Greenboy vs. Barefaced vs. Audiokinesis

[sratas]

If I were in the usa I would like to try one of mike arnopol's cabs, the MAS. With all those flexibility and dispersion is really tempting.
But, living in europe with a big baby 2 is not bad either

 

[Jools4001]

A friend of mine had a BFM Jack 12 - VERY LOUD, plenty of mids, & pretty lacking otherwise, but hey, not saying they still sound musical - depending on your tone goals.

I built a pair of Jack 12 Lites for use as PA tops. I love them for PA but don't care for their tone as bass cabs.

 

[ThisBass]

In my experience, what makes a SVT 8x10 feel like a SVT 8x10 is about 140 lbs.

In my experience, what makes a SVT 8x10 feel like a SVT 8x10 is wave front coupling, among ohers.

 

[Mike Arnopol]

I haven't read through the thread but I would seriously consider a pair of Duke's 1203's. They're killin'.

 

[ThisBass]

It always makes me wonder the way how voiced cabs and linear sounding cabs and as well different topologies are considered to be as just the same thing?

 

[Mike Arnopol]

One thing that Duke and I have noticed. Most guys---even ones that insist on "flat" cabs---prefer a bit of an elevated midrange for electric bass. I've always been adamant about a cab being flat, but I've come to prefer a bit elevated midrange---on EB it sounds flat to me, and the actual flat cabs sound a bit dull. Just my two cents.

 

[Dave Hill]

I've been dying to hear a 2 1203 stack, and it looks like I'll be getting a chance to set them up next to my F212 in the not too distant future! Can't wait!

 

[Al Kraft]

One thing that Duke and I have noticed. Most guys---even ones that insist on "flat" cabs---prefer a bit of an elevated midrange for electric bass. I've always been adamant about a cab being flat, but I've come to prefer a bit elevated midrange---on EB it sounds flat to me, and the actual flat cabs sound a bit dull. Just my two cents.

Do you think that is because many amps have a bit it of scoop in the mids and it sort of balances things out, it's just a preference for you or it's a phenomenon associated with how the ear perceives frequencies...or (D) None of the Above?

 

[12bass]

One thing that Duke and I have noticed. Most guys---even ones that insist on "flat" cabs---prefer a bit of an elevated midrange for electric bass. I've always been adamant about a cab being flat, but I've come to prefer a bit elevated midrange---on EB it sounds flat to me, and the actual flat cabs sound a bit dull. Just my two cents.

Curious to know more specifically what you mean by 'midrange', which encompasses a broad frequency spectrum. I could see advantages in having a bit of a bump in the 400-800Hz area for presence in the mix, or perhaps lower for some folks who prefer forward midbass. However, some frequency ranges are not all that flattering to bass, IMO, and a bit of a dip might sound more musical.

 

[DukeLeJeune]

One thing that Duke and I have noticed. Most guys---even ones that insist on "flat" cabs---prefer a bit of an elevated midrange for electric bass. I've always been adamant about a cab being flat, but I've come to prefer a bit elevated midrange---on EB it sounds flat to me, and the actual flat cabs sound a bit dull. Just my two cents.

Curious to know more specifically what you mean by 'midrange', which encompasses a broad frequency spectrum.

Speaking for myself only, south of about 800 Hz, I don't want any really big peaks or dips. I definitely don't want any sag in the response below about 300 Hz. There is a particular non-flat curve that I prefer in the region south of 800 Hz, but it's not a major departure from "flat".

My Thunderchild series is voiced pretty smooth, but in my Hathor series I do some deliberate voicing north of 800 Hz, based on what I think sounds good and what I think slots well in the mix. I'd call the region from ballpark 800 Hz to about 2 kHz the "upper mids" , and that's probably what I focus on the most when "voicing" a cab for electric bass. But that's just me, and other designers probably have other ideas.

 

[Lindex]

Many of today's bass players prefer to have elevated mids in their cabs, so that they can scoop them on their amps again using the contour knobs...

 

[12bass]

My Eden D-210XST sounds like a midfest (almost AM radio-like) when compared with my true 3-way fEARful 15/6/1. Although many have reported the XSTs to have stronger fundamental response than most commercial cabinets, there is simply no comparison with the deep lows from the fEARful. That said, I used the Eden for many years and it sat pretty well in the mix.

 

[jnewmark]

As someone who has played bass guitar for 40 years now, I definitely prefer a lower mid bump, somewhere in the 250 hz range, and pretty much do not enjoy a built in upper mid range bump. I play mostly down at the nut, finger style Blues and RnB, and that lower mid bump really gives me that chunky type of pillow in the mix. What kills me is that, that 250 hz bump seems to differ from amp to amp, let alone from cab to cab. Right now, I'm using a Genz Benz Shuttle 6.2, and a Greenboy Bassic 15, with the Faital woofer. I don't know what the " built in " specs are for that particular rig , but a slight bump in the 250 -300 area gives me pretty much what I want.

