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Genz Benz Shuttle 9.0 discussion thread
- Thread starter Kelly Lee
- Start date
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That MB500 voicing is way to the right of the Shuttle (in context to the RH450 being way to the left). The MB500 has a HUGE low end extension (they must have the hi pass set at 30hz or something... very deep bass) and the upper treble is cutting like a knife... a LOT going on above 8K... SUPER sizzly and modern. It's the only head I've played that makes my F1/F500 sound 'warm and dark'!
Way too over the top for me, and I've played two recent ones that hissed like snakes (partially due to that upper treble peak built into the voicing IMO). Loud as heck though, and they have a 'super goosed' tone.... super deep, super sizzly, with that classic GK aggressive grind in the upper mids.
Build quality is less than impressive IMO... not in the same league as Genz, Markbass, etc. (although to be fair, it is significantly less expensive than those other heads also.
Gotcha, thanks for sharing the info.It's fine volume wise, just not as loud as I expected based on the stated specs of the amp. I'm far from alone in this sentiment, I'm just one of the few that's willing to say it in open forum. I've caught quite a bit of backlash for it as a result. For example, if you notice I have a hard time getting any support here now from GB or other supporters of the product. As a result I try to keep my comments focused on the positive aspects of the GB equipment so I can avoid that and continual comments like...It's funny hearing this from you considering some of our PM conversations, but yeah, I've been through all that ad nauseum. People who I've never met or heard me play implying I don't know how to play, don't now how to turn knobs, something is wrong with my equipment or ears, etc. That's fine. I've been around the Internet long enough to understand how the mob mentality works when it comes to people touting their favorite gear. Like I have mentioned plenty of times, I really enjoy the amp and the good GB customer (phone) service. The Shuttle 9.0 works well on the different gigs I use it on and sounds great for my recording needs. It's a very slick product and I'm glad I bought it. My suggestion to others, just make sure you don't say anything negative about it on TalkBass
I reread my post, and it did come off a little snarky. That was not my intention. I too find the 900 watt power rating rather 'ambitious' on this amp (just like the 600 watt rating on the Shuttle 6), but am still confused with your output/volume experience compared to the little Trace350 (which I gigged for years back in the day). Something must be going on with the interaction of the rather unusual gain structure of the 9 combined with the signal you are sending it (which was really what I was trying to say)
It seems funny how clear your left and right discriptions are to me. Where would you put SWR?
If you are talking classic SWR (SM400, etc.), then pretty darn close to the GK as far as deep low end extension and sparkly, sizzly top end. However, the SWR tone has a bit of creaminess to it versus the aggressive upper mid grind of the GK... the upper mids are what sets the GK MB500 apart from the SWR to me. The 'x' models (750x, etc.) are a bit more mid present and grindy... I believe SWR considers those their 'rock heads'... so those are kind of in-between the GK MB500 voicing and the Genz to me. Of course, the 750x is three rack spaces and weighs a ton, and the Genz Shuttle 9 and the GK MB500 will both bury that dog
All of the above... plus.
What I was referring to is; the relationship between those 2 controls has a plethora of tones in them altering the voicing. Subtle ratio changes made can take you from clean and bright to warm and smooth. I really haven't played an amp that had a front end exactly like this before. One more thing, get rid of your old notions about the use of the O/L light.
Are you saying get comfortable with it O/L on?
When it flashes does it sound compressed, limited, fatter, less dynamics...?
Dr Funk
"If you ain't appearing then you be disappearing"
No. I'm just saying that when the OL light is on you are pumping that tube is all. Unlike the Markbass amps where the clip light is not a good thing.
+1 That Genz clip light design is strange. It should basically be ignored. The MB input clip light (and most other input clip light designs) is just that... when it lights up, it means you are in the clip zone and should turn down the input gain (standard execution with a solid state preamp). The Genz clip light... not sure what it is. Strange concept to have a clip light associated with a tube pre anyway, since there is not hard 'danger zone' with a tube pre, which just gains complexity when pushed (versus the nasty gank and compression of a solid state pre being pushed). There is no 'optimum' setting (regarding signal to noise relative to distortion) with a tube pre.. that's the whole point of a tube pre... infinite gain possibility, with every level being 'appropriate' depending on tone goals.
