Would appreciate some input on how to count measures 7 and 11. The eighth note after "&" is throwing me off. I think it is on 3 but it doesn't seem right.
Thanks,
Jack
Thanks,
Jack
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How do I count these measures?
- Thread starter FenderB
- Start date
Play on the downbeat for beat 1, and the & for beats 2, 3, and 4.
Dots increase a note's duration by 50%. So a dotted quarter equals three eighths.
Ties connect two (or more) notes of the same pitch, to make them into one long note.
It is customary in standard notation to visually indicate the division halfway through the measure, between beats 2 and 3. That is why, in this example, the note on the & of 2 is written as two tied eighth notes, but the note on the & of 3 is written as a quarter note. They are written differently, but have the same duration. A little confusing, I know, but traditionally a lot of musicians find it easier to read that way.
Dots increase a note's duration by 50%. So a dotted quarter equals three eighths.
Ties connect two (or more) notes of the same pitch, to make them into one long note.
It is customary in standard notation to visually indicate the division halfway through the measure, between beats 2 and 3. That is why, in this example, the note on the & of 2 is written as two tied eighth notes, but the note on the & of 3 is written as a quarter note. They are written differently, but have the same duration. A little confusing, I know, but traditionally a lot of musicians find it easier to read that way.
So on #7 and 11 after the & of 2 (because of the dotted qtr.) the count is 3 - 4 - &? With the eighth note being 3, the quarter note 4 and the last eighth the & of 4?
There are no notes played on beats 3 or 4 in measures 7 and 11. Rather, the notes are played on the &. Do you have a recording of this song you can listen to to get the sound in your head?
If I'm not mistaken I believe the F, F# and G are played on the & of 2, 3 and 4 respectively.
edit: Which is the same thing that Mushroo said in his first post
edit: Which is the same thing that Mushroo said in his first post
Measure 11:
Counting eighths-
The dotted quarter note is three counts 1&2
The first eighth note is one count on the & of 2
the second eighth is one count on 3
The quarter note is two counts, the & of three plus 4
The last eighth note is one count on the & of four
X--XXX-X
1&2&3&4&
In measure 7, the second eighth note is tied to the first one, so is not played separately, it just extends the length of the first eighth note.
Counting eighths-
The dotted quarter note is three counts 1&2
The first eighth note is one count on the & of 2
the second eighth is one count on 3
The quarter note is two counts, the & of three plus 4
The last eighth note is one count on the & of four
X--XXX-X
1&2&3&4&
In measure 7, the second eighth note is tied to the first one, so is not played separately, it just extends the length of the first eighth note.
In measure 11, the second eighth note is on beat three.
Measure 7: ONE and two AND three AND four AND
Measure 11: ONE and two AND THREE AND four AND
So Febs is this what you are saying it should be counted as?
In measure 11 that's a quarter note, doesn't that have to be on 3, not &?
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Correct.
A quarter note can start on the downbeat as long as you count it's full value. So it can be on the downbeat (i.e., "3 and") or the upbeat (i.e., "and 3"). In fact, here's an example I just played a few minutes ago at the gig I'm playing tonight. These measures are counted ONE and two and three AND four AND. (I'm using capital letters to show where the note starts and underlining to show how long each note is held.)
So as I see this the first 1/4 note is counted as 1, the 1/4 rest is 2, the 1/8th rest is 3, the D# is & and the last 1/8th note is & also?
Hey Mushroo not to worry, I surprised myself by noticing it. What I find aggravating is I've been banging away on drums for a couple of years now and have no trouble counting as long as it's reasonably simple. What I can't figure out is why in measure 11 the 3 & aren't tied together with a bar like in measure 10.
You're getting the hang of it!
These rhythms are an example of "syncopation" which basically means rhythms that feel "off the beat" or "funky." Bootsy Collins gives a good demonstration of funky/syncopated rhythms in this video. The basic concept he is demonstrating, is first to set up a strong feel of "the one" (beat 1, the downbeat of the measure), and then you can emphasize the off-beats. Another way to feel it is, tap your foot on the beats, and play the bass in the spaces between your foot taps. Listening to this video, can you keep a steady 1-2-3-4 going with your foot, and play along (or clap your hands, snap your fingers, sing, etc.) along with his bass line?
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Ties can only be used to connect notes of the same pitch. In measure 7, the tie connects eighth note E# to eighth note E#, creating a quarter note E#. (But it is notated as tied eighth notes, because of tradition.) In measure 11 however, the notes are eighth note F# and eighth note G#, two different pitches, and so they cannot be tied together into a single quarter note. Does that make any sense?
You're getting the hang of it!
These rhythms are an example of "syncopation" which basically means rhythms that feel "off the beat" or "funky." Bootsy Collins gives a good demonstration of funky/syncopated rhythms in this video. The basic concept he is demonstrating, is first to set up a strong feel of "the one" (beat 1, the downbeat of the measure), and then you can emphasize the off-beats. Another way to feel it is, tap your foot on the beats, and play the bass in the spaces between your foot taps. Listening to this video, can you keep a steady 1-2-3-4 going with your foot, and play along (or clap your hands, snap your fingers, sing, etc.) along with his bass line?
Thanks Mushroo I'll have to take some time and listen to this.
Yes, thank you for explaining that to me.Ties can only be used to connect notes of the same pitch. In measure 7, the tie connects eighth note E# to eighth note E#, creating a quarter note E#. (But it is notated as tied eighth notes, because of tradition.) In measure 11 however, the notes are eighth note F# and eighth note G#, two different pitches, and so they cannot be tied together into a single quarter note. Does that make any sense?
