Inexpensive IEM systems

[s0c9]

The MiPro seems like an attractive item.
I’ve been using the Xvive U4 simply for its portably to throw in my gigbag vs. carrying a separate rack or case, but a 5.8 unit with digital clarity goes have my attention
I tried a phenix UHF unit, which worked well as a low cost unit but suffered from slightly blurry sound.

The only issue I see with the U4 is it’s 2.4G in a highly cluttered frequency range.
The Mipro units are 432Mhz+ and 5.8Ghz… minimal interference.. for now.

and..if you compare both to a Senn G4 or a Shure PSM1000… they ARE CHEAP!!

 

[Geri O]

I'm just tired of brand snobs.

Well, gee, I’m glad somebody said so. I guess I know I should stop participating then, right?

BTW, when I spent a lot of money on the Lectro and the Sennheiser several years ago, MiPro wasn’t around. So if not having a crystal ball to see future products in the pipeline makes me a brand snob, so be it.

I’m actually looking into a new MiPro IEM rig to replace my 6-year-old Sennheiser that’s still serving me well, but has many, many miles on it and I’m worrying about its dependability. But don’t let that stop from your point about brand snobs, by all means….

 

[s0c9]

BTW, when I spent a lot of money on the Lectro and the Sennheiser several years ago, MiPro wasn’t around. So if not having a crystal ball to see future products in the pipeline makes me a brand snob, so be it.

I’m actually looking into a new MiPro IEM rig to replace my 6-year-old Sennheiser that’s still serving me well, but has many, many miles on it and I’m worrying about its dependability.

I guess we should start a "brand snob" TB club?? LOL
I buy - usually after tons of research - the best product that meets my needs and available budget. But yeah, I too prefer reputable brands.. for longevity, reliability, customer service and so on!

In the case of my IEM systems, that has been a SLOW progression from wired (using a variety of universal buds) to wireless (Carvin, Shure, Senn and Mipro) and somewhere in the wireless stage going to custom IEM's (1964Ears/64Audio) as universals did not work for me!

I too had my Senn G3 for ~6yrs. I noticed a while back that certain venues (even w/ frequency scans) were giving my IEM's the usual "uh-oh" artifacts (dropout, interference, noise).

I started some research on a replacement /upgrade. Came up with the Mipro and newer G4.
No brainer. Specs and price go to the Mipro - other than the limiter, which I have covered on my console!

I [also] considered the Mipro 5.8G model, but I would have had to buy extra batteries and the dual charger - as failsafe's/backups - which would have upped the price to near the MI909.
Since I already had a plethora of EBL AA rechargeable's for the G3 that factored into my decision.

I got the Mipro from Mike. No affiliation other than being a satisfied customer
Mipro MI-58 5.8Ghz

In summary - why spend $1200 on a new G4 - when I can save $450 and buy other "stuff"!

 

[steve_rolfeca]

There can be a lot more to preferring high-end gear than brand snobbery.

I went from full-time musician to part-time semi-pro shortly after college. As a result, I've rarely been in a position to justify purchasing brand-new pro-level gear, but there have been a number of times where I jumped on a steal deal on older pieces.

Nobody has a crystal ball. Still, at this point in my life (67 years old, 50-odd years of that involved in live music), I do have the benefit of perspective. Looking back, some of the best investments I've ever made were in serious pro gear that I picked up after the new wore off

I'm downsizing these days, so most of my old fossils have moved on. Still, I know where most of that stuff went, and it's almost all still in use despite being obsolete.

I can't say the same for consumer-grade stuff I've purchased over the years- particularly since the transition to digital and surface-mount micro components.

This is one of the reasons I hesitated on picking up the Mi-Pro. Although the gear appears to be great, there isn't much of a distribution network or a track record for it in North America.

If I was running a rental company and the math on amortization looked good, I'd probably be all over it. But for a single user with a limited budget, a used Sennheiser rig is still tempting. The performance isn't as good, but they a great service network, lots of technical support, and the sort of brand recognition that keeps used prices hight and guarantees a healthy market for used pieces.

 

[Geri O]

I guess we should start a "brand snob" TB club?? LOL
I buy - usually after tons of research - the best product that meets my needs and available budget. But yeah, I too prefer reputable brands.. for longevity, reliability, customer service and so on!

In the case of my IEM systems, that has been a SLOW progression from wired (using a variety of universal buds) to wireless (Carvin, Shure, Senn and Mipro) and somewhere in the wireless stage going to custom IEM's (1964Ears/64Audio) as universals did not work for me!

I too had my Senn G3 for ~6yrs. I noticed a while back that certain venues (even w/ frequency scans) were giving my IEM's the usual "uh-oh" artifacts (dropout, interference, noise).

