Interesting article on Premier Guitar - Carol Kaye

[king_biscuit]

The last thing I'm gonna do is mention the names of prominent musicians I've had conversations with pertaining to Carol Kaye...but you can trust me I have...I'd be as nutty as her if I did.

BTW...This ENTIRE deal with CK claiming to have played on 60's Motown hits like Bernadette and IWMTLH is as absurd as claiming that the Cadillac parked outside was built at a Chrysler plant. Enjoy the Kool Aid...Lol

Whether CK or Jamerson played Made to Love Her is a fact, that is neither proved no disproved by the so call witness accounts. I know there is an isolated bass track out there, and if you are as important as you make out, I'll bet you have access to it. Produce it and let us use our ears!

The rest of your statements about CK are just your opinions.

 

[TNCreature]

SoCal do you really represent any musicians interests? Do they know how angry and xxxxx (had to edit myself) you sound on their behalf?
One thing I miss about the older generation is a sense of respect and class. What is the point of all this??? It has nothing to do with the op and it serves no purpose.
Go start your own thread or club or VoIP of bitter curmudgeons. Sheesh.

 

[SoCal1]

Whether CK or Jamerson played Made to Love Her is a fact, that is neither proved no disproved by the so call witness accounts. I know there is an isolated bass track out there, and if you are as important as you make out, I'll bet you have access to it. Produce it and let us use our ears!

The rest of your statements about CK are just your opinions.

No...it's fact. I've spoken with several Funk Brothers (who DID play on those tracks) about this and the mixed down version I'm talking about is on the Grammy winning soundtrack of Standing In The Shadows Of Motown (track 5 I believe). Gotto go...tired of arguing with stubborn uninformed idiots.

 

[SoCal1]

SoCal do you really represent any musicians interests? Do they know how angry and xxxxx (had to edit myself) you sound on their behalf?
One thing I miss about the older generation is a sense of respect and class. What is the point of all this??? It has nothing to do with the op and it serves no purpose.
Go start your own thread or club or VoIP of bitter curmudgeons. Sheesh.

So I imagine the individual who lied and claimed credit for work they never performed is the one with "class"...rite...

 

[Rickengeezer]

I don't care what any of the witnesses say, the track (Made to Love Her) speaks for itself. An isolated bass would help to clear this up as it should be obvious whether the line was played with fingers or a pick.

There is an isolated bass track on CK's website, judge for yourself:

http://www.carolkaye.com/www/library/sounds/bass_only/i_was_made_to_love_her.wav

It may or may not be the track included on the version that the so-called So Cal is referring to, but sounds like her to me.

 

[king_biscuit]

No...it's fact. I've spoken with several Funk Brothers (who DID play on those tracks) about this and the mixed down version I'm talking about is on the Grammy winning soundtrack of Standing In The Shadows Of Motown (track 5 I believe). Gotto go...tired of arguing with stubborn uninformed idiots.

I'm pretty sure calling TB members names is a "bannable" offense. Now, we have CK's statement that she played on Made to Love Her, we apparently have the claims of a few Funk brothers that she didn't. Those are not facts, but rather proof that tends to prove or disprove an alleged fact. The track itself is the only objective physical evidence we have.

 

[mcm]

Gimme some cliff Williams!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[SoCal1]

Right...Carol sat in a studio in L.A. while the rest of the Funk Brothers sat in the snakepit in Detroit playing that song. She must have had one hell of an amp...Like. B-3000 miles.

 

[king_biscuit]

Right...Carol sat in a studio in L.A. while the rest of the Funk Brothers sat in the snakepit in Detroit playing that song. She must have had one hell of an amp...Like. B-3000 miles.

You don't know any of that, you only know what a few people have said, and you have made a choice to believe the evidence that supports your opinion. If someone chooses to believe Carol, than their "proof" is just as valid as yours. Again, the track is the only objective evidence we have.

 

[SoCal1]

You don't know any of that, you only know what a few people have said, and you have made a choice to believe the evidence that supports your opinion. If someone chooses to believe Carol, than their "proof" is just as valid as yours. Again, the track is the only objective evidence we have.

No...The Funk Brothers like Jack Ashford who played the session and Stevie Wonder whose song it was know better. Bernadette...practically every Funk Brother alive when these absurd claims were made contradicted her. If you can't recognize Earl VanDykes "gorilla" keyboard style or Joe Messinas sustained tremelo's alone then you know nothing about Motown. Can CK quote just ONE. Los Angeles musician who claims to have played on either of those tracks? I'll answer for her...NO. Quite honestly, and no offense intended...this has to be the stupidest music discusion I've ever had.

