Gear Bias

[Heiwa]

I would agree if they sounded like crap playing on "junk" but if they sound good, does a more expensive bass "help you better do your job"? I don't think so. It just makes you "look the part."

Looks like he thinks we can buy a Foderowsky, WalZon or a Laklingwall and BAM! We are pros in ten seconds

 

[deff]

Not true. A pro musician makes the best out of anything.

eh, within limits. they will still sound better on an objectively better sounding bass.

 

[BaltBass5]

Not true. A pro musician makes the best out of anything.

A True Pro doesn't show up to a gig with junk.

 

[shadven]

I have a JMJ Mustang and I love how it sounds and play. I brought it to my last gig with a blues band and got a lot of compliments on the bass tone. So it all comes down to how you play and use the bass.

Yeah, they sound great and thumps as good as a P-bass (almost).

 

[BaltBass5]

Looks like he thinks we can buy a Foderowsky, WalZon or a Laklingwall and BAM! We are pros in ten seconds

You really are ignorant. You haven't read and/or understood ANYTHING I've said in this thread and you keep on making ignorant one liner assumptions.
Not that you'll read this or actually pay attention, but what I said was that if you're already a great player....a higher end bass is going to make you sound and play that much better.

 

[Heiwa]

You really are ignorant. You haven't read and/or understood ANYTHING I've said in this thread and you keep on making ignorant one liner assumptions.
Not that you'll read this or actually pay attention, but what I said was that if you're already a great player....a higher end bass is going to make you sound and play that much better.

All this time you were saying you would not see us as serious musicians if we had a low/mid tier bass onstage, even if it was at bar. So in the end you are like those school kids who have a “phone bias”, who think you have to own the latest iPhone or you are a loser.

Grow up

 

[BaltBass5]

All this time you were saying you would not see us as serious musicians if we had a low/mid tier bass onstage, even if it was at bar. So in the end you are like those school kids who have a “phone bias”, who think you have to own the latest iPhone or you are a loser.

Grow up

AGAIN...I'll state....in my OP I said that when I walked in I saw gear and expected nothing great and was pleasantly surprised. So once again your entire list of one line comments are ignorant and you haven't read or understood a single thing I have said. AND...once again you come back with some ignorant one line response. SO for that reason....I'm done with your nonsense.

Oh and I find it funny that YOU yourself have a thread about buying better equipment:

https://www.talkbass.com/threads/upgrade-to-prs-kestrel-or-yamaha-bb424.1565297/

 

[micguy]

They don't need to show us anything....however, 95% of professional musicians are using relatively expensive gear.

This can be twisted to mean just about anything. I used to play a small "coffee house" vibe gig, where the other musicians included a guy playing a Martin guitar (is that "relatively inexpensive?" - it is in this context), a woman who played a harp (not a harmonica, the 7 foot tall variety) and a pianist on a nice Yamaha grand. Sometimes we had a cellist.

In that context, when compared with the harp or the piano, even the most expensive Fodera bass guitar is "relatively inexpensive". The bass I was playing? Not cheap as bass guitars go, but in this context, pretty cheap.

Compared with classical instruments, bass guitars are "cheap" - all of them. Some are just cheap, some are insanely cheap

 

[Heiwa]

AGAIN...I'll state....in my OP I said that when I walked in I saw gear and expected nothing great and was pleasantly surprised. So once again your entire list of one line comments are ignorant and you haven't read or understood a single thing I have said. AND...once again you come back with some ignorant one line response. SO for that reason....I'm done with your nonsense.

Oh and I find it funny that YOU yourself have a thread about buying better equipment:

https://www.talkbass.com/threads/upgrade-to-prs-kestrel-or-yamaha-bb424.1565297/

Yawn, so you are childish, you have free time and misconceptions.. Nice

BTW, I’m as good with my 150 u$d Cort or my 1000 u$d custom made PJ.

 

[IAMPK]

In my experience, part of the cost of a better bass is due to selection or customization of elements that better match the needs of a given player.

I don't play expensive basses, but I have customized a few of the basses I already own to make them more comfortable to play for extended perods of time, to make adjustments for playability faster or easier to achieve, to replace tuning machines so the instrument stays in tune better during gigs, to replace one kind of fret with another, to enhance an instrument's balance or reduce its weight, to modify the sound, to replace the controls, or to improve the looks. If I weren't capable of doing the work myself, I would likely have chosen between a different instrument that already had the attibutes I was looking for, or having a luthier do the customization. I wouldn't have bothered if the instrument didn't sound acceptable to begin with. None of this has much to do with trying to "look the part."

