Good mike choices for my cabinet

[agedhorse]

Never give up the fight! If you ask to blend DI and mic, you'll just get DI. Bring a mic with full range (not an SM57) and don't give the sound guy an option for DI.

Yeah, you COULD do this, but you might discover that the sound guy has more important things to deal with and will turn it up a bit and move on. It may sound worse than using a DI also. If you get too pushy, and become unreasonable to the sound guy, you might find that he says sure ok, in order to move things along and you move to the bottom of his "to do" list.

A sound guy has a bunch of moving parts he/she is dealing with. I good sound guy will deal with the most critical and necessary ones first when building a mix. Vocals tend to be more important than the bass, but of course it depends on the type of music too.

 

[JeezyMcNuggles]

Im tired of the soundman using " i dont have a mike" as an excuse for not miking my cab so im buying one to carry with me
Im looking for suggestions for a solid/tough, roadworthy mike for my ampeg 810 wich i push hard with my svt2 pro. Would a 57 cut it? Im not looking for a $300 mike either.
Thanks in advance

You're going to sound much less clear, and have to turn down too much to really hear your "amazing" tone anyway. Your cab is just a monitor. If you mic your cab, your bass will be so much less full, and probably not sit all that well in the mix. The sound guy will then completely jack up your sound with his eq to compensate, and no one will be happy. I would just stick to going direct. There is a reason almost every bassist is plugged straight into the board.

 

[LowFactor]

Most of the touring guys in Nashville are going away from amps. Either using a cab sim pedal or a modeler like a kemper or axe fx. Yet we still use two channels. Normally a dry straight off the bass blended with the cab sim. Guess it’s kinda the new school way of doing di and micing the cab. Heck even most of the guitar players are ditching their amps for kempers.
By all means carry a mic with you. And talk to the sound person. Sometimes you may get what you want. But sometimes you won’t. Due to limited channel count, time etc. or you may have to sacrifice and give up either the mic or the di. DI will give you a fuller sound. You may get more amp grit with the mic but will have to sacrifice low end. Remember the frequencies your are trying to capture can be up to 30 plus feet long... I normally use the mic for mid range cut and a di for the full bottom end.

 

[agedhorse]

Most of the touring guys in Nashville are going away from amps. Either using a cab sim pedal or a modeler like a kemper or axe fx. Yet we still use two channels. Normally a dry straight off the bass blended with the cab sim. Guess it’s kinda the new school way of doing di and micing the cab. Heck even most of the guitar players are ditching their amps for kempers.
By all means carry a mic with you. And talk to the sound person. Sometimes you may get what you want. But sometimes you won’t. Due to limited channel count, time etc. or you may have to sacrifice and give up either the mic or the di. DI will give you a fuller sound. You may get more amp grit with the mic but will have to sacrifice low end. Remember the frequencies your are trying to capture can be up to 30 plus feet long... I normally use the mic for mid range cut and a di for the full bottom end.

Note that capturing the low end has nothing to do with the length of the wave as it's based on varying pressure. Wavelength has nothing to do with it, otherwise headphones would have no low end...

 

[rohi]

+1 for the MD421 II. It's my go to mic.

 

[TheReceder]

I think I'd rather get into a p***ing match with my wife than with my soundman, and my wife knows where I sleep and where all the sharp objects are in the house.

 

[dalahorse]

Yeah, you COULD do this, but you might discover that the sound guy has more important things to deal with and will turn it up a bit and move on. It may sound worse than using a DI also. If you get too pushy, and become unreasonable to the sound guy, you might find that he says sure ok, in order to move things along and you move to the bottom of his "to do" list.

A sound guy has a bunch of moving parts he/she is dealing with. I good sound guy will deal with the most critical and necessary ones first when building a mix. Vocals tend to be more important than the bass, but of course it depends on the type of music too.

I agree that the sound engineer has lots of moving parts. Importance and ranking is dependent on the situation.

