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Is it really THAT SERIOUS??????
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I was involved with a lot of competitive activities growing up. With my competitive soccer team, it was expected that players would be at every single game. Miss more than two games and you were booted from the team. It seemed harsh to some parents, but you can't expect a team to win when kids are missing both practices and games left and right for other things.
Likewise with band in high school, we were super competitive and did a lot of competitions with our marching group. With marching, you can't have people missing practices or competitions because that means you'll have holes in your show. It looks bad, and it can cost your band dearly on a competition.
You can ask whether it's a serious issue or not, and largely it depends on the band in question. Like with sports teams, you can have a recreational, weekend warrior type band, or you can be competitive and try to make your band into something more than a simple bar group. Both are valid options and just depend on the wants of their members. The trick is finding players who all have the same mindset and (more importantly IMHO) know when they're priorities change so that they can move on from a team or band when it no longer aligns with their wants.
Likewise with band in high school, we were super competitive and did a lot of competitions with our marching group. With marching, you can't have people missing practices or competitions because that means you'll have holes in your show. It looks bad, and it can cost your band dearly on a competition.
You can ask whether it's a serious issue or not, and largely it depends on the band in question. Like with sports teams, you can have a recreational, weekend warrior type band, or you can be competitive and try to make your band into something more than a simple bar group. Both are valid options and just depend on the wants of their members. The trick is finding players who all have the same mindset and (more importantly IMHO) know when they're priorities change so that they can move on from a team or band when it no longer aligns with their wants.
- Oct 7, 2000
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- Endorsing artist: Musicman basses
This has more to do with lateness than not showing up, but one of the best things I learned in college was in an acting class.
Teacher told us the first day that one of the most important things we need to learn if we expect to be successful in the entertainment industry, is to show up, and show up on time. 2 (might have been 3) absences from that class and you failed, and if you were late she wouldn't let you in. She said if it were an important audition and you were 5 minutes late, more often than not you would lose the gig. Excuses don't matter. Stuff happens, but what's important is that you're there. And if you make whatever you're doing important enought - you will be there. On time. The class shuddered everytime she wouldn't let someone who was 2 minutes late into the class, but she stuck by her word. It was kinda freaky actually, but it really drove the message home.
I'm teaching nightschool to troubled kids right now, and I try to teach the same. There is always someone that argues that there are things that can't be helped. It's really hard, if not impossible, to always be on time. I ask them if I had $20,000 cash sitting here for every time they show up a minute before 6PM, if they think they'd be there a minute to every single day of class. I absolutely guarantee they would.
I think showing up, and being on time is a great habit to develop.
Teacher told us the first day that one of the most important things we need to learn if we expect to be successful in the entertainment industry, is to show up, and show up on time. 2 (might have been 3) absences from that class and you failed, and if you were late she wouldn't let you in. She said if it were an important audition and you were 5 minutes late, more often than not you would lose the gig. Excuses don't matter. Stuff happens, but what's important is that you're there. And if you make whatever you're doing important enought - you will be there. On time. The class shuddered everytime she wouldn't let someone who was 2 minutes late into the class, but she stuck by her word. It was kinda freaky actually, but it really drove the message home.
I'm teaching nightschool to troubled kids right now, and I try to teach the same. There is always someone that argues that there are things that can't be helped. It's really hard, if not impossible, to always be on time. I ask them if I had $20,000 cash sitting here for every time they show up a minute before 6PM, if they think they'd be there a minute to every single day of class. I absolutely guarantee they would.
I think showing up, and being on time is a great habit to develop.
Maybe things have changed enough in the music business where weekend warrior bar bands aren't expected to be so good anymore. I see lots of bands where people can barely play, and aren't tight as group at all. Sometimes we blame club owners for hiring these bands, but if that is all that is expected who can blame them.
When I started going to clubs in the late 70's, it seemed that the bands were awesome. Playing covers or originals they were filled with great musicians. Maybe I was lucky and only went to good clubs, but to play a weekend at any decent club, you had to be really good. Maybe my ear is more discerning and that makes me judge things more harshly, but I have recordings of some of the first bands I went to see, and they still sound very professional.
