The trick of playing through harmonically moving music is the resolution. If the pianist is shifting the harmony and you cannot keep up, I absolutely guarantee that a point in the music is coming, probably after either 4, 8, or 16 bars where he will resolve his harmony. Music must finis within a performance and trust me on this, look for one of these points in the tunes that you are playing and your pianist will play the written chord 100% guarantted.
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Jeff Berlin Talks Music First, Bass Second
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The trick of playing through harmonically moving music is the resolution. If the pianist is shifting the harmony and you cannot keep up, I absolutely guarantee that a point in the music is coming, probably after either 4, 8, or 16 bars where he will resolve his harmony. Music must finis within a performance and trust me on this, look for one of these points in the tunes that you are playing and your pianist will play the written chord 100% guarantted.
You do not need to know how you played or what you've played. There's no reason for this extra work. Besides, you already know what you've played because it is your composition. You won't learn anything more trying to figure out how you played it. Tab is a humbug. Music rules. I hope you will believe this.
thanks for the honest answer....
...one more thing:
one of the first things i was taught as a bassplayer were the modes of the major scale (ionian, dorian, .... ...., locrian). And practising those really didn´t get me anywhere.
then i learned about Carol Kaye and read that she prefers to teach "in chords instead of scales". this really helped me to find my way in harmonic situations and also to improve my "listening".
i hope you understand what i´m trying to say.... ...an if so, can you support this approach??
Make sure that you practice it without a metronome. Count the time outloud if necessary, and subdivide the rhythms this way. Do it slowly if you have to. and Review what you've read several times over several days. No intense practicing please unless you can handle it.
Thanks for the advise. I'll ask my old trumpet teacher about some music because I think he teaches trombone as well.
My method totally. She is totally right-on about this. Teachers who teach scales do so because they aren't aware of other musical possibilities or the silliness of learning scales. Chord tones rule the world for bass players and most basists don't know this. This is one reason why I have a hard time with many teachers who are angry with me when I dismiss their teaching methods. I've studied music since 1958 and I've figured out a few things. My background is far far more rich in academic learning than most guys. I know how to show music to people. Since many teachers don't know much about music, they really cannot teach it to you. Hence the popularity of scales, metronomes, tab. etc.
Heya Jeff, nice to see you here again. I think you're doing a great service to the TalkBass community by having these "open discussions".
Best,
Xavier
Best,
Xavier
Yes, Jeff you nailed it with that answer, and this should clear the air on these forums.
Don't go to a audition thinking you got it ,when there are many surprises that wait for you ,like a slider or a curve ball looks good coming at you then the bottom drops out.
Word of mouth is the best form of advertisement .
Don't go to a audition thinking you got it ,when there are many surprises that wait for you ,like a slider or a curve ball looks good coming at you then the bottom drops out.
Word of mouth is the best form of advertisement .
I truly believe in music (not in TAB, when learning anything). The TAB transcription only allows me to achieve a certain and desired "tonal" effect. Think of an open G string and the same note on the 15th fret of E str; it's not the same tone (pitch wise is the same though, but not the "harmonic profile" of the two positions). That's the only valid reason that I do double the work in my compositions (std and tab trascription). And I need this as I compose several pieces at once (so tastes and desires vary a lot) . Definitely not lazy, and I know that there is NO shortcut if you really want to learn music. And you are a valid and living proof of this. Thank you for the reply
Musicians cannot become better as players unless they learn the language of their art and learn very well the instrument that best represents it. This is why I do away with almost everything that some guys have held fast to in music education and still do. My intentions is to enlighten guys that the only way that you will get what you want which is (I assume) musical awareness and playing compentency to work for it. To do this, you will have to do a lot more than use tab and a metronome, believe me.
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Hi Jeff - I knew there was a reason why I walked in from a beautiful day in Northern Minnesota to check out TB, you are on! Now that I am a veteran of the March 2009 Intensive Week at Players School, I can perhaps offer some perspective to those curious about the School. As a 54 year old beginner, I walked into the School 3 months after purchasing my first electric bass. I trusted the website that EVERYONE interested in learning was welcome and sure enough, by some magic, EVERYONE had what could be described as an individual curriculum. Yet, everyday we played together 3 times. The Intensity was real yet very soulful. The vibe from that week keeps me focused to this moment. I could go on, but I'll just state if you can get to Clearwater for a week, it will change you in many ways. I hope to return. BTW, Jeff does a great Jackie Gleason..
