GenzBenz Streamliner Pt 8...

[N. Kentucky Bass]

I started out with it in the effects loop, but found that I couldn't really hear a big difference. I use it in either spot, depending on whether I want the EQ to be pre- or post-DI.

One caveat; if you were into amp overdrive, you'd likely need to run it out front. During testing, I found that I could clip the Empress when the gain button was in and the Gain and Volume knobs were cranked.

So how does the ParaEQ help define tone that is heard directly from your amp and cab? I'm having a hard time understanding how the ParaEQ's controls are not dramatically altered by the distinctive voicing of the Streamliner as the signal goes through the amp and cab. Thanks.

 

[steve_rolfeca]

So how does the ParaEQ help define tone that is heard directly from your amp and cab? I'm having a hard time understanding how the ParaEQ's controls are not dramatically altered by the distinctive voicing of the Streamliner as the signal goes through the amp and cab. Thanks.

They are affected. But it's a two-way street- the ParaEQ is also shaping the Streamliner (unless you bypass the SL's front end, and use the Para EQ as a preamp).

Ever cranked the bass on your onboard preamp, then had the sound guy suck it back out again, up at FOH? This is no different. If the Streamliner and the Empress are boosting in a similar frequency range, the curves will add. If one is cutting and the other is boosting, the two curves will tend to cancel each other.

With the controls at noon, the SL900 shows a two unusually broad humps on a scope, with a trough between them. The curve is roughly 10dB peak-to-peak, and it's a big part of the Streamliner's "voicing". It's as though the bass and treble controls are preset to about 2 o'clock, before the amp is even turned on.

It's worth noting that the Baxandall tone controls are pretty broad, and the SL's is tuned so that cranking the bass also boosts the mid bass. In fact, unless you apply a cut at 220 with the mid control, you've ALWAYS got more mid bass than bottom end. While this is part of what makes it sound fatter than amps like the Shuttle 9.0, it can also cause trouble with midbass-heavy cabs.

Adding the ParaEQ allows you to do more subtle, precise tone shaping. For example, you can apply a narrower midbass cut that lowers the upper shoulder of the Streamliner's bass control. The amp retains its dynamic character and sounds the same from the midbass up, but it's leaner in the low end, and now the bass control works more like a Shuttle. Or you could do like I do, and apply a broader cut around 70Hz to simultaneously lean out the Streamliner, and adjust the tone of my cab.

That's just using one knob- with three bands of parametric EQ plus the Streamliner's tone controls, the possibilities are nearly endless...

 

[KJung]

So how does the ParaEQ help define tone that is heard directly from your amp and cab? I'm having a hard time understanding how the ParaEQ's controls are not dramatically altered by the distinctive voicing of the Streamliner as the signal goes through the amp and cab. Thanks.

Per the above, it is no different conceptually than having an active preamp with EQ in your bass... just additional EQ that can impact different frequencies than the controls on the amp, resulting in a bit more control. Of course, as posted above, it can get you into a bit of trouble if you aren't careful, since overlapping frequency boosts sum.

 

[N. Kentucky Bass]

Per the above, it is no different conceptually than having an active preamp with EQ in your bass... just additional EQ that can impact different frequencies than the controls on the amp, resulting in a bit more control. Of course, as posted above, it can get you into a bit of trouble if you aren't careful, since overlapping frequency boosts sum.

I'm getting the idea now, thanks. I've always used passive basses so it's new territory.

 

[KJung]

I'm getting the idea now, thanks. I've always used passive basses so it's new territory.

All these cases are a bit of 'driving a pre with another pre', which can be very nice if your rig is not quite giving you what you want. I'm pretty much playing passive at this point myself, and as we've discussed, have a couple of different 'rig voicings' to give me pretty much every tone and volume I could dream of without extra boxes, etc.

The 'double preamp' approach makes sense though if you are careful to not overdo it. For example, most of my rigs can benefit a bit from the round fatness that a slight boost of the onboard bass control on my Sadowsky.