When I started playing in clubs myself, I was a bit embarrassed that we weren't as good as the bands I saw when I was younger. Eventually we got better, but still it seemed like the standards had been lowered. Now I go to see bands that hardly measure up to the high school talent show bands I remember seeing as a kid. It sounds like the guys haven't dedicated themselves to music. But people dance and have a good time anyway. It's almost like these days I am surprised if I see a good band at the club level.
When I started going to clubs in the late 70's, it seemed that the bands were awesome. Playing covers or originals they were filled with great musicians. Maybe I was lucky and only went to good clubs, but to play a weekend at any decent club, you had to be really good. Maybe my ear is more discerning and that makes me judge things more harshly, but I have recordings of some of the first bands I went to see, and they still sound very professional.
When I started playing in clubs myself, I was a bit embarrassed that we weren't as good as the bands I saw when I was younger. Eventually we got better, but still it seemed like the standards had been lowered. Now I go to see bands that hardly measure up to the high school talent show bands I remember seeing as a kid. It sounds like the guys haven't dedicated themselves to music. But people dance and have a good time anyway. It's almost like these days I am surprised if I see a good band at the club level.
Let's see. When the band was playing 6 nights a week, I didn't miss a gig. Casuals? Didn't miss a gig. I go to work when I'd rather not, because I made a commitment to be there. I don't cheat on my wife, because I made a commitment. If I'm not there, the people who know me know there's a real good reason.
I think that it is commendable to have total dedication to your bandmates. I have also strived to be a good band member, but I have also missed gigs. Missed one once because I was so ill with food poisoning that I could not even stand up. I also missed a gig because of the opportunity to see an artist in concert that I have wanted to see live my entire life. I gave my band 2 months notice that I would not be at the gig. I tried to find a suitable replacement, but I knew that because of our songlist it would be nearly impossible - and it was. I even found a replacement gig to book so that they could cancel the conflicted date. They ended up playing the gig anyways, and from what I heard it was a train-wreck. I was sorry, but given the same situation I would do it again. As a previous poster stated - life sometimes trumps band !! I did however stay busy for over 10 years playing strictly as a sub, working about 7 - 10 gigs a year. I did not want to play any more than that - so I do see two sides to this coin.
In all honesty, the average club-goer here in ATL just doesn't care what you play. They are too busy texting on their ipad/iphone and trying to talk to a girl or the waitress.
Sad but true. I think "live" music is dying, particularly cover bands in the ATL, it just isn't appreciated very much here.
And my band is not half bad, we play respectable sounding music well.
There just seems to be a huge disconnect, guess we may be playing the wrong places??
Sad but true. I think "live" music is dying, particularly cover bands in the ATL, it just isn't appreciated very much here.
And my band is not half bad, we play respectable sounding music well.
There just seems to be a huge disconnect, guess we may be playing the wrong places??
Everyone is replaceable. If you're in an active band, then you have multiple subs for every position. People are going to miss gigs......and it's not the end of the world if you have a plan in place. Got a song where you need the sick singer to play the harp? Skip it and play something else. 12 string?......nobody wants to hear that anyway. 
This. Yes, sometimes life happens, but for the most part, there is no excuse to miss a gig. One band I work with, the lead singer won't agree to working more than two weekends per month, and misses five or six gigs per year anyway. This is unacceptable, IMO. You want nights off? Don't join a working band. It really is that simple.
I have never missed a gig. EVER. I have played with broken fingers, broken toes, sprained knees, etc. I have played when ill. You don't flake out on your bandmates, period.
A dose of reality serves to put things into perspective. I have played a lot of gigs with my band of the past 3 years. But reality happens and sometimes a gig has to get cancelled.
A band member gets hurt and can't play the gig? Let alone get in the car for the 5 hour trip to one gig, and then another 4 hours to the next? Guess what? Two gigs cancelled. If someone can barely even stand and needs prescription meds in order to not be in excruciating pain because of that injury, you cancel the gig and make it up at a later date. Some bookers are cool, others are not.
