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Double Bass How to do better walking bass lines
- Thread starter sxwr
- Start date
Here's a good recent thread on the subject:
http://www.talkbass.com/threads/intro-to-walking-bass.1080715/
http://www.talkbass.com/threads/intro-to-walking-bass.1080715/
Yup, transcribe and listen to how the bass line interacts with the soloist and the rest of the band. Listen to how the bassline is it's own counter melody - how it phrases, builds, and responds. Rhythmic hits, repetitive phrases, outlines of chords, contour, etc.
It doesn't hurt to get a lesson from a pro.
- Dec 13, 1999
- 11,736
- 8,941
- 70
- Disclosures
- Chuck Sher publishes my book, WALKING BASSICS:The Fundamentals of Jazz Bass Playing.
I've got a couple of Sher books in my library and have learned a lot from them.
This one just went on the short list...
Why aren't you playing what you hear in recordings then? It is totally fine to "borrow" lines from the masters!
I've started doing that. I really like memorizing the lines in Ed Fuqua's book too. I found that it gives me more confidence that my "muscle memory" at least will play something nice, and also that they pretty quickly get metabolized by my brain into phrases and licks that better fit me and who I'm playing with.
Perhaps you could take some cues from the people you are playing with. They're not repetitive and dull . . . Look up! Listen up! If you're not worrying about "the right note" for a moment you might find some great ones.
Can't argue. Excellent book. Amazing when one considers the author!
When you look at transcriptions or examples in books like Ed's, make a note of the types of chord changes that are happening and how each walking example gets from one chord to the next.
For example, if you see a ii-V7, notice how they get from ii to V. Is it by scale degrees, or by chord notes, or chromatic? Is it ascending or descending? Once you see a pattern that works well for ii-V, add it to your practice routine. See another one, add it, too. If you find that you're always doing the same thing(s), then look for one that is more "interesting", perhaps because it has larger intervals, changes direction, uses a rhythmic variation, etc.
Do the same thing for other patterns that you run across, especially the ones where you feel you're stuck doing the same thing every time.
This IS copying from other players and processing the information in books like Ed's. For me, I find it helps me to retain the examples by framing them in terms of common changes.
For example, if you see a ii-V7, notice how they get from ii to V. Is it by scale degrees, or by chord notes, or chromatic? Is it ascending or descending? Once you see a pattern that works well for ii-V, add it to your practice routine. See another one, add it, too. If you find that you're always doing the same thing(s), then look for one that is more "interesting", perhaps because it has larger intervals, changes direction, uses a rhythmic variation, etc.
Do the same thing for other patterns that you run across, especially the ones where you feel you're stuck doing the same thing every time.
This IS copying from other players and processing the information in books like Ed's. For me, I find it helps me to retain the examples by framing them in terms of common changes.
- Jul 3, 2004
- 1,300
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- Disclosures
- Endorsing Artist: Ernie Ball MusicMan Guitars
Modern walking bass technique by mike richmond
I have Every book on walking bass- the first page of this book is one if the best examples I've ever read/heard/played.
Get it
Analyze it
Play it in all keys
I'm talking about the first 16 bars
It's that good
I have Every book on walking bass- the first page of this book is one if the best examples I've ever read/heard/played.
Get it
Analyze it
Play it in all keys
I'm talking about the first 16 bars
It's that good
Be systematic in your approach to practicing with regard to connecting chords in progressions. If you take a simple turnaround with a harmonic rhythm of two chords per bar:
//: C A7b9 / Dm7 G7 ://
Try using all chromatic approach notes from above (C-Bb-A-Eb-D-Ab-G-Db-C), then all chromatic approach notes from below (C-G#-A-C#-D-F#-G-B-C). This gives you two basic ways to approach a simple turnaround. Then if your understanding of the chords and the key allows it, play all upper diatonic approach notes (C-B-A-E-D-A-G-D-C), and lower diatonic approach notes (C-G-A-C#-D-F-G-B-C); noticing that between 40-50% of lower diatonic approach notes will also be chromatic. With just these few tools, you have access to a ton of variation possibilities, which can be thought of as permutations (UC=upper chromatic, LC=lower chromatic, UD=upper diatonic, LD =lower diatonic):
UC UC UC UC
UC LC UC LC
UC UC LC UC
UC UC LC LC
UC UC UC LC
UC LC UC UC
UC LC LC UC
UC LC LC LC
Then begin with the lower chromatics and respin:
LC LC LC LC
etc.
Do the same with the diatonic upper and lower notes. Then mix diatonic and chromatic. Then start systematically mixing in different octaves of the root notes. In this way, you can create a (practically unlimited) variety of slight variations on the same turnaround. While this is a practice technique only and I wouldn't recommend trying to think like this when actually playing lots of players I listen to seem to keep a vague tally of exact turnaround formulas they've already played in a tune and try to play variations in the moment. Lots of players I talk to in educational settings talk about doing this semi consciously while playing longer progressions so that they don't end up repeating their lines exactly on multiple passes through the same set of changes. In the end, great players are playing lines as spontaneous melody, but the technique of creating slight variations on the fly so as not to repeat yourself exactly is a positive step in the right direction toward that goal.