If you want to make the Streamliner mimic a more mid present, modern amp, this would be a good way to go, just like guys using a VT pedal in front of their Markbass LMII's/III's to emulate a more grindy tube like response.

Lots of ways to get where you want to go!

 

[Joe Smithberger]

To each his own...I am finding that just using B8:00, M12:00, T9:00 as my baseline starting point leaves me the mid shaping I need. I see this as no different than a Boost only preamp onboard. There is more than enough gain available with this amp to make up the volume difference for the lower bass setting.

 

[KJung]

To each his own...I am finding that just using B8:00, M12:00, T9:00 as my baseline starting point leaves me the mid shaping I need. I see this as no different than a Boost only preamp onboard. There is more than enough gain available with this amp to make up the volume difference for the lower bass setting.

+1, but again, depending on the specific cab, and the tone goals of the player, combined with technique and the actual voicing of the bass, it is hard to generalize. I have run into cabs that I find don't work optimally with the Streamliner for me no matter what knobs I turn (actually, I never us my Streamliner with the cab Steve is having trouble with.... not an optimal matchup given the lack of low mid bump and lack of upper mid bump, which IMO the Streamliner can benefit from).

I'm with you though. With my AE410, a touch of bass cut, and a touch of mid boost, and there you go with my PBass!

Edit: Interestingly, many think that the clip I posted on my Youtube channel of the Thunderchild112/Streamliner/Alleva LM5 (with everything relatively flat) is one of the better sounding tones. At home, I agree... VERY much like playing through an old tube driven mic preamp or channel strip into a studio monitor. However, there is a reason that most guys don't gig studio monitors and channel strips live. That pure, wide, even, low distortion, extended tone gets pretty much swallowed up in many mixes. If I was playing mostly low volume small group jazz or fold things, that rig would be an option IMO.

 

[Tunaman]

9.2 Review

LOVE the 9.2 Shuttlemax... I think people are genuinely insane not to have this amp on their must have list... ESPECIALLY if you're into diversity of music. I've played in a few cover bands & sometimes put my Itunes on shuffle so I have to go from Reggae to Greenday to Gospel to Sublime to Funk. This amp can do it all with the click of a footswitch

I set the 9.2 for 2 tonal goals

FET: Grindy in your face tone for cut & punk rock
Lows cut (10 oclock), Low & high mids boosted (2 o'clock) with frequency set according cab voicing

Tube: Warm, round, big low tone
Lows boosted (2 o'clock), Low & high mids cut (10 o'clock)

Switching between the 2 channels with the settings like that makes it 2 completely different amps! Now once you know what general tone your after to match the song your playing you add the shaping in to customize it, get it a little closer... PERFECT

What other amp does that on the fly? With that EQ versatility? With the ability to tone shape as well without touching a freaking knob? Thats amp nirvana baby for those in coverbands or versatile tones needed without missing a beat.

If I was in an original band & had a certain tone in mind sure maybe you'd want an amp to fit that mold but to grab every tone in 1 box? This is it.

Light as a feather... sure its bigger than a micro but honestly are we going to complain about 5 lbs vs 7 lbs? No way, not me coming from a 80 lbs amp racked up. Mine will be racked in a shallow Gator case with a tuner & a wireless when that all comes in... going to grab a mute footswitch too which is HUGE for me

Shuttlemax 9.2 vs Streamliner 900
If I could only have ONE amp... absolutely the 9.2 for the versatility but the Streamliner is PERFECT with my GK NEOs

The 9.2 FET section was the tone I was really missing with my Streamliner, grindy tight lows & strong treble. Being able to change the frequency of the low & high mids are SO crucial to be able to tame cab voicing that you don't want or for an evenly responsed cab... add character exactly where YOU want it, not whats built into the cab or set by the amp. The FET with the settings above sounds a lot like the GK MB500 I just sold which is a good thing. Great for cutting through the mix... I'll take the 9.2 over the MB500 for 1) Mute footswitch 2) Change low & high mid frequency 3) Tone shaping 4) Having a whole 2nd tube amp tone. The Streamliner can't come anywhere NEAR the FET channel, especially with the settings above