Combine that input clip light on the Shuttle that really isn't a 'clip light' with the power amp clip light, that also doesn't indicate that any action should be taken (i.e., it isn't a power amp clip indicator, but an indicator that the 'tube emulation limiting is kicking in), and you have... well... customer confusion! Zillions of posts on this.
+1 totally ignore those lights on the Genz heads and use your ears.
Oh, sorry guys, I thought we were talking about the Amp LIMIT light. Dough! I understand the O/L I just haven't looked at this heads face in a while. I remember the LIMIT light making me worry a bit, good to know what it means now.
Thanks.
Thanks.
Maybe GB should rename them "Let's get this party started!" indicators....
Sold!
EDIT: well I already got sold this morning when I purchased the head, but a let's get this party started! indicator would have sealed the deal if I had been unsure.
hasbeen
Commercial User
- Sep 23, 2004
- 4,806
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- Executive Vice President, The Adam Hall Group
OK .....to be fair, you're responsible for .99 zillion of the posts. I'M KIDDING.
Seriously though....I know from your posts that you don't like this "interface". Well....neither do I. ....never have. However...I was a full-on endorser of SWR in the 80's and, I worked with Trace in their prime. Both amps had the same type of "set the input until the light comes on during your hardest hits".
With this in mind...since it had been done before, I yielded to my objection. BUT....I did finally have the light changed from red...which means "danger"...to, amber.
Having said all that.....sorry by the way, I have to be honest: I'm still a little intrigued as to how many people eq and set levels by their eyes...and not ears.
I'm also intrigued by how many people set their sound for "arms length"...rather than adjusting and then stepping back six feet.
Coming full circle- Our lights were red....the shouldn't have been. They were also labled in a way to cause confusion.
I can understand this, but the MAX has indeed a lot of knobs
I was thinking that a (let's call it) contour would be more gradual, but I'm fine with the 3 preset. I play lots of gig on the weirdest sounding stages and a dual semi para eq would be the holy grail (uhm, maybe not that biblical...) for that....
M
Personally, I don't really understand the whole "too many knobs" argument. If you want simplicity, well, just because they're there doesn't mean you have to turn them - it means that the base amplifier-voiced sound can be tweaked in a number of ways if you so choose. If the amp sounds good to your ears, then it sounds good, regardless of the number of knobs.
Sometimes, the more options you have, the harder it gets.
When you have a lot of knobs, you feel obligated to turn them.
When you have a lot of knobs, you feel obligated to turn them.
This logic does not make sense to me, unless you're a spineles bass player who's easy for an inanimate object to slap around.
I have a ShuttleMAX12 and when I need the granular contol, I turn them. 90% of the time they are ignored. It's just a tool, not some evil Medusa trying to seduce my energy and attention.
IMHO and IME as one commenter says.
svtb15
Inactive
- Mar 22, 2004
- 13,004
- 4,741
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- I play it all. Whatever works for the gig. Q+
i agree.. if you dont or are weird about touching them.. leave em at top dead center...
i come from the school of where the only para eq you could use on a live bass rig was a Orban 622... thats alot of knobs!
I tell folks that if you are using one channel on your max 12 ( as most people do) then the knobs you see,,,, cut that number in half..!
once i did that folks relaxed and i showed them how to set gain ect.. its really so easy..
i had my knob twisting habit broken ( and it is a habit ) 20 years ago. i was doing a major tour that demanded a clean and no gear stage.... all the gear was under the stage coming up through grills, and my gear rack stage left.. if i needed a change i needed to let the tech know.. so that broke the habit of knob tweaking for me..
these days i could be fine with a box with one knob on it .. .VOLUME
i come from the school of where the only para eq you could use on a live bass rig was a Orban 622... thats alot of knobs!
I tell folks that if you are using one channel on your max 12 ( as most people do) then the knobs you see,,,, cut that number in half..!
once i did that folks relaxed and i showed them how to set gain ect.. its really so easy..
i had my knob twisting habit broken ( and it is a habit ) 20 years ago. i was doing a major tour that demanded a clean and no gear stage.... all the gear was under the stage coming up through grills, and my gear rack stage left.. if i needed a change i needed to let the tech know.. so that broke the habit of knob tweaking for me..
these days i could be fine with a box with one knob on it .. .VOLUME
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