I started some research on a replacement /upgrade. Came up with the Mipro and newer G4.
No brainer. Specs and price go to the Mipro - other than the limiter, which I have covered on my console!

I [also] considered the Mipro 5.8G model, but I would have had to buy extra batteries and the dual charger - as failsafe's/backups - which would have upped the price to near the MI909.
Since I already had a plethora of EBL AA rechargeable's for the G3 that factored into my decision.

I got the Mipro from Mike. No affiliation other than being a satisfied customer
Mipro MI-58 5.8Ghz

In summary - why spend $1200 on a new G4 - when I can save $450 and buy other "stuff"!

And I also go by recommendations by folks I know that I can count on to relay a positive experience such as yours. If the MiPro is serving you well, it’s definitely up front on my radar to check out. I’ll let you know when I get it and may have some setup questions.

Thanx, Steve!

(P.S…..”Mike”?

 

[s0c9]

And I also go by recommendations by folks I know that I can count on to relay a positive experience such as yours. If the MiPro is serving you well, it’s definitely up front on my radar to check out. I’ll let you know when I get it and may have some setup questions.

Thanx, Steve!

(P.S…..”Mike”?

PM'd!!

 

[s0c9]

If I was running a rental company and the math on amortization looked good, I'd probably be all over it. But for a single user with a limited budget, a used Sennheiser rig is still tempting. The performance isn't as good, but they a great service network, lots of technical support, and the sort of brand recognition that keeps used prices hight and guarantees a healthy market for used pieces.

All very true. All good. I'm a solo user who's not gigging as much due to the "Rona" so $$$ is a major factor now.
But I guess the above is the risk one takes with "newer" brands -even with a great overseas reputation!
FWIW - I'd be well on the way to the price of a 2nd Mi-909 with what I saved over the G4.
And also.. I would NEVER consider the entry level stuff from Nady, etc.
My top choices would be Senn, Shure, Mipro.

 

[mike o]

Maybe I’m confused. Isn’t the tread titled inexpensive IEM? I’m sure later dialogue is good equipment but most of us wouldn’t consider $ 600.00 inexpensive. Maybe a very good value but not inexpensive.

 

[Geri O]

Maybe I’m confused. Isn’t the tread titled inexpensive IEM? I’m sure later dialogue is good equipment but most of us wouldn’t consider $ 600.00 inexpensive. Maybe a very good value but not inexpensive.

That is indeed the title and it was a genuine inquiry from me about advising some local friends on the purchase of an inexpensive IEM system, except that the band blew up very shortly after my initial inquiry.

And, yes, there’s been considerable topic drift happening as the thread progressed.

It happens….

 

[EdO.]

I [also] considered the Mipro 5.8G model, but I would have had to buy extra batteries and the dual charger - as failsafe's/backups - which would have upped the price to near the MI909.
Since I already had a plethora of EBL AA rechargeable's for the G3 that factored into my decision.

Mine came in a nice hard case with the charger included, added a second battery for $9. I switch between batteries every use to (hopefully) extend the service life of the two and the batteries are readily found with a quick web search if you ever need another one. Not an issue AFAIC.

 

[steve_rolfeca]

Maybe I’m confused. Isn’t the tread titled inexpensive IEM? I’m sure later dialogue is good equipment but most of us wouldn’t consider $ 600.00 inexpensive. Maybe a very good value but not inexpensive.

We're all spoiled by the affordability of stable, reliable digital instrument transmitters.

The transmit side (instrument to FOH) is very well-served, with all kinds of great options. Some of the cheap wireless guitar transmitters you can get off Amazon are good enough for semi-pro stage use in some venues.

Unfortunately, there's far less choice in the receive direction (FOH to your IEM's):

• Cheap analog wireless IEM packs from off-brand suppliers don't have the rock-solid signal quality you can expect from cheap 2.4GHZ digital instrument transmitters.
• The cheap analog stuff doesn't come close to good analog wireless IEM solutions from Shure, Senheiser. Unfortunately, the buy-in for good analog wireless is quite expensive.
• At the moment, affordable digital, low-latency IEM packs are very hard to find. Aside from the high-end stuff that others mentioned, MiPro is pretty much alone in the market at the moment.
• At least IMO, Shure's low-end digital IEM rig doesn't offer the same level of performance as the MiPro, yet it's getting into Sennheiser territory price-wise.

 

[TelosHedge]

I will revive this thread for anybody who may have gone deeper into the topic of the MiPro units.

I have had 1 for a couple of years with super excellent results. As my bands have evolved, we've picked up more and more wireless setups one at a time and have run into frequency band incompatibilities and other related issues. It's been rough, but a blessing, as it pushed me to learn more about RF coordination and how to avoid problems before they happen.