Peace -Don Sovil
Peace -Don Sovil
Music is best represented by chordal harmony. Scales gloss over tonality in that they don't specify the chord.
C,E,G, and B are a chord with no other name other than C Major 7.
One could use these scales over Cmaj7: C,D,E,F,G,A,B,C or C,D,E,F#,G,A,B,C, or C,D,E,F#,G#,A,B,C, or C,Db,E,F# G, A B,C or C,D D# E F# G# B,C. There are more but I think you get the point.
Secondly, if you have a II,V,I in Cmaj7 and use a C major 7 ionian scale on all the chords, you are not representing each chord, just glossing over their individual tonalities. This is my quick explanation why scales are really too non-specific to be used by players other than players with a skill and playing knowledge in how to use these things. As far as academics go, scales really are lousy practic principles in most cases.
Jeff, i read a forum on are there any sources to get a gig with a major act ?
Of the many answers giving yours is the one that would have given also .
For the gigs that i have gotten with major artist have been through reconmendations
and not any other type of source. The curves or the sliders that can come at you is when a artist changes songs , Keys etc. that you were not ready for.
Of the many answers giving yours is the one that would have given also .
For the gigs that i have gotten with major artist have been through reconmendations
and not any other type of source. The curves or the sliders that can come at you is when a artist changes songs , Keys etc. that you were not ready for.
I remember Don and remember that he couldn't play nor understand written music on Monday. By Friday, he was reading, playing soloing, sure in simple ways. But no one, no other school, no other camp, class, intensive, one week event, no one else can do what we can do at The Players School because we insist that guys learn music from the first minute, certainly at their pace, but they must learn real music nontheless. Thanks Don for your generous comments about The Players School. And remenber; NORTON, WE ARE NOT GOING' BOWLIN' TANIGHT!
heh...I'm not sure I have ANY hope of gigging with a major artist any time soon...
I'm sort of a hack bass player, but I think something that has helped me is taking 2 yrs of piano when I was a kid, and also some music theory classes in high school. I'm old now, 53, and just picked up bass guitar for the first time 6 yrs ago. I understand the intervals, 2nd, 3rds, 4ths, etc, and some basic chord progressions and that helps me understand what I listen to and how to play it. I do NOT practice scales, for some reason I just can't make myself do that. Instead, what I do is listen to music and try to figure out how they played what they played. More often than not, it ends up pretty simple and I can learn it in just a few minutes.
Just more rambling...no meaning here lol
I'm sort of a hack bass player, but I think something that has helped me is taking 2 yrs of piano when I was a kid, and also some music theory classes in high school. I'm old now, 53, and just picked up bass guitar for the first time 6 yrs ago. I understand the intervals, 2nd, 3rds, 4ths, etc, and some basic chord progressions and that helps me understand what I listen to and how to play it. I do NOT practice scales, for some reason I just can't make myself do that. Instead, what I do is listen to music and try to figure out how they played what they played. More often than not, it ends up pretty simple and I can learn it in just a few minutes.
Just more rambling...no meaning here lol
Thanks again. i really appreciate that you are doing this kind of "question and answer" regularly here. it´s very helpful and the topics are very interesting.
I actually got to "know" you from the german bass-magazine "Bassprofessor" where you did a column for a short period of time. Great stuff but ended to quickly. Gathering more information about you and your teaching-opinions together with learning about C. Kaye´s approach sometime later really helped me. So thanks for that too.
I´d like to ask a rather stupid question just out of curiosity:
Did you practise already today, and if so: what was it....
PS if you ever think about opening a PSoM in Germany, please let me know...
Indeed I do. Right now I am in the midst of working out of a Jerry Bergonzi book (can't remember the name). I am also transcribing another Keith Jarrett solo so that I can have something to practice on the bass guitar,
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