9.2 Tube section... closer in comparison to the Streamliner but clearly not as huge in the lows, less warmth throughout the range even the mids. Even with the treble & high mids rolled off it still has some grind in the tone if thats what your bass does (A Sterling HH & Bongo HH always have a ton of that) The 9.2 will let the character of your bass shine through while the Streamliner will neuter it. The 9.2 tube still has a warm tone but nothing like the Streamliner

Comparing Cabs: Epifani NYC vs GK NEO 115
The Epifani is a VERY big in the lows & scooped mid cab with little mid character & presence... even response. This cab is FANTASTIC with the 9.2. I can add mids at any frequency I want... I get a very warm almost Streamliner like tone with the tube section & I get a great warmed up but still cut through the mix in your face tone with the FET. The Streamliner Epi combo is terrible, too much lows, too much warmth, muddy, lost in the mix even with extreme eq settings.

GK NEO 115 has very little lows, much more tight, grindy, Flea like slap tone with a strong upper mid volume boost. The Streamliner is clearly the winner with this particular cab. It really adds the lows this cab doesn't have & can make it warm. I cut the mids at 2.5K to get rid of the GK cab voicing & its warmth with punch, clarity & cut. The 9.2 still brings some warmth to the GK NEO but the cabs voicing is very strong & still present. I like the tube section better with this cab as it tames the voicing a bit but still cuts through the mix like a ton of bricks. Very in your face.

I love having both the Streamliner 900 & the 9.2. The Streamliner is the answer to the cabs with NEO magnets that are too grindy, not warm. I play at church & NEED a very warm, sitting back in the mix tone... you know... we play bass after all !! When I'm on coverband gigs, playing diverse music its the 9.2 for sure. The 9.2 is the amp you grab pretty much with any cab, diverse music, coverbands etc. Theres NOTHING it doesn't pair up with well having basically 2 amps using the settings above.

I'm in amp heaven! Who knows? Maybe Roger will let me keep the 2nd 9.2 & I'll grab some Uber cabs & review those too!

Feel free to PM me, ask any questions! Merry Christmas yall

 

[Limeman]

Great review! I've been thinking about adding a 9.0 to supplement my WA and Streamliner but your description of the FET channel helps me think I might want to wait for GBs 2012 product announcements first to see if they'll have a SS only 9 series.

FYI... I just picked up an Uber 212 from a fellow TB'er for use with my Streamliner. It arrived yesterday and having spent roughly 30 minutes with it and my 900. I have to say it is a pretty sweet match. Coming from playing through GS series cabs for the last 5 years, it was a bit of a shock at first. The punch of the neo drivers just about floored me in comparison, but there is also an exceptional amount of warm bottom and an airy top-end that makes for a sweeter sounding cab than most other neo's I have heard. Extremely efficient too... this cab is LOUD and gives the impression it can handle high-volume with no complaints. I will be using it tonight at a gig in the same medium-sized venue that gave me fits last week with my STL900 and GS cabs. Looking forward to sharing how it works out in comparison.

Oh... pic attached to show Uber 212 with 900 and a GS112 for size comparison. Uber is on a Gamma pad. Even though it is a large cab, it is only 18lbs or so heavier than the GS112, and with rollers on the back, should make for easy cartage.

 

[dukeorock]

Great review! I've been thinking about adding a 9.0 to supplement my WA and Streamliner but your description of the FET channel helps me think I might want to wait for GBs 2012 product announcements first to see if they'll have a SS only 9 series.