A medical emergency in the family? And it's a life threatening situation? You go to be with that family member and cancel the gig. Deal with the bookers and bandmates later, because an emergency like that requires your presence.
And then there's my own circumstances. My personal life has changed tremendously. My wife and I have a new baby, and our day jobs and childcare needed to become a priority. My own free time practically vanished, and scheduling rehearsals along with gigs became next to impossible. I made a very tough decision and had to quit, and told my band last week. In that case it's because my own personal responsibilities merited my time and presence elsewhere. Did the financial end of things factor into this? Sure. If the band was paying comparably or better than the day job, then things might be different. It was my own responsibility to step up and say "I can't do this anymore, you need to find someone who can commit the time you need".
Now have I dealt with more frivolous bandmates? Absolutely. Guys who would constantly be late, or even no-shows. Eventually it became apparent that they were d**ches who had no sense of consideration for the other people in the band. Those are the types of people who are less deserving of your understanding. And they're the ones who you should probably bounce out of a band.
A band member gets hurt and can't play the gig? Let alone get in the car for the 5 hour trip to one gig, and then another 4 hours to the next? Guess what? Two gigs cancelled. If someone can barely even stand and needs prescription meds in order to not be in excruciating pain because of that injury, you cancel the gig and make it up at a later date. Some bookers are cool, others are not.
A medical emergency in the family? And it's a life threatening situation? You go to be with that family member and cancel the gig. Deal with the bookers and bandmates later, because an emergency like that requires your presence.
And then there's my own circumstances. My personal life has changed tremendously. My wife and I have a new baby, and our day jobs and childcare needed to become a priority. My own free time practically vanished, and scheduling rehearsals along with gigs became next to impossible. I made a very tough decision and had to quit, and told my band last week. In that case it's because my own personal responsibilities merited my time and presence elsewhere. Did the financial end of things factor into this? Sure. If the band was paying comparably or better than the day job, then things might be different. It was my own responsibility to step up and say "I can't do this anymore, you need to find someone who can commit the time you need".
Now have I dealt with more frivolous bandmates? Absolutely. Guys who would constantly be late, or even no-shows. Eventually it became apparent that they were d**ches who had no sense of consideration for the other people in the band. Those are the types of people who are less deserving of your understanding. And they're the ones who you should probably bounce out of a band.
Expecting all 19 members of my band to make every gig would be comical. The local symphony has it written into their contract how many gigs they have to play, and how many they can sub out.
- Oct 18, 2012
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I have never missed a gig either. About 10 years ago, I attended my brother's wedding, drove 2 1/2 hours to a gig, finished at 12:30 AM, drove back 2 1/2 hours so I would be at the hotel in the morning to have breakfast with the wedding party at 7 AM and then drove 2 1/2 hours back to the venue because we were playing that afternoon.
We schedule around family obligations but once a gig is scheduled, everyone is expected to be there unless there is a family emergency such as a death or illness.
You are either committed or you're not.
It's the difference between being a professional or an amateur.
My marching band in high school had over 400 members (counting pit, guard, and drumline), and everyone would make it to our shows.
Not trying to compare e-penises, but I will say that it is very feasible to get 19 people together for a gig. It might be a hair more difficult considering adult responsibilities vs the responsibilities of high school kids, but we're still talking over 400 people.
butchblack
Life is short. Do good. Find and do what you love.
I agree with the OP for the most part. It gets tricky if you're an all originals band. Subs, especially on short notice. probably won't work. In those cases it should be something major to cancel on short notice. A list of "friendly bands" to cover a gig is a good idea.
I play in a blues & bluesy rock band. We have people who can cover when needed. Common courtesy is you don't cancel the day of the gig because your S.O. want to watch DWTS with you, or something similar.
The main point of the OP is well taken. We take ourselves too seriously at times.
Of course, the higher up the success ladder you are the more serious the reason needs to be to miss a gig. Most of us are low enough that it's no big deal.
I play in a blues & bluesy rock band. We have people who can cover when needed. Common courtesy is you don't cancel the day of the gig because your S.O. want to watch DWTS with you, or something similar.
