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Has anyone bought and NOT liked a Sadowsky??

You certainly can make a 3 band (or 500 band if you want) FET based preamp.

...and FETs ARE solid state, so I'm not sure what you're trying to get at differentiating between a "FET preamp" and a "solid state" mid boost.

I used the term solid state instead of op amp since most people don’t know the difference. Obviously I was wrong and some do know the difference.

They are both, FET and op amp, solid state but they achieve results in a very different ways thus having different sounds. FET boost tend to have a warmer color to the tone, more tube-like but not quite the pleasant warmth of a tube preamp. An OpAmp in my opinion sounds sterile, very linear in response, almost too linear. On the upside, the linearity makes them very predictable when designing a boost circuit.

Building FET preamps can be difficult since they are susceptible to noise and wide or increasing Q’s. In a bass preamp the frequency range that needs to be worked with to be most effective is fairly small.

Roger has determined that adding a mid control to the FET circuit affected the current bass & treble FET in a negative way and he decided not to go that route. He opted (no pun intended) for an op amp mid circuit so the Q width and Frequency could be adjusted since an op amp’s operation is primarily a mathematical algorithm.
 
I'm pretty surprised so many people weren't into the Sadowsky's they played, but as others said, it really boils down to personal preference.

For me Sadowsky's are exactly what I want out of a bass. I love the look and feel of a Fender, but for the most part, I want more of a modern tone.

Sadowsky's fill those requirements perfectly and it doesn't hurt that they're build amazingly well and that Roger and Co are all a great bunch of people to do business with.
 
You are right on point, and yet I disagree with you.

I think it is absolutely reasonable and certainly possible to make objective comments about a "piece of gear that is diametrically opposed to your playing style, your gig, your tonal needs."

Ok then, what are your objective standards and comments that are free of your subjective needs/experiences. See, I could understand if someone made a comment to the effect of:

" I really wanted a 5 string take on a Jazz bass, but the Sadowsky I got was way more modern sounding"

That's a constructive comment that might steer a similar player away from buying one. Alleva Coppolo might be a better option here from what I've heard, or simply a Fender passive 5 string Jbass.

I guess it's all in the presentation of who you are as a player and what your tonal goals are. If a particular player feels that they absolutely have to have a mid-boost in a bass, demand that a $4k+ bass contains top-shelf exotic woods, and think that a 35 inch and up scale is THE ONLY way to acheive their definition of 'a killer B string', then any negative comments they might make about a Sadowsky are largely irrelevant based off of their narrow, VERY subjective needs. In the same way, me saying that I ended up not liking the tone of my various MTDs (all different wood combos) is predictable (wish I had thought this out back then!!!!) because the 'tone in my head' is very much a modern variation of a 60's Fender bass sound.

What I like about Talkbass is that as you get to know certain members insofar as how they play/what their gigs demand/how they sound, you can better judge how to take their impressions. But if you can't ascertain what that persons 'standards' are, how are you to learn anything from their impressions?
 
What I like about Talkbass is that as you get to know certain members insofar as how they play/what their gigs demand/how they sound, you can better judge how to take their impressions. But if you can't ascertain what that persons 'standards' are, how are you to learn anything from their impressions?

Agreed. I also like when players give us some samples of their playing so I at least have an idea where they're coming from. Sometimes requesting opinions on an instrument around here is like showing up at a monster truck rally and asking how the new Jetta handles long stretches of freeway. Or better yet, asking a bunch of kids who don't even have a drivers license yet what the best car is.
 
I've heard people use that term "organic" when comparing tone before, I wonder what it means. Did the Sadowsky not sound carbon based? :hiding:

I use that term quite a bit.... think of it (oversimply) as the upper mid and trelbe response of a passive J single coil pickup (organic... meaning loosely 'natural') versus the upper mid and treble response of a hum cancelling J run through an onboard preamp (not organic:).

I go for 'kind of organic':D... single coil traditional J pickup, but buffered by a preamp set mostly 'neutral'.... some organic grind, but a bit more deep bass and a bit more 'sparkle' up top due to the buffering, and the slight voicing built into a preamp like the Sadowky.

The stock Sadowsky J tone with the HC's and a bit of boost on the preamp is the definition of 'not organic' to me.... not that it isn't good, but if you dig a passive Fender.... you would have a good chance of not digging the stock Sadowsky J tone IMO... different beast.

IMO there.
 
I hear ya. I posted a few different clips with the Fender & Sadowsky a few posts ago because I agree that the Fender sounded deep and full when solo'd and especially when woodshedding or playing alone. However, the Sadowsky always felt more full in the mix and sat perfectly.

I also found all of that nice passive single coil sound I was getting from the Fender was not noticeable on the gig and I had to adjust EQ on my bass amp when playing to compensate. The gigs I brought both basses to ranged from Country to Urban Gospel.