I have just recently added 3 more MiPro units to our rack setup to eliminate our other units. The results so far are very promising. We currently run 10 wireless systems in both directions on stage and while I still have a bit of noodling to do, things are running extremely smoothly in harsh environments.

That being said, does anyone on this forum have both a few of these MiPro units, and a deeper knowledge of Wireless Workbench? I have been tweaking equipment profiles manually but I am on the fringe of being in over my head, and want to make sure I have the process correct.

 

[s0c9]

I will revive this thread for anybody who may have gone deeper into the topic of the MiPro units.

I have had 1 for a couple of years with super excellent results. As my bands have evolved, we've picked up more and more wireless setups one at a time and have run into frequency band incompatibilities and other related issues. It's been rough, but a blessing, as it pushed me to learn more about RF coordination and how to avoid problems before they happen.

I have just recently added 3 more MiPro units to our rack setup to eliminate our other units. The results so far are very promising. We currently run 10 wireless systems in both directions on stage and while I still have a bit of noodling to do, things are running extremely smoothly in harsh environments.

That being said, does anyone on this forum have both a few of these MiPro units, and a deeper knowledge of Wireless Workbench? I have been tweaking equipment profiles manually but I am on the fringe of being in over my head, and want to make sure I have the process correct.

It's not clear to me that what you are asking is specific to Mipro units or RF Coordination in general.

I'm NOT close to being an RF expert, but have installed [and configured/run] a few systems at local churches and manage my those in my band. I have the Workbench but only used it to update firmware on my G3.

2 things come to mind.. While not specifically applicable to the 909's
1. If you have x nbr of [909] transmitters, take their available bandwidth 5E (483 ~ 542Mhz) or 5F (540 ~ 604Mhz), divide by x and manually set each one to make them equidistant on the spectrum. EG: 64/5 = 12.8 MHz. So set 1st at 483 MHz, 2nd at 498.8 MHz, and so on.
2. Do the same for any wireless mics you are using.

If there are more than 5 devices one should probably invest in an external splitter/combiner + antennas (extra $$) - one for inbound, one for out! - as having all those antenna's on individual units will cause problems.

With all of this.. make sure you check that the freq ranges on your devices are the "best" (most open channels) for your zip/area - FCC keeps track - see links in the doc in my sig on how to do that. If you don't pick the correct range, you WILL get the usual dropouts, interference etc. and it has NOTHING to do w/ the devices, it will be interference from [usually TV] systems operating in the same freq ranges!

I installed 16 devices at a church. 8 wireless mics, 8 IEM transmitters. All housed in same rack. 4 combiner/splitters in rack with 4 paddle antennas. I did NOT order them.
Simple setup. 4 receivers -> combiner -> Antenna and 4 xmitters -> splitter -> antenna!
I then set each unit to a specific frequency - only this time dividing by 16 and keeping xmit and recv freq's as far apart as possible.

That's probably NOT how RF coordinators with large concert events do it.. but it's worked for me [local guy] so far!

 

[TelosHedge]

Thank you for your reply, but I am specifically looking for someone who has a deeper knowledge of how these particular units operate within their spectrum.

First of all, I was not aware that Shure's WWB utility was capable of upgrading Sennheiser's firmware - that's quite useful!

My main question is learning the fundamentals when it comes to intermods produced by 'digital'/non companded signals that these 909s produce. The intermods produced are quite different than their 'analog' cousins. What I'm looking for is someone willing to show me how they approach building custom equipment profiles for units like this, as specs like front end filter type and range are not provided by MiPro.

If anyone out there has to coordinate these on the regular please let me know!

 

[s0c9]

Thank you for your reply, but I am specifically looking for someone who has a deeper knowledge of how these particular units operate within their spectrum.

First of all, I was not aware that Shure's WWB utility was capable of upgrading Sennheiser's firmware - that's quite useful!

My main question is learning the fundamentals when it comes to intermods produced by 'digital'/non companded signals that these 909s produce. The intermods produced are quite different than their 'analog' cousins. What I'm looking for is someone willing to show me how they approach building custom equipment profiles for units like this, as specs like front end filter type and range are not provided by MiPro.

If anyone out there has to coordinate these on the regular please let me know!

Reach out to Mike Volkerding at ineargear, he can probably help you.

MIPRO MI909 MI-909 Wireless In Ear Monitor System

and Senn also has a WWB equivalent.. that’s the one I was referring to.

 

[TelosHedge]

I know Mike well - where do you think all this gear came from?

I will give him a shout, but I'm not sure these are numbers he'll have off the top of his head. Can't hurt though.

 

[s0c9]

I know Mike well - where do you think all this gear came from?

I will give him a shout, but I'm not sure these are numbers he'll have off the top of his head. Can't hurt though.

Got mine there too! Lol