The main point of the OP is well taken. We take ourselves too seriously at times.
Of course, the higher up the success ladder you are the more serious the reason needs to be to miss a gig. Most of us are low enough that it's no big deal.
Myself I never missed a gig, worst thing was playing a set that involved a bunch of chili peppers covers with a taped up dislocated right thumb. 'Bout 5 shots of brandy with a couple of beer chasers numbed it up just fine and I was able to get slap happy. Felt it the day after though YOUCH!!!
Feasible, yes. Anything is possible. Desirable, no. Many of the players in the band, in addition to adult responsibilities, also belong to other bands. If we demanded 100% attendance, we would have to settle for less talented players and/or play less challenging material. In fact I'm not sure that anybody would sign up. As a rule, I don't commit to bands that can't handle subs.
The bands that we "cover" or aspire to emulate all dealt with subs as a normal part of being working musicians. In fact I've got a sub for this month's gig. The challenge for me is that the bassists who can even play the material are all in constant demand.
If absolute 100% attendance is necessary or desirable for your band, for any reason, and is acceptable to the players, that's cool.
Now, the following isn't directed at you, and not even specifically at this thread, but is just a general rant. If any of us took to heart half of the relentless authoritarian posturing about what we "need" in order to perform, none of us would ever venture out of the house, much less even play bass. The trick to all threads is deciding what to believe and what to ignore.
OK I'm back. Interesting reads everyone. By the way, in case you are unfamiliar with my "writing style" (and many of you aren't...... I don't fancy myself as one of the "popular kids" here) I write very sarcastically. This is often misunderstood as my being really upset, or degrading even. That couldn't be further from the truth. My opinions some across stronger than they are quite often. If I offended anyone, I apologize.
1) If you are in one of the bands a railed "against", good for you!
2) If you are committed to your band and would play one the day your house burnt down, good for you!
3) If you honestly feel that you are the only person in the tri-state area who could cover your parts, good for you!
That being said, here's the thing. Lighten up. My gosh you guys take some music SERIOUSLY! You are in the ENTERTAINMENT business. You are not curing cancer. Nobody is going to loose a wink of sleep if they don't hear YOUR EXACT rendition of Tush. And, yes, I was mostly referring to cover bands in my OP. If you have all moved to LA or Nashville with the intention of making it in the music business having sold all of your worldly possessions to have a go at it, then you are in a different situation. However, if you are in Kansas playing a few pay to play gigs in an original (aka "real band".... ha!) then you too need to lighten up.
I'm not committed? Give me a BREAK! I am married. I have two (YOUNG) kids. I am in school full-time. I run a business. And I do side work. If you think that my rant has anything to do with COMMITMENT ISSUES, then you can bite me. I'm the first one up and the last one down in my house every day. I'm the first student to class. I am ranked #1 in my class with a 4.1 average. My clients call me 7 days a week. Now THAT is some serious stuff.
Having to find another guy to play drums on Mustang Sally and Brown Eyed Girl for Stinky's Bar and Grill Friday night, seemingly "letting down" three other musicians (by not knowing Freebird? Really?), Stinky (who wouldn't be at your funeral if you died in a wreck tomorrow), Bambi the bar tender who doesn't even know you play BASS rather than guitar, and the 75 drunks who came to hear Brown Eyed Girl (or the 13 drunks.... sorry..... friends who came to hear 10 original.... excuse me "real" bands at one pay to play gig) is TOTAL BS. You ARE taking yourselves WAY too seriously. You bang out songs on a BASS. It's FUN. If it weren't FUN, or ENTERTAINING, nobody would come to watch you DO IT. We are RESPECTABLE CLOWNS. We perform and ACT to make people CLAP. The clapping goes along with BUYING BEER. If it weren't for BUYING BEER, there would BE NO MUSIC BUSINESS. Not even in Nashville, LA, or NYC.