On one hand, it sucks that guitarists can expect a mic no matter what while the bassist gets the easy DI request. On the other hand, there are lots of basssists that can't dial in a good sound on their own.

So yeah - I agree with you. And if the bass sound is dependent on the rig, the bassist should study sound reinforcement and work with the sound engineer... And bring their own full rant mic.

 

[agedhorse]

+1 for the MD421 II. It's my go to mic.

It's one of my favorites as well... except for the damn clip!

I agree that the sound engineer has lots of moving parts. Importance and ranking is dependent on the situation.

On one hand, it sucks that guitarists can expect a mic no matter what while the bassist gets the easy DI request. On the other hand, there are lots of basssists that can't dial in a good sound on their own.

So yeah - I agree with you. And if the bass sound is dependent on the rig, the bassist should study sound reinforcement and work with the sound engineer... And bring their own full rant mic.

Maybe it doesn't suck so bad that the guitar player gets a mic, and you don't. Often it's less hassle due to the (generally) noisier rigs plus the dirty little secret that sound guys keep to themselves... in smaller rooms, even though we might put up a mic, we spend zero time on it because it's not going to be needed anyway. If there was a way to turn down the guitar, we might be a happier bunch. In a larger room, we might opt for the mic as an easier way to translate the guitar player's entire sound but often it's not as good as we would like.

In many cases a DI will sound BETTER than a mic, and what our job to do is to get the bass to sit best within the entire mix, in a listening environment that's different than the stage sound. It depends on the room, it depends on the PA rig, it depends on the volume but if I had to choose between a mic or a DI, I would almost always choose the DI because I know I will be able to get something easily usable even if it's not "perfect". With a mic, the confidence factor is not as high, especially if tighter low end extension is part of the player's tone. Ideally, I would choose both, start with the DI and add mic to taste.

Since most of the gigs I worked were at the national touring level, I generally had whatever I needed and likewise, the band trusted me to do my job (be it mix FOH or support their own guy) so that they could concentrate on playing. At this level, both DI and mic were the norm, though if only one input was used it was almost always the DI.

This is the reason why I put so much effort into a highly usable DI on every amp I design.

 

[FugaziBomb]

This should probably be under "Band Management", tbh.

I believe you are misreading the situation. Your soundman is trying to explain in bassist-friendly way that he has no interest in miking your cab and, while you're at it, please stop asking. You could show up with some kind of awesome Sennheiser 441 and he would still take you direct.

If I was mixing, I'd feel the same way. "Lovely: you have this awesome fridge set up on stage. Enjoy it because it's got nothing to do with what I'm up to out here."

Don't press the issue with the BL, either. Keep your powder dry. You're not going to win this one.

Never give up the fight!

Nah, I'm with @saabfender on this one - give up the fight. Why do you want your cab to be mic'd? Are you running an overdrive pedal that sounds harsh when DI'd or do you just want to make sure the audience hears your SVT cab? If it is the latter, I'd say you're causing more trouble than its worth. No one in the audience cares what your 810 sounds like. I know that sounds harsh, but it is totally true. Send the DI line from the back of the amp and that should be enough to preserve your tone.

I mic my cab and DI, but that is because I treat my DI line as a "dry" line and my mic as a "wet" for my pedalboard. When I don't gig with my originals band and don't have all the crazy effects (doing cover gigs or sub work) I don't even bring an amp half the time. I talk to people in the crowd all the time who didn't even notice there wasn't a bass amp onstage.

If you ask to blend DI and mic, you'll just get DI. Bring a mic with full range (not an SM57) and don't give the sound guy an option for DI.

This is the worst advice. If you quarrel with the FOH, you are always going to come up the loser. You are completely at his mercy. if you try some ultimatum crap on him, chances are he will tank your sound live. Why wouldn't he? It's not like he has a boss sitting there waiting to give him grief cuz the bass guitar was mixed so low you couldn't hear it, or was all boom and no definition, etc.

