well.

 

[jmlee]

I recall Mike Lull used to put a small bare metal plate in the paint while it was still wet, and there was a screw into that plate that would allow you to connect a ground wire anytime after the paint had dried.

The advantage of this approach is that there's a large surface area of contact between the paint and the plate, and then it's metal-to-metal contact between the plate and the screw. But make no mistake—the contact between the paint and the plate is still surface-to-surface.

 

[bdgotoh]

Awesome! Do you have pictures?

Roasted maple neck and fingerboard, swamp ash body, alnico pickups

 

[IvanBassist]

Roasted maple neck and fingerboard, swamp ash body, alnico pickups

View attachment 3953252

Stunning!!

 

[RocketMusic]

While not quoting Greg, it would be *very* surprising if the surface of electrically conductive paint were non-conducting. It's simply a (colloidal) suspension of conductive particles in some solvent which then forms a continuous, conducting sheet as it dries. The conductivity will depend on that of the individual particles and the degree of connectivity between them. Such paints are used to create touch sensors etc., so have to be surface-conducting. We also use them in the lab to drain surface static charge to ground. On a more practical level, I've measured surface conductivity while applying sequential coats of the carbon variety and, as expected, conductivity goes up (resistance goes down) with increasing coating thickness, consistent with greater amounts of conducting particles per sq cm of coated area.

[Invalid or Expired Link Removed]

Hahaha. Thanks for not quoting me! LOL

And thanks for correcting me, more importantly. I swear I tried to run a conductivity test between dried paint in a cavity and anything else with no conductivity resulting... but that was years ago, and my memory is cloudy at best.

 

[jmlee]

Hahaha. Thanks for not quoting me! LOL

And thanks for correcting me, more importantly. I swear I tried to run a conductivity test between dried paint in a cavity and anything else with no conductivity resulting... but that was years ago, and my memory is cloudy at best.

We never had this conversation...when I was using that paint (and attempting to poison myself like a Russian opposition leader), I routinely measured resistance point-to-point on the paint surface and paint-to-pot ground. As I recall, the resistance would get down to maybe a hundred ohms: so, not bad but no better, even after 3 coats. That was with StewMac's black carbon/graphite-based paint.