Speaking of Nashville, I have friends who live there. Some of the fill-in gigs I do are with acts out of Nashville. One guy (we'll call him "Joe") meets people in a FOOD LION PARKING LOT to go do gigs. He will drive 11 1/2 hours three states over to play a gig with a rhythm section he met at Food Lion THAT MORNING. They have NEVER played together. That is the way (small-time) Nashville works. And these people are playing for a LIVING. And, yes, they are playing ORIGINALS. How are they able to pull it off? It's simple. Everybody out there can PLAY. They can ride in a van, listen to a song a couple times, make a chart, and come show time they can PLAY THE SONG. Why is that so foreign to so many of you? "Joe" often doesn't even know WHO will be playing with him the WEEK before going out on the rod for DAYS. His act does 14 originals and some pretty complicated country. I know because I play with him sometimes. And the FIRST time I played with him, I got the call for a weekend of gigs on WEDNESDAY. I was ready by Friday (with kids, a business, school, etc.) and the gigs went fine. And I even aced a DC/AC exam that had to be done online by midnight Sunday. That's what (cough) people who can PLAY THEIR INSTRUMENTS DO.
So, if Nashville original acts (aka "real" bands) can do it all the time, why can't you guys who either play Knock On Wood on the weekends, or you guys (in "real" bands) who play ten freakin' songs for $12.13 a night between 45 other "real" bands get a sub every now and then and get over yourselves? If your guitar player finds out on Thursday afternoon that failing his exam on Monday morning would mean he has to take the class over, he would be a dipstick for playing a show Friday and Saturday with some band just because "Slick", "Snake", "Roscoe", and "The Beast" wouldn't be able to make $12.78 playing their originals for 21 of their closest friends. Likewise, if I get the chance to sit behind the batter's box at a RedSox at Fenway game next Friday night (a one-in-a-lifetime chance) I'm not going to turn it down because the other three guys in "Two fingers, the Band" will be pissed because they would rather have me there at Grinder's Honkytonk than the other guy who knows all the material (except maybe a couple) and might have to read a chart on 5 songs. Sorry. That's just dumb IMO. I'm going to see the Sox. Grinder will be fine. The drunks will be fine. Two Fingers, The Band will be fine. And I am comfortable enough in my own skin to know that I won't be missed all that much.
Neither would any of you by the way. Nobody is irreplaceable. The band may not be able to do the same arrangements, but they could put on a show with somebody else if they had to. If you broke your right hand this morning, are you guys really saying that your band would shut down until your cast came off six weeks from now? What if you LOST your right arm? Are all of you saying that your bands would just FOLD and call it a day? In most cases, you are simply wrong. Sorry.
Either way, it's an interesting conversation that seems to have most people at the far ends of the spectrum. Again, I am sarcastic. I love original bands. Lighten up. I'm only kidding with you a little. We all know you never make as much as $13 for a show. That's a pipe dream. (That was another joke.)
1) If you are in one of the bands a railed "against", good for you!
2) If you are committed to your band and would play one the day your house burnt down, good for you!
3) If you honestly feel that you are the only person in the tri-state area who could cover your parts, good for you!
That being said, here's the thing. Lighten up. My gosh you guys take some music SERIOUSLY! You are in the ENTERTAINMENT business. You are not curing cancer. Nobody is going to loose a wink of sleep if they don't hear YOUR EXACT rendition of Tush. And, yes, I was mostly referring to cover bands in my OP. If you have all moved to LA or Nashville with the intention of making it in the music business having sold all of your worldly possessions to have a go at it, then you are in a different situation. However, if you are in Kansas playing a few pay to play gigs in an original (aka "real band".... ha!) then you too need to lighten up.
I'm not committed? Give me a BREAK! I am married. I have two (YOUNG) kids. I am in school full-time. I run a business. And I do side work. If you think that my rant has anything to do with COMMITMENT ISSUES, then you can bite me. I'm the first one up and the last one down in my house every day. I'm the first student to class. I am ranked #1 in my class with a 4.1 average. My clients call me 7 days a week. Now THAT is some serious stuff.