Think of it this way: imagine if you worked in a big box type store and a customer told you he did not want you to use a hand truck to move a heavy item because he thinks it will damage the item. You explain to him that the item is in a cardboard box and has packing foam inside that box and that there is no need to worry, but he is dead set on making your job harder anyway. How would that make you feel? Would you want to offer that guy great service? I wouldn't.

Maybe instead approach the sound guy like this:

"Hey, my name is _____ and I'm the bassist. Do you plan on running a DI for the bass amp? I ask because I always bring this Make/Model mic with me I like to use. What do you think, mic or DI? I personally prefer the mic but its your call."

I know we all think support staff at events are there to cater to our artistic vision, but that's just a fairy tale. These guys and girls are just at work, doing their job. They probably would rather be somewhere else - maybe on stage with their bands instead of doing a thankless job where they constantly deal with amateurs who think they know better than them.

The irony of this is that my own set up in my originals band requires a mic and a DI, but I just explain my set up to them and ask for what I want in a way that frames it like it is beneficial to them ("If I could have a DI for my dry side and a mic on the cab to send you my effects, then you can mix to taste out front.") It never fails.

 

[Mingo Sanders]

Im tired of the soundman using " i dont have a mike" as an excuse for not miking my cab so im buying one to carry with me
Im looking for suggestions for a solid/tough, roadworthy mike for my ampeg 810 wich i push hard with my svt2 pro. Would a 57 cut it? Im not looking for a $300 mike either.
Thanks in advance

Point your cabinet at the kick drum. Turn WAY up. "Share" the kick drum mic with the drummer (snicker, snicker). When the sound man tells you that your cab is bleeding into the kick drum, tell him to tighten up his noise gate. When he says, "I don't have a noise gate," offer to turn down if he'll run your E-V RE20 into the board.

Just kidding.

Has anybody in the audience told you that they can't hear you? That's where the rubber meets the road. What is the size of the venues you play? Your profile page says you're in a Motley Crue tribute band. Dumb question, but are you loud? When I worked for Showco in the '80's, I was assigned to the Motley Crue tour twice (December 1983 and April-June 1984), so I know what Motley Crue sounded like live (um, loud, duh). Nikki Sixx's bass roadie read a Bible on the bus.

Sound men come in more varieties than there are musicians. Are you working with one sound man or more than one? You can't win a fight with a dope, and you can't stand at the house console and turn up your mic and di in the mix, even if you get to run them to the board.

As already mentioned by some others above, this is a band management/people question much more than it is a gear question. Let the audience be your guide. If you care about the music and your playing, that may be a bitter pill to swallow, because heavy metal audiences aren't typically interested in your tone or your technique.

Having said all that, we always used the Electro-Voice RE20 on bass. It's more expensive than the budget you set above. You're getting lots of good advice here. EDIT: We always gave every band, including every opening act, both a bass mic and a bass di line to both the house and the monitor console.

BTW, I see in your profile that you're in Detroit. On the Kinks "Come Dancing" tour in 1983, the Rockets opened on a bunch of dates. I'l never forget those shows. Dave Gilbert: what a voice, what a tragic soul. The Motor City knows how to rock. Good luck.

 

[five7]

When I ran sound I used a EV RE20 a Sen 421 and sometimes a 57. Audix also was used.

 

[JimmyM]

You're going to sound much less clear, and have to turn down too much to really hear your "amazing" tone anyway. Your cab is just a monitor. If you mic your cab, your bass will be so much less full, and probably not sit all that well in the mix. The sound guy will then completely jack up your sound with his eq to compensate, and no one will be happy. I would just stick to going direct. There is a reason almost every bassist is plugged straight into the board.

Sorry but this sounds like someone who never tried a mic on a cab. Nothing but internet myths.