 

[NWB]

Oh yeah, Claypool is such an innovator. Heard any of this, recorded in late 1971, 18 years before "Suck on This"?


Ever heard Claypool give any credit to Colin Hodkinson? Hodkkinson not only innovated the style, he does it better than Claypool ever dreamed of. Just IMO, so don't get excited.
Sorry, WAY off topic, but it (frizzle) fries me when Claypool is hailed as an "innovator". Nothing wrong with "borrowing" from someone else's style, but a little acknowledgment would be nice. But I guess that'd confuse the people who are re-writing history.
(BTW, check out The Residents' EP's "Duck Stab" and "Buster and Glen", also from the early/mid 70's, to find out where Les got his "innovative" vocal style.)

Wow. Colin Hodkinson.

Never heard of the guy until now. What a monster player!

Thanks for sharing that FT.

 

[smcfarland1337]

I'm not getting into this, but lordy, SoCal you sound about as angry and grumpy as CK herself.

 

[eddododo]

Be as "politically correct" as you wish, but it's Carol Kaye herself who touted the fact that she used to show up for sessions in miniskirts, and the most famous picture of her is the one where she's wearing a miniskirt, white go-go boots and glasses while playing her instrument...but if you want to see me puke, keep up the phony PC.

Mother****er, the point is that you focused on it, not whether or not she wore one

I would tend to think someone from socal wouldn't be so... Eh ill leave this alone

 

[SoCal1]

Mother****er, the point is that you focused on it, not whether or not she wore one

I would tend to think someone from socal wouldn't be so... Eh ill leave this alone

Please do. I admit that it's not the first miniskirt I've ever focused on. Oops...sorry if I offended your distorted and completely phony sense of "decency"...Ms Kaye would likely be pleased I noticed!

 

[SoCal1]

I'm not getting into this, but lordy, SoCal you sound about as angry and grumpy as CK herself.

Actually I end up laughing at these discussions when I tell real musicians who know better about them. It's just incredulous that people who obviously know no beter take the word of someone who has been proven wrong and disputed in no uncertain terms by the musicians who were actually there when these tracks were cut, and those claims have been corroborated by absolutely NO ONE. That's the really laughable part whenever this womans name is mentioned to those who actually know the truth.

 

[dmrogers]

I love how the truth in history reveals itself. People really should do their homework before putting players on a god like pedestal.

A generous spot. You think Carole cares about you reorganizing a list to fit her? Whether Carol is at the bottom or the top of your list, she does belong on the list. I think Jamaaladeen Tacuma should be on the list, is he?.



I have had many conversation with Carol over the years and she has always spoken positive of Jamerson, always and she had a lot of respect for him. What would your thoughts on Carol be if she said that she played on tracks that Motown bassist Tony Newton played on?

And for the record I have the highest respect for Jamerson and his contribution and I have the same for Carole. Her gift and contribution should not be swept under a rug, it would be impossible to do so any way no matter how hard one may try.


Exactly.

Thank you Mr. JAUQO, well said!

 

[JimmyM]

Actually I end up laughing at these discussions when I tell real musicians who know better about them. It's just incredulous that people who obviously know no beter take the word of someone who has been proven wrong and disputed in no uncertain terms by the musicians who were actually there when these tracks were cut, and those claims have been corroborated by absolutely NO ONE. That's the really laughable part whenever this womans name is mentioned to those who actually know the truth.

I thought you were done arguing with "idiots." Don't ragequit then not even quit. Besides, it was 20 years ago when this BS with the Motown stuff happened, and like I said a million times, nobody really cares anymore. If she didn't play them, she didn't play them, but there is plenty of stuff that she clearly played, and she will be remembered for it way longer than you will.

 

[JAUQO III-X]

Thank you Mr. JAUQO, well said!

You're welcome.

 

[king_biscuit]

I thought you were done arguing with "idiots." Don't ragequit then not even quit. Besides, it was 20 years ago when this BS with the Motown stuff happened, and like I said a million times, nobody really cares anymore. If she didn't play them, she didn't play them, but there is plenty of stuff that she clearly played, and she will be remembered for it way longer than you will.

+1, nobody really cares about any of this, except to discuss it in a bass forum! Ragequit LOL!

 

[SoCal1]

And hopefully anyone in this conversation will recognise the fact that I have mentioned in virtually every post that Ms Kaye is indeed a fine musical technician with a terrific resume. Buddy Rich, perhaps the greatest drummer of all time was also known to be perhaps the biggest jerk of all time in music, treating virtually everyone like crap. Those are not mutually exclusive concepts...I can honor someones musical ability and still recognise them for what they are once the music stops.