Having to find another guy to play drums on Mustang Sally and Brown Eyed Girl for Stinky's Bar and Grill Friday night, seemingly "letting down" three other musicians (by not knowing Freebird? Really?), Stinky (who wouldn't be at your funeral if you died in a wreck tomorrow), Bambi the bar tender who doesn't even know you play BASS rather than guitar, and the 75 drunks who came to hear Brown Eyed Girl (or the 13 drunks.... sorry..... friends who came to hear 10 original.... excuse me "real" bands at one pay to play gig) is TOTAL BS. You ARE taking yourselves WAY too seriously. You bang out songs on a BASS. It's FUN. If it weren't FUN, or ENTERTAINING, nobody would come to watch you DO IT. We are RESPECTABLE CLOWNS. We perform and ACT to make people CLAP. The clapping goes along with BUYING BEER. If it weren't for BUYING BEER, there would BE NO MUSIC BUSINESS. Not even in Nashville, LA, or NYC.
Speaking of Nashville, I have friends who live there. Some of the fill-in gigs I do are with acts out of Nashville. One guy (we'll call him "Joe") meets people in a FOOD LION PARKING LOT to go do gigs. He will drive 11 1/2 hours three states over to play a gig with a rhythm section he met at Food Lion THAT MORNING. They have NEVER played together. That is the way (small-time) Nashville works. And these people are playing for a LIVING. And, yes, they are playing ORIGINALS. How are they able to pull it off? It's simple. Everybody out there can PLAY. They can ride in a van, listen to a song a couple times, make a chart, and come show time they can PLAY THE SONG. Why is that so foreign to so many of you? "Joe" often doesn't even know WHO will be playing with him the WEEK before going out on the rod for DAYS. His act does 14 originals and some pretty complicated country. I know because I play with him sometimes. And the FIRST time I played with him, I got the call for a weekend of gigs on WEDNESDAY. I was ready by Friday (with kids, a business, school, etc.) and the gigs went fine. And I even aced a DC/AC exam that had to be done online by midnight Sunday. That's what (cough) people who can PLAY THEIR INSTRUMENTS DO.
So, if Nashville original acts (aka "real" bands) can do it all the time, why can't you guys who either play Knock On Wood on the weekends, or you guys (in "real" bands) who play ten freakin' songs for $12.13 a night between 45 other "real" bands get a sub every now and then and get over yourselves? If your guitar player finds out on Thursday afternoon that failing his exam on Monday morning would mean he has to take the class over, he would be a dipstick for playing a show Friday and Saturday with some band just because "Slick", "Snake", "Roscoe", and "The Beast" wouldn't be able to make $12.78 playing their originals for 21 of their closest friends. Likewise, if I get the chance to sit behind the batter's box at a RedSox at Fenway game next Friday night (a one-in-a-lifetime chance) I'm not going to turn it down because the other three guys in "Two fingers, the Band" will be pissed because they would rather have me there at Grinder's Honkytonk than the other guy who knows all the material (except maybe a couple) and might have to read a chart on 5 songs. Sorry. That's just dumb IMO. I'm going to see the Sox. Grinder will be fine. The drunks will be fine. Two Fingers, The Band will be fine. And I am comfortable enough in my own skin to know that I won't be missed all that much.
Neither would any of you by the way. Nobody is irreplaceable. The band may not be able to do the same arrangements, but they could put on a show with somebody else if they had to. If you broke your right hand this morning, are you guys really saying that your band would shut down until your cast came off six weeks from now? What if you LOST your right arm? Are all of you saying that your bands would just FOLD and call it a day? In most cases, you are simply wrong. Sorry.
Either way, it's an interesting conversation that seems to have most people at the far ends of the spectrum. Again, I am sarcastic. I love original bands. Lighten up. I'm only kidding with you a little. We all know you never make as much as $13 for a show. That's a pipe dream. (That was another joke.)
All I'm saying is, I don't know any other way to approach music. I play every show, even if there's two people in the bar, and one of them is passed out, as if it's the Ed Sullivan show, being watched by twenty five million people.
As I said, either you're committed, or you aren't.
And yes, maybe I should be.
As I said, either you're committed, or you aren't.
And yes, maybe I should be.
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