I can definitely see somebody making the comparison playing both basses in a music store or their basement, but bringing both out on multiple gigs sealed the deal for me.

Now, obviously lots of guys gig and sound wonderful on their passive Fenders, this is just based on my experience and my opinion - I liked how the Sadowsky sounded and everything I thought I liked more about the Fender disappeared when I gigged it alongside the Sadowsky. IMO, IME, YMMV, don't shoot the messenger etc. ;)

I go for 'kind of organic':D... single coil traditional J pickup, but buffered by a preamp set mostly 'neutral'.... some organic grind, but a bit more deep bass and a bit more 'sparkle' up top due to the buffering, and the slight voicing built into a preamp like the Sadowky.
 
Not really a meaningful question. I'm sure there a zillions of players like that. That's why Fodera, Lull, MTD, Zon and a hundred other brands exist ;)...
BZZZZZZT! Wrong answer.
Fodera, Lull, MTD, Zon, etc. DON'T exist because there are zillions of players who don't like Sadowsky. They exist because Zon, Tobias, blah...blah...blah have the skills to make basses and THEY want to make money too! That's all. There's no conspiracy to it, there's no special meaning to it, there's no magic to it. It's just simply a matter of: "Hey, I want to make a product and sell it".

Apple/Mac is more user-friendly, higher tech, and safer than Microsoft/PC and always has been. That didn't stop Bill Gates...cuz Billy wanted to make money too.
 
BZZZZZZT! Wrong answer.
Fodera, Lull, MTD, Zon, etc. DON'T exist because there are zillions of players who don't like Sadowsky. They exist because Zon, Tobias, blah...blah...blah have the skills to make basses and THEY want to make money too! That's all. There's no conspiracy to it, there's no special meaning to it, there's no magic to it. It's just simply a matter of: "Hey, I want to make a product and sell it".

+1 to this, but...

Apple/Mac is more user-friendly, higher tech, and safer than Microsoft/PC and always has been. That didn't stop Bill Gates...cuz Billy wanted to make money too.

Not so much to this. Whether something is "user friendly" is just as much a matter of opinion as whether or not a bass sounds "good". Depends on what you are doing and how you want to do it.

Also, the only reason Apple has been "safer" is because not that many people have used them - until recently. As their market share grows they are becoming targeted by more and more viruses and malware.

Using this logic, we could say that Ubuntu is much "safer".

In the tech world we call it "security through obscurity". :)
 
I had a sadowsky I wasn't really fond of. I bought it used mostly because I wasn't able to find a nicer jazz bass at the moment and it was made before there were two differend lines.. It was a fine instruments by all accounts, just not great for me. I'm a jazz bass fanatic, but this one had all the things options I really don't like that much and I got insanely lucky with a run of the mill fender that played just as well but sounded better to me, so it was easy to let the sadowsky go.

I'd love to give a more 70's style sadowsky a try, but honestly, with the bass I play at the moment, I just couldn't justify the price to myself.
 
Agreed. I also like when players give us some samples of their playing so I at least have an idea where they're coming from. Sometimes requesting opinions on an instrument around here is like showing up at a monster truck rally and asking how the new Jetta handles long stretches of freeway. Or better yet, asking a bunch of kids who don't even have a drivers license yet what the best car is.

The problem is, a lot have no examples to give, but they talk like they raced F1 or NASCAR.
Thus you have opinions of a Jetta give by someone who's only been behind the wheel of a PowerWheels Corvette


This:
TrentsCorvette093-2.jpg


When you want to know about this:
009.jpg


Before I get flamed, EVERYone has a valid opinion. But please don't over state yourself. Be honest.
That's all.

KJung and I have a buddy (Ken, you know who I'm talking about) who you would swear is a dyed in the wool hard-core gigging player.
Waxes poetic about gear like you wouldn't believe.

Maybe does 3 gigs a year.
But damn!!! He'll tell you how good or bad a bass works in a live mix/studio.
 
I had a sadowsky I wasn't really fond of. I bought it used mostly because I wasn't able to find a nicer jazz bass at the moment and it was made before there were two differend lines.. It was a fine instruments by all accounts, just not great for me. I'm a jazz bass fanatic, but this one had all the things options I really don't like that much and I got insanely lucky with a run of the mill fender that played just as well but sounded better to me, so it was easy to let the sadowsky go.

I'd love to give a more 70's style sadowsky a try, but honestly, with the bass I play at the moment, I just couldn't justify the price to myself.

Perfect post.
 
Before I get flamed, EVERYone has a valid opinion. But please don't over state yourself. Be honest.
That's all.