I read posts on TB all the time about folks buying an affordable instrument and making some of the changes I mentioned, above, all of the time. Somehow, the pro players I've known, who are on the road at least half the year, seldom have the time, energy, or requisite skills to make these kinds of changes themselves. Some have had the luxury of having some of the easier changes performed by a "guitar tech" who travels with the band. But most have done so by selecting instruments that already have the features they are looking for, which typically cost more. The touring pros I've known spend more time strapped to their instruments than the bassists on TB. They typically want their instrument to give them what they want, consistently, gig after gig; touring and recording already gives them abundant challenges without having to worry about their instruments.

I can agree with this to an extent. Customization is sometimes required depending on what you're trying to accomplish. But does the more expensive bass with the features you want make you sound better than the cheap bass you customized?

Maybe the more expensive bass can get lower action without buzz compared to a cheap piece of crap. But on the other hand, some bassists don't need too much customization. As long as it meets a baseline of usability and tone production, they can do great things with the instrument regardless of the price.

For example, Joe Dart was known to play a cheap Mexican Fender or a Squier on a lot of early Vulfpeck stuff. Did he become better when he started playing his signature basses from EBMM instead? I'd say no. In my opinion, no upgrade in equipment would have made his solos in "Beastly" better than it sounds on that cheap Squier P. Yes, it may have been customized, but it's still cheap. I think he would've sounded just as good whether it was that Squier or a custom shop Fender.

 

[IAMPK]

Respectfully disagree. If you sound great on a junk bass you're prob going to sound even better on a nicer bass.
Better electronics will give even better tone. A more comfortable neck will help you play faster and fret easier. Better hardware will help the intonation and more stable tuning.

I'd agree to an extent, but per my last point regarding Joe Dart, that Beastly track would not have sounded any better on a custom shop Fender than it did on that Squier. In my opinion.

 

[DavidEdenAria]

I'd agree to an extent, but per my last point regarding Joe Dart, that Beastly track would not have sounded any better on a custom shop Fender than it did on that Squier. In my opinion.

All Squiers are not equal....Japan stuff is excellent in build quality.

Take something like a simple P bass, as long as the neck is setup well, its stays in tune and has a decent set of electronics thats all that is necessary to play your local dive bar.

Its when you start into complex electronics that things get dicey where cost adds up quick for quality...jmho...but the neck is where it starts

 

[BassyBill]

Sometimes, I think I care way too much about gear. Then I just read TB for a few minutes and realise that I don’t really have such a serious problem with that after all.

 

[deff]

Yawn, so you are childish, you have free time and misconceptions.. Nice

BTW, I’m as good with my 150 u$d Cort or my 1000 u$d custom made PJ.

You are, maybe. But what you are stating completely ignore that what a bass player does for their craft is exclusively just playing. That simply isn't true. Most players go through more than a few combinations of basses and amps and pedals to hone their sound. Some of this is irrespective of how much something costs and the brand name. Look at how many great players now play on old Japanese guitars that people 20 years ago would never even look twice at.

Plus your argument says that there is no room for improvement with a bass that plays really nice. I have a few basses that play better IMO and I'd rather play them. This isn't to say that a nice playing bass has to be expensive, but it doesn't hurt. This is irrespective of brand. Sure there are some Schecters out there like some of the Stilettos with rolled fingerboards and incredible finishes that punch well above their weight and play incredibly well. There is value out there. But there is such a thing as even pros wanting to play better or easier on a comfortable bass.

 

[Snert]

I preferred to 'storm proof' my gear, and if I still gigged today, I'd be happy as a clam to go out with my Squiers after I replaced the pots and wiring with CTS and Switchcraft, checked the shielding, and made sure the good-enough keys and bridge were tight and lightly lubricated: None of the costs a lot. Squier, like any quote/unquote 'cheap' bass, makes sure they look good and skimp on the internals, every company does this, but as I said, a handful of good pots, a jack, and a thorough installation is cheap insurance. A few drops of CLP in the bridge screws, a little white grease in the keys, I'm ready for Hurricane Season.

Ditto. If I was going to drive any car cross country, I'd so a whole bunch of preventative checks and maintenance first too.