//: C A7b9 / Dm7 G7 ://
Try using all chromatic approach notes from above (C-Bb-A-Eb-D-Ab-G-Db-C), then all chromatic approach notes from below (C-G#-A-C#-D-F#-G-B-C). This gives you two basic ways to approach a simple turnaround. Then if your understanding of the chords and the key allows it, play all upper diatonic approach notes (C-B-A-E-D-A-G-D-C), and lower diatonic approach notes (C-G-A-C#-D-F-G-B-C); noticing that between 40-50% of lower diatonic approach notes will also be chromatic. With just these few tools, you have access to a ton of variation possibilities, which can be thought of as permutations (UC=upper chromatic, LC=lower chromatic, UD=upper diatonic, LD =lower diatonic):
UC UC UC UC
UC LC UC LC
UC UC LC UC
UC UC LC LC
UC UC UC LC
UC LC UC UC
UC LC LC UC
UC LC LC LC
Then begin with the lower chromatics and respin:
LC LC LC LC
etc.
Do the same with the diatonic upper and lower notes. Then mix diatonic and chromatic. Then start systematically mixing in different octaves of the root notes. In this way, you can create a (practically unlimited) variety of slight variations on the same turnaround. While this is a practice technique only and I wouldn't recommend trying to think like this when actually playing lots of players I listen to seem to keep a vague tally of exact turnaround formulas they've already played in a tune and try to play variations in the moment. Lots of players I talk to in educational settings talk about doing this semi consciously while playing longer progressions so that they don't end up repeating their lines exactly on multiple passes through the same set of changes. In the end, great players are playing lines as spontaneous melody, but the technique of creating slight variations on the fly so as not to repeat yourself exactly is a positive step in the right direction toward that goal.
+1 for Mike Richmond's "Modern Walking Bass Technique," which doesn't seem to get enough love from bass players. In addition to the wealth of examples of great walking bass lines, he really takes apart the techniques of adding accents, ghost notes, and triplets to walking bass lines that impart great swing and color to lines and raise the level of even ordinary note choices. This has helped my playing immeasurably. That and standing next to George Mraz for a week during one of Atilla Zoller's jazz camps in Putney, VT many years ago!
- Dec 13, 1999
- 11,736
- 8,941
- 70
- Disclosures
- Chuck Sher publishes my book, WALKING BASSICS:The Fundamentals of Jazz Bass Playing.
That's where we'll have to disagree; in my experience, if you can't make a line of just quarter notes swing, no amount of crap you add onto that is going to make it swing.
- Jul 3, 2004
- 1,300
- 641
- Disclosures
- Endorsing Artist: Ernie Ball MusicMan Guitars
Check the book- he takes amazingly crafted lines that swing
and adds rhythm to them. The book is not about crap filling- it's tasteful Musical lines that move the changes forward- with rhythmic aspects added later.
I got a lot from
1. listening to and playing along with a certain album (in my case pc in a garland of red) that I liked( over and over a million times), because Paul's lines are the real deal, no fluff!
2. transcribing the 'good bits',
3. playing with the nome and recording
Its still a work in progress, I learn a lot when I see and hear Neil Miner or Buster Williams or Shaun Smith etc etc.
I found my work now is to try to get deeper into the groove, time or whatever you call that which makes it swing.
1. listening to and playing along with a certain album (in my case pc in a garland of red) that I liked( over and over a million times), because Paul's lines are the real deal, no fluff!
2. transcribing the 'good bits',
3. playing with the nome and recording
Its still a work in progress, I learn a lot when I see and hear Neil Miner or Buster Williams or Shaun Smith etc etc.
I found my work now is to try to get deeper into the groove, time or whatever you call that which makes it swing.
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To that I would add that just making nothing but chord tones swing is pretty important too. Using chromatics or diatonics is almost secondary. The pulse needs to be evident regardless of what notes are played, even if it's just a pedal.
If you can't swing just a single note over 8 bars and focus on the rhythm and the pocket, that's something pretty huge to work on.
I am going to check out Ed's book listed above, it looks fantastic. Paul Wolf has a very good course on building walking bass lines. [Invalid or Expired Link Removed].
I agree with Ed; being able to make a line of quarter notes swing is a pre-requisite to using the more advanced rhythmic techniques Mike Richmond describes. This seems to me to be a difficult thing to teach; more about feel and groove, and best learned almost by osmosis through intense and prolonged exposure to examples of great players doing it. Playing a lot without a drummer also helps!
I have met teachers who I believe can teach their students to have better time, better swing, and better groove. A lot of is definitely listening, but I believe a knowledgeable teacher can speed the development.