FYI... I just picked up an Uber 212 from a fellow TB'er for use with my Streamliner. It arrived yesterday and having spent roughly 30 minutes with it and my 900. I have to say it is a pretty sweet match. Coming from playing through GS series cabs for the last 5 years, it was a bit of a shock at first. The punch of the neo drivers just about floored me in comparison, but there is also an exceptional amount of warm bottom and an airy top-end that makes for a sweeter sounding cab than most other neo's I have heard. Extremely efficient too... this cab is LOUD and gives the impression it can handle high-volume with no complaints. I will use it tonight at a gig with my STL900. Looking forward to sharing how it works out.

Oh... pic attached to show Uber 212 with 900 and a GS112 for size comparison. Uber is on a Gamma pad. Even though it is a large cab, it is only 18lbs or so heavier than the GS112, and with rollers on the back, should make for easy cartage.

I use the SM 12.0 with an Uber 212 on electric only gigs, and I think you're in for a treat, brother! I have yet to really test drive an STL, but am very excited to do so asap.

 

[Tunaman]

Streamliner gig report

Still loving this amp with the GK NEOs. Boy those cabs are voiced for grind & huge mids

The Streamliner adds the lows this cab so desperately needs. Because of the cabs voicing I have a lot of versatility... I can make the cab sound warm as hell or still be in your face grind

I had the cab way in front of me & EQ'd it as normal. Bass noon, Mids cut 10 O'Clock @ 2.5K, Treble boosted a hair... from behind I sounded muddy but I went up to in front of the cab & the mids were clearly there (Funny how they don't travel nearly as well especially behind you)

VERY happy with my tone again... loving this micro with very low shy, mid boosted cabs

If your cab & bass tone is too grindy, not warm... this is the amp for you.

 

[bherman]

Great review! I've been thinking about adding a 9.0 to supplement my WA and Streamliner but your description of the FET channel helps me think I might want to wait for GBs 2012 product announcements first to see if they'll have a SS only 9 series.

FYI... I just picked up an Uber 212 from a fellow TB'er for use with my Streamliner. It arrived yesterday and having spent roughly 30 minutes with it and my 900. I have to say it is a pretty sweet match. Coming from playing through GS series cabs for the last 5 years, it was a bit of a shock at first. The punch of the neo drivers just about floored me in comparison, but there is also an exceptional amount of warm bottom and an airy top-end that makes for a sweeter sounding cab than most other neo's I have heard. Extremely efficient too... this cab is LOUD and gives the impression it can handle high-volume with no complaints. I will be using it tonight at a gig in the same medium-sized venue that gave me fits last week with my STL900 and GS cabs. Looking forward to sharing how it works out in comparison.

Oh... pic attached to show Uber 212 with 900 and a GS112 for size comparison. Uber is on a Gamma pad. Even though it is a large cab, it is only 18lbs or so heavier than the GS112, and with rollers on the back, should make for easy cartage.

I have the same setup and used it Saturday night at a gig - sounds great and can handle whatever you throw at it! Just curious, do you find that the Gamma pad makes much of a difference with that rig?

 

[KJung]

I have the same setup and used it Saturday night at a gig - sounds great and can handle whatever you throw at it! Just curious, do you find that the Gamma pad makes much of a difference with that rig?

FYI, a device like the Gramma pad only impacts what is called 'mechanical coupling'. In other words, it simply helps isolate the cab from the floor. So, it really only has an impact (a moderate one) when you are in situations where you are playing on a hollow wooden stage, or if you have, for example, a rehearsal space on an upper floor of a home. On concrete floors, etc. it would have no impact.

So, for many gigs, a 'waste of space'. On those gigs where you are stuck on a raised, hollow wooden stage, it can reduce the rumble a touch.

 

[bherman]

FYI, a device like the Gramma pad only impacts what is called 'mechanical coupling'. In other words, it simply helps isolate the cab from the floor. So, it really only has an impact (a moderate one) when you are in situations where you are playing on a hollow wooden stage, or if you have, for example, a rehearsal space on an upper floor of a home. On concrete floors, etc. it would have no impact.