But not necessarily on the issue at hand. A lot of opinions are based on inexperience and misinformation, which makes them completely invalid. Of course, it's much more PC to talk about respecting everyone's opinion. There is, however, a difference between respecting a person's right to their opinion and respecting their actual opinion. :)
 
The problem is, a lot have no examples to give, but they talk like they raced F1 or NASCAR.
Thus you have opinions of a Jetta give by someone who's only been behind the wheel of a PowerWheels Corvette

ha...perfect. I hear ya man!

I agree 100%, in fact the opinions that I factor in from Talkbass are only of players I've seen/heard. If metalpunkbassist from south dakota tells me the new Warwick beats the pants off of every boutique, then sweet, rock on my brother. But if it's one of the players (like you Mike) who I've at least seen or heard samples from and have an idea what they sound like, I'll pay attention.

There's others who are the complete opposite, I really dig Joe Duran (narud's) playing but when he talks about which basses he prefers based on his setup and how they feel then I don't even pay attention because the dude makes Gary Willis seem conservative with his setup and technique. The gripes he has about low action and bridge spacing would register at about 0% on my radar for needs/wants. So IMO you gotta know where these guys are coming from before you put any weight behind their opinions, not just their talent as a player but their goals and personal preferences as well.
 
. . . If a particular player feels that they absolutely have to have a mid-boost in a bass, demand that a $4k+ bass contains top-shelf exotic woods, and think that a 35 inch and up scale is THE ONLY way to acheive their definition of 'a killer B string', then any negative comments they might make about a Sadowsky are largely irrelevant based off of their narrow, VERY subjective needs. . .

I am certain each of us would question why said player ever tried a Sadowsky in the first place, but nevertherless, I disagree. If the question is offered as the OP did, the above is a perfectly legitimate reason and reply. One that most would dismiss, but no less valid in the context of the OP. I think your example is extreme, but of course, extremes makes the best examples. :) The aestetics and design should be obvious to anyone simply by looking at a pic or two, but the playability and tone would not be without a try out. If a person with the preferences above decided to try one anyway and didn't care for it, I don't know why he or she couldn't post as much.

. . .In the same way, me saying that I ended up not liking the tone of my various MTDs (all different wood combos) is predictable (wish I had thought this out back then!!!!) because the 'tone in my head' is very much a modern variation of a 60's Fender bass sound. . . .

Predictable? Perhaps to someone well studied and who enjoys research and in-depth discussion about bass tone, but I don't think we should always presume a poster to be as such. And, even if your criticism is predictable, that makes it no less legitimate.

If not this thread, then what is a correct context to invite and offer valid criticism of a Sadowsky? (or any other bass for that matter)
 
Yeah, those ones I REALLY don't get....$2500.00 for a Japanese-made robot copy that probably cost $200.00 to make (and sounds like it).

Good on Roger for being able to charge that much. I won't be buying one anytime soon.

Cheers,
Cameron

The Metro basses are hand made in Japan, and are NOT "robot" copies. The quality is the same as the NYC line. The only differences are
(a) where they are made
(b) limited options wrt body woods/finishes, & black hardware
(c) the NYC bodies are now chambered, which reduces the weight a little bit.

They play, feel and sound much better than any Fender I've played in the past 30 years.

And nothing beats Roger's customer service and attention to detail.
 
ha...perfect. I hear ya man!

I agree 100%, in fact the opinions that I factor in from Talkbass are only of players I've seen/heard. If metalpunkbassist from south dakota tells me the new Warwick beats the pants off of every boutique, then sweet, rock on my brother. But if it's one of the players (like you Mike) who I've at least seen or heard samples from and have an idea what they sound like, I'll pay attention.

There's others who are the complete opposite, I really dig Joe Duran (narud's) playing but when he talks about which basses he prefers based on his setup and how they feel then I don't even pay attention because the dude makes Gary Willis seem conservative with his setup and technique. The gripes he has about low action and bridge spacing would register at about 0% on my radar for needs/wants. So IMO you gotta know where these guys are coming from before you put any weight behind their opinions, not just their talent as a player but their goals and personal preferences as well.

Yeah, at least you know what to expect going in.
It's the same reason we're made to disclose if we have any affiliation with any companies.
Me: Genz Benz, AccuGroove and indirectly- but directly- Valenti.
So, when discussion of cabs/amps/basses come up, you can at least know where I may be and judge my comments accordingly.

I've put together a number of "parts" basses (Warmoth etc..), but wouldn't attempt to have a deep conversation about assembling or building them on par with Nino one stinkin' bit.
Could I have an intelligent one and relate my experiences? Sure.
But I wouldn't talk like I had been doing it for as long as he.

I am picky enough to maybe get to a level to be respected as he I would hope- only the market would tell........ But at this point I wouldn't lay claim to being anything more than a chump with a soldering iron and a screwdriver!
Nino is the real deal. Knows wood. Knows construction. Knows fit/finish as good as anyone.

BTW- not getting into the bass business anytime soon!!!
You guys a BRUTAL!!!!;)
 

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