I'd like to say that I'm not gear biased but I have to admit so, and I believe most guys do as well. We tend to infer certain things about the player according to what gear he brings or uses. But not all are bad.
As for myself, I love gear so if I go to see live music and some guy has some higher end gear that he's playing with, I tend to be more excited compared to if he brought cheaper gear. But that's because that gear that is less common or less available and more rare to see, compared to other cheaper models.

Agreed, and I've had some fun chats and tried other instruments I hadn't seen/played by talking with the band post gig.

A True Pro doesn't show up to a gig with junk.

Define junk. Is an SX or a Glarry that you haven't just pulled out of the box and run to the gig with, but have set up, put new strings on and given a general once over to make sure it's all OK, junk? If it's something simple like a passive 1/2 PU instrument and doesn't go out of tune or break, in most cases, how is a boutique FSO (for example) going to be any better at getting butts out of seats and dancing that a Glarry isn't?
If you'd worked with me before, no matter what I showed up with, you'd assume it was OK because I have a pro attitude to how I approach a gig and would not use an instrument held together by spit and string.

 

[chris_b]

. . . . 1. Do you advertently or inadvertently have a gear bias? 2. What is it based upon? 3. Who are some other pro-level artists that routinely use "entry" to "mid-level" gear?

I'll always take a "professional" interest in the gear other players are using, but I only ever judge a player on his bass lines.

 

[Egg250]

I'm going to go on a limb here (Well not really, because I already know the stats) and tell you that if you just start listing touring ROCK bassists that are in some of the biggest bands in the world right now (Robert Trujillo, Nate Mendel, Adam Clayton, Jeff Ament, Flea, Mark Hoppus, Mike Dirnt, Duff McKagan) not a single one of them is walking onto a stage with a bass that costs less than $1500....about half of those listed are more like $3K. When you add in multiple basses, amps and effects, wireless etc...well you get the point. The guitarists are even worse.

I'm not saying that you can't or shouldn't play gear that makes you happy (Even if it's cheaper) what I am saying is that most players that can pick from their choice of gear are not walking onto the stage with a $300 bass and a $300 amp.

Since my original post in which I asked people to list A-List professionals (who have the choice of ANY gear) to name some folks that are choosing to stick with "lower end" gear. I named one in the original post. You listed one in your response but, in 8 pages of this thread there were only about 3-4 other names thrown out.

Currently recovering from the covid, so I did a little bit of research, about 5 minutes worth. I found an article from 2020 listing 6 touring bassists using instruments under $1000, some around $500.

Fat Mike - NOFX (Danelectro - DC Cooper)
Brandon Schwartzel - FIDLAR (Fender Mustang PJ)
Benji Blakeway - Catfish and the Bottlemen (Epiphone Thunderbird)
Jamie Mathis - Bullet for my Valentine (Sterling StingRay)
Payam Doostzadeh - The Young Giant (G&L JB2)
Robert Levon Been - Black Rebel Motorcycle Club (Epiphone Jack Cassidy & Rivoli (90's re-release))

Now, this article is 3 years old and prices may have changed somewhat. If someone took the time to go through all the big name and little name touring acts, I'm sure one could find lots of professional musicians (and bassists) that use mid level gear.

While I do have that Geddy Lee Signature, but really enjoy my LTD B4E, I am gassing over the Ibanez SR2600. As soon as I can quit raiding my bass fund for other band purchases, I shall have it. So, you are correct in that most musicians would prefer pro gear but I will be sorely disappointed if that SR2600 doesn't live up to my LTD.

 

[BaltBass5]

Yawn, so you are childish, you have free time and misconceptions.. Nice

BTW, I’m as good with my 150 u$d Cort or my 1000 u$d custom made PJ.

Good For You...I'm sure your stellar personality and wit shines through as well.

 

[pepj]

Whilst I expect very good builders with a very good rep to dramatically reduce the amount of poor basses they might release into the wild, I don't take it for granted until I get to play it.
The vast majority of basses I've recently tried were not fab straight out the box and there was quite a variance of the definition of 'fab'

But inherrent quality is more apparent..and should be a given, if you select the maker well.
They might have a bad day..and that really really shouldn't get past QC, but if you only spot check a certain number out of a 100, then the risk is higher?

 

[Sharko]

They don't need to show us anything....however, 95% of professional musicians are using relatively expensive gear. Why do you think that is is you don't think it is required?

Asking someone to explain a statistic that you just made up is a fruitless exercise