 

[JimmyM]

Nah, I'm with @saabfender on this one - give up the fight. Why do you want your cab to be mic'd? Are you running an overdrive pedal that sounds harsh when DI'd or do you just want to make sure the audience hears your SVT cab? If it is the latter, I'd say you're causing more trouble than its worth. No one in the audience cares what your 810 sounds like. I know that sounds harsh, but it is totally true. Send the DI line from the back of the amp and that should be enough to preserve your tone.

I mic my cab and DI, but that is because I treat my DI line as a "dry" line and my mic as a "wet" for my pedalboard. When I don't gig with my originals band and don't have all the crazy effects (doing cover gigs or sub work) I don't even bring an amp half the time. I talk to people in the crowd all the time who didn't even notice there wasn't a bass amp onstage.



This is the worst advice. If you quarrel with the FOH, you are always going to come up the loser. You are completely at his mercy. if you try some ultimatum crap on him, chances are he will tank your sound live. Why wouldn't he? It's not like he has a boss sitting there waiting to give him grief cuz the bass guitar was mixed so low you couldn't hear it, or was all boom and no definition, etc.

Think of it this way: imagine if you worked in a big box type store and a customer told you he did not want you to use a hand truck to move a heavy item because he thinks it will damage the item. You explain to him that the item is in a cardboard box and has packing foam inside that box and that there is no need to worry, but he is dead set on making your job harder anyway. How would that make you feel? Would you want to offer that guy great service? I wouldn't.

Maybe instead approach the sound guy like this:

"Hey, my name is _____ and I'm the bassist. Do you plan on running a DI for the bass amp? I ask because I always bring this Make/Model mic with me I like to use. What do you think, mic or DI? I personally prefer the mic but its your call."

I know we all think support staff at events are there to cater to our artistic vision, but that's just a fairy tale. These guys and girls are just at work, doing their job. They probably would rather be somewhere else - maybe on stage with their bands instead of doing a thankless job where they constantly deal with amateurs who think they know better than them.

The irony of this is that my own set up in my originals band requires a mic and a DI, but I just explain my set up to them and ask for what I want in a way that frames it like it is beneficial to them ("If I could have a DI for my dry side and a mic on the cab to send you my effects, then you can mix to taste out front.") It never fails.

Wow. Just wow.

 

[Mingo Sanders]

It's one of my favorites as well... except for the damn clip!

We always field serviced those clips with .

 

[wolfkeller]

Ok, ive had my cab miked many times, ive had it di and miked as well as just di. I want the sound of my whole rig to go to FOH. We always get on well with the FOH guys but im tired of not having the sound i want. So i will require my cab to me miked and i will provide a mike and clamp. Its simply a matter of which mike

 

[wolfkeller]

Its never a matter of being heard, i just want more of the sound on stage to be FOH. Soundmen tend to be lazy, ill make it easier

 

[TN WOODMAN]

I read the post title and 1st thought-Shure SM-57. It’s truly the p bass of microphones . Mic your bass cab, effortlessly. Mic your drummers kick drum? No prob. Guitarist Marshall stack? Ditto. Singer ‘s fav mic crapped out? You guessed it. I still can’t believe how versatile and inexpensive these are after all these years.

 

[LowFactor]

The 421 clips aren’t that bad. Just adjust the set screw and they are fine. Yeah it’s not the best design. But most people ignore the screw and tape them.

 

[wolfkeller]

My name’s Mike and I’m pretty cheap. I’ll come and talk to your soundguy.

Best ive heard!!!

 

[Mingo Sanders]

I read the post title and 1st thought-Shure SM-57. It’s truly the p bass of microphones . Mic your bass cab, effortlessly. Mic your drummers kick drum? No prob. Guitarist Marshall stack? Ditto. Singer ‘s fav mic crapped out? You guessed it. I still can’t believe how versatile and inexpensive these are after all these years.

The SM-57 sounds great on everything, but it fails miserably as a hammer. For that, my go to choice is the Shure 548: a good (not great) mic AND a good hammer!