 

[Mike Arnopol]

I'm with Duke on this. Like the previous post,I too prefer a bit of an upper bass/lower mid bump----great for finger style funk, r&b, etc. But a lot of guys prefer flatter in that area. So in my cabs--I offer both. But with a lot of guys it obscures clarity for their style. So you can't go too far. Fusion guys like more of a 500hz bump---maybe I'm wrong.Jaco growl. But the 800 to 2k region stays pretty musical with a little rise. For me--2k to 4k is the worst place for a rise, but that's just my opinion. That's why I went to custom drivers---the stock Kappalites (and many Eminence speakers) have a nasty peak just north of 2k. So you have to either cross over lower or use a filter. One of the boutique designer's cabs had a big peak at 4k. To me that's the worst place for a peak---unless you want finger noise to be a major element in your sound.

So, yeah---when you say midrange---it's a useless vague term. And none of us agree what's lower mids, upper mids, etc.. I consider 250 to be more upper bass---it's where you hear a lot of second harmonics which add thickness to the bass punch region. 60's thickness if that makes sense. I really consider 350 to 600 lower mids and 800 to 2k mids. 2k to 4k upper mids. Above that--tweeterland. My philosophy is that the mids contribute to the overall timbre of the sound. What makes one bass sound different from another. Above 4k doesn't really change the essential timbre, it just offers definition---puts you more forward in a mix without changing the essential timbre.

Again---my two cents----again most would likely disagree

 

[Lindex]

So true. All personal preferences.

One of my amps has its lower mids @220Hz which I find starting to sound a little "boxy" when boosted too much.
My other one has them centered at 140Hz which I like much more as it really adds some serious punch while you can cut the low end under 50Hz with the bass knob when the room is shaking too much in the lows.

Actually this is why I switched from a 3-band EQ amp to a 5-band.
You can cut the subs a bit, add some punch in the lowest mids, slightly scoop around 500Hz, add some high mids at 1.6 KHz and adjust treble as needed.
Fits me better than having a 5-way mid freq selector where you can only edit one at a time.

I always thought I liked voiced cabs more as they gave the sound some personality/character.
But lately I started learning that using more neutral, flatter response cabs are a more valuable option to me as they're not limited to just one character sound but are more flexible and can have different "character" sounds dialed in easily by eq-ing.

 

[bordinco90]

Wow I did not expect so many replies! I hope this cab delivers. The customer service from Duke has really been great. I'm so ready to get the H1203. I could not believe that he recommended the H1203 over the TC12, due to the H1203 being cheaper than the TC12. Duke really knows his stuff and I really enjoyed discussing the listed cabs above. He was completely honest about all the cabs.

 

[Marial]

Wow I did not expect so many replies! I hope this cab delivers. The customer service from Duke has really been great. I'm so ready to get the H1203. I could not believe that he recommended the H1203 over the TC12, due to the H1203 being cheaper than the TC12. Duke really knows his stuff and I really enjoyed discussing the listed cabs above. He was completely honest about all the cabs.

That's Duke, he's a gem.

 

[nostatic]

I've gone through a lot of cabs - right now have an H1203 and MAS109. They are different beasts that do exactly what I want them to do. The only thing I'd change at this point would be to double up on each, though the H1203 stacked on the MAS109 covers any loud gig I'd need.

I've had quite a few conversations with both Mike and Duke (who are both great guys). I was one of the "give me more upper mid edge, less low mid wool" voices as I favor an articulate tone for comping when I need to and hate having a very thick low mids. I know other guys who sound great with the thick low mid thing but it isn't my goal.

I tried a couple of Barefaced cabs and they are nice and have their own thing going on (the 210 takes grind/dirt is a spectacular way). But the H1203 is the best sound I can get in a small 24 lb package, and the MAS109 will carry a big and/or difficult room in amazing ways. Plus I just like the way a 3" paper cone driver sounds in the mids/highs.

Totally ymmv.

 

[tombowlus]

I've had quite a few conversations with both Mike and Duke (who are both great guys). I was one of the "give me more upper mid edge, less low mid wool" voices as I favor an articulate tone for comping when I need to and hate having a very thick low mids. I know other guys who sound great with the thick low mid thing but it isn't my goal.

You might really like Duke's new 1505, then.

 

[Arthur U. Poon]

One thing that Duke and I have noticed. Most guys---even ones that insist on "flat" cabs---prefer a bit of an elevated midrange for electric bass. I've always been adamant about a cab being flat, but I've come to prefer a bit elevated midrange---on EB it sounds flat to me, and the actual flat cabs sound a bit dull. Just my two cents.

I very much agree. I "discovered" over the years, while using a pair of cabinets that were aimed more towards a "flat" eq voicing, that I required a fair amount of mids-boosting to be able to hear myself on a small stage, in a loud mix, especially when playing Classic Rock material. (I always wear earplugs in these situations, btw.)

On a hunch, I bought a pair of cabinets that have a bit of a Rock Tone "Baked Into" their tone, and instantly noticed how much easier it was for me to hear myself, -and at an overall lower volume setting.

My "Flat EQ"cabinets' tone perform wonderfully when I play Country and R&B material, though.

Oddly, I've found my Rock Tone cabinets pull off the County and R&B material really well, so a cabinet with a mids hump baked in perform much better for my style.