So, for many gigs, a 'waste of space'. On those gigs where you are stuck on a raised, hollow wooden stage, it can reduce the rumble a touch.

THX, seems like an expensive accessory unless you encounter those situations often.

 

[wateroftyne]

THX, seems like an expensive accessory unless you encounter those situations often.

It's rare that I play on solid concrete floors, so I don't go anywhere without my GRAMMA pad any more. I find it to be indispensable.

 

[Limeman]

FYI, a device like the Gramma pad only impacts what is called 'mechanical coupling'. In other words, it simply helps isolate the cab from the floor. So, it really only has an impact (a moderate one) when you are in situations where you are playing on a hollow wooden stage, or if you have, for example, a rehearsal space on an upper floor of a home. On concrete floors, etc. it would have no impact.

So, for many gigs, a 'waste of space'. On those gigs where you are stuck on a raised, hollow wooden stage, it can reduce the rumble a touch.

+1 on that and a hollow wooden stage - exactly my situation at Saturday's gig. Other than that, it is a lightweight way to raise your cab a few inches. I found with the Uber 212, I can tilt the cab back slightly as well by letting the rear feet of the cab hang off the back of the gamma pad. Every bit helps to get the sound up to your ears. I paid about $40 for mine. Was a good investment. Also helpful in the studio with guitar amps, etc. I don't use it at every gig, but in the right situation, it can provide some benefit.

 

[bherman]

+1 on that and a hollow wooden stage - exactly my situation at Saturday's gig. Other than that, it is a lightweight way to raise your cab a few inches. I found with the Uber 212, I can tilt the cab back slightly as well by letting the rear feet of the cab hang off the back of the gamma pad. Every bit helps to get the sound up to your ears. I paid about $40 for mine. Was a good investment. Also helpful in the studio with guitar amps, etc. I don't use it at every gig, but in the right situation, it can provide some benefit.

OK, you guys have convinced me to try it. I'll report back after my next gig.

 

[bherman]

Hi all - since I started using the Streamliner as my go-to amp, I have found that I am no longer using my VT bass pedal as much. Played a gig Saturday night and didn't use it at all - just turned up the gain when I wanted a bit more drive, and my bass tone controls for more highs. FYI, I am playing a P-Bass with tapewound flats and a G&L fretless also with tape flats.

When I was using a Shuttle as my amp, I used the VT all the time, mostly for overdrive. I am curious to know if others have had the same experience or if you are still using the VT with a Streamliner and if so, how?

 

[N. Kentucky Bass]

FYI, a device like the Gramma pad only impacts what is called 'mechanical coupling'. In other words, it simply helps isolate the cab from the floor. So, it really only has an impact (a moderate one) when you are in situations where you are playing on a hollow wooden stage, or if you have, for example, a rehearsal space on an upper floor of a home. On concrete floors, etc. it would have no impact.

So, for many gigs, a 'waste of space'. On those gigs where you are stuck on a raised, hollow wooden stage, it can reduce the rumble a touch.

The Gramma pad also helps reduce extraneous noise in my home studio. The hardwood floor floats atop a 3/4" plywood base, which floats atop a concrete foundation pad. Basically, the Gramma helps decouple the vibrations that otherwise transmit to the wall joists and cause buzzing. Doesn't totally solve the problem, but sure helps reduce it alot!

 

[adivin]

Hi all - since I started using the Streamliner as my go-to amp, I have found that I am no longer using my VT bass pedal as much. Played a gig Saturday night and didn't use it at all - just turned up the gain when I wanted a bit more drive, and my bass tone controls for more highs. FYI, I am playing a P-Bass with tapewound flats and a G&L fretless also with tape flats.

When I was using a Shuttle as my amp, I used the VT all the time, mostly for overdrive. I am curious to know if others have had the same experience or if you are still using the VT with a Streamliner and if so, how?

I personally don't like my VT pedal with the Streamliner much. The VT pedal with my old SWR solid state head sounds good together though. I think a good distortion pedal will get better results.