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Double Bass Hurt Feelings and a Kick in the Butt

Michael F Clef

Michael F Clef

Mar 23, 2017
276
313
Lower Hudson Valley, NY
#1
So: I played a gig with my New Orleans Band but with no drummer this time, we usually play with one in the ensemble. This was a 45 minute set for a charity event. Trumpet, Trombone, acoustic guitar, banjo guitar, and me on upright bass. After the set - which went well - it was opined by one of the players, and agreed by all, that, "Boy I miss not having a drummer."

I kept silent and was overwhelmed by the feeling that I was inept, that I didn't do my job as the bass player, that I didn't hold it together enough so that they didn't miss the drummer. As weak defense, it would be nice if the rhythm banjo guitar player give a little pump on 2 and 4, but he doesn't; he just sort of strums along.

I don't know. How do you keep it swinging in a 2 feel? Is there more I could have done? Am I copping out by pointing a finger at the strumming guitar player? Thoughts?
 
#2
Chances are you could have played the most perfect parts imaginable and they'd still say they missed the drummer. All it means is that they're used to hearing the drums.

That said, in that situation, I'd be careful to play, if anything, more simply than I would have with a drummer. Playing in 2/4 or 2/2 without a drummer, the best thing you can do is provide a steady pulse..
 
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#3
Transparency: Jazz isn't my primary genre, but what little old jazz I play has encouraged me to regularly follow a number of local old-jazz bands...

I can't judge the quality of you or your band, but I'm reminded of what one of my friends told me -- the drums are for the band, the bass is for the audience.

Meaning, whenever a band member has a question about tempo or where in the song they are, they listen to the drums, the de-facto metronome. The bass responsibility is to get the audience tapping their feet, figuratively or in reality.

I'd say if you got the audience tapping their feet, you did your job. The band member who spoke up was simply reflecting on how much the drums are needed if the rest of the band is used to them being there.

In my primary genre, bluegrass, where there are generally no drums, it's a slightly different story; the "metronome" responsibility is shared between the bass and a few other instruments, depending on who is and who isn't taking a break. But the bass still gets the feet tapping.
 
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#5
I played about twenty gigs over the last year with a pianist who often would tell me he wishes we could add a drummer and I didn’t understand his reasoning. However, I noticed very early that he doesn’t have the best time and was expecting me, and maybe a drummer, to make up for it. I eventually got frustrated and decided to move on because it just wasn’t fun. Everyone on the bandstand should have good time and not put the timekeeping role on the bassist or drummer. Be sure you have good time and make it feel good.
 
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#6
Michael F Clef said:
So: I played a gig with my New Orleans Band but with no drummer this time, we usually play with one in the ensemble. This was a 45 minute set for a charity event. Trumpet, Trombone, acoustic guitar, banjo guitar, and me on upright bass. After the set - which went well - it was opined by one of the players, and agreed by all, that, "Boy I miss not having a drummer."

I kept silent and was overwhelmed by the feeling that I was inept, that I didn't do my job as the bass player, that I didn't hold it together enough so that they didn't miss the drummer. As weak defense, it would be nice if the rhythm banjo guitar player give a little pump on 2 and 4, but he doesn't; he just sort of strums along.

I don't know. How do you keep it swinging in a 2 feel? Is there more I could have done? Am I copping out by pointing a finger at the strumming guitar player? Thoughts?
Click to expand...
It is very different playing rhythm without a drummer. I play regularly with one and without one, but they are completely different groups. If the band is accustomed to having a drummer, then sure, they'll miss the drummer. It's probably you and the drummer who keep the beat, while the guitar players have more freedom to noodle like the horn players. With no drummer, the three of you have to lock in with each other and hold steady. In one of my drumless ensembles, there are usually two or three guitars, but one of the guitarists is a more reliable rhythm player than the others. When he takes a solo, I feel a noticeable increase in my responsibility for keeping the band on track.
 
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#8
One of the fantastic advices from Thelonious Monk: Number one tip; ‘Just because you’re not a drummer, doesn’t mean you don’t have to keep time’.
That is advice given from a pianist to a trumpet player.
In this case I read that as ‘the bass player is not a surrogate metronome if the drummer is missing, and the drummer isn’t a surrogate metronome if they aren’t.’

Lots of folk struggle in their gigs if something they are used to is missing or different, even if visual cues are changed. Many people even position themselves in exactly the same spot relative to others on stage and don’t cope well with any change.

Sounds like it’s something the band would need to practice at, and rehearse if they feel it’s likely they’ll be drummer-less in future gigs.

Don’t sweat it - not your responsibility, you changed to try to help - that’s already a gold star!!
 
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#11
EdwardofHuncote said:
"A banjer ain't nuthin' butta' drum widda' neck on it."

~Guy who runs a store I do repair and setup work for.
Click to expand...
Exactly. That's it's purpose because New Orleans music is originally a street band without a sit-down drummer. In New Orleans music there could be a washboard player too. One thing in common with N.O. bands is the collective feel of the beat, more so than any other music this side of Balinese Ketjak.
A virtue of N.O. music is that you can take away any instrument (because you never know) and still make people dance. Premier New Orleans recreationists (this is the real stuff from the Living Legends) since 2009, is Tuba Skinny led by cornetist Shay Cohn (granddaughter of Al Cohn of Woody Herman's bands), singer & bass drum player is Erica Lewis. (she sits on it like they did when the band stops walking). And tuba is the N.O. bass instrument going back to the beginning) They made it to Newport Jazz!
 
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#14
Bass should keep time with or without a drummer, but it can't do all the things a drummer does. And it's not the only instrument with timekeeping responsibility. You had two other rhythm section players, ostensibly.

Missing the drummer isn't the same as not appreciating the bassist. Unless somebody said something about your playing, don't sweat it 👍
 
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#19
If you’re playing in two, and no one is hitting the two and four, then take charge and do it yourself. Pluck the string on one and three, and slap the strings against the neck on two and four. I’ve even had to do that in bossas, and 4/4 walking. It can be challenging and a little distracting, but if the band can’t hear where the beat is, sometimes you gotta do what you gotta do…
 
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