Jointer Size?

[Big B.]

Yes the helical head really does make that much difference. Not saying it will never tearout at all but I've run everything from burls to highly figured maple of all stripes and have rarely had any kind of tearout. Another advantage is the cutters are staggered so they hit the wood separately and at an angle instead of a single square set knife slamming into the wood. You know that feeling when you joint a hard wood like maple and you feel the board trying to bounce off the cutters? The helical head almost totally erases that and almost feels like it's sucking the board down against the table. This isn't to say a well tuned straight knife jointer won't be great for most woods. Our shop has a 14" straight knife jointer that is top of the line but when we make maple drawer boxes we still join the edges on an 8" powermatic with a helical head to eliminate chipping.

 

[RichterScale]

I don't know how this got so out of hand, but I'm pretty sure it's you guys' fault!

They did the same thing to me.
I think they're some kinda scientology or devil worship cult or something.

 

[rudy4444]

About my only complaint so far with the router sled is dust control, or more accurately shaving control, it flings stuff out in a circular arc, including back at me, a single-point vacuum port would only catch what happens to be flung in that direction. My jointer has a dust port, but even when I have a vacuum on it, it flings a % of shavings off the back of the table. I have yet to own almost any tool where the dust collection worked worth a damn, except maybe my Porter Cable sander with the perforated discs hooked up to vacuum.

I briefly owned a Saf-T-planer, and wasn't overwhelmed with the finish I was getting out of it, about what the photos show, a series of overlapping circular tool marks that had to be sanded out. Part of that may have been due to the age and accumulated bearing slop on my old drill press, if the drill is a really tight, rigid structure, seems like you'd get better results. At any rate, I seem to get a really smooth cut using the router sled and a Freud 1-1/4" dia. flattening bit. Really glass smooth finish with no tearout, I'm sold. Different strokes, all that matters is what works for you, took me too long to figure this out.

With the STP it's vitally important that it's sharp. It's not that difficult to do, but if it isn't sharp you won't get good results.

Yes, you get swirls! If I'm looking for a surface that will require minimal clean up then I make a last light pass. It takes only a few minutes to sand the swirls out with a 5" oscillating sander fitted with a 220 sanding disk.

The STP creates a veritable mountain of small curls and very little fine dust. I have my drill press set up in a corner of the shop to trap the shavings to the left and rear of the drill press. A broom and dust pan make pretty quick work of cleaning up the mess.

I certainly agree on the different strokes philosophy. That's a big part of the fun behind woodworking, you find what works for you and the tools you're willing to buy.

 

[Bruce Johnson]

I was given a Saf-T-Planer head, one of the newer Stew-Mac ones. I've done some experimenting with it, in one of my milling machines. Yes, it is a very interesting device, and I can see how it could be useful for many specialty planing jobs.

I also happen to have this giant old Buffalo 20" drill press, from the 1930's, which I picked up about 5 years ago for $100. It's sitting in my back room storage area, with all my other giant old drill presses. But it's in running condition, just needing a motor rigged up to it.....

I've been thinking of moving it over into my woodworking shop and rigging it up to be my Big woodworking drill press. Big Forstner bits, etc.

And then I started thinking about the Saf-T-Planer.....This old monster could be just the machine for it, with the sturdy frame and big crank-up table. A Sup-R-Saf-T-Planer Press!

 

[RichterScale]

But for final straightening of edges to be glued on instrument laminations, my router fixtures are faster and more reliable.

Do you have any pics of your router fixtures, or a thread with pics?
I have a nice piece of polished aluminum square stock that's 1 x 1.5 x 32 that I plan to use as a string path sanding block and also a straight edge for jointing with the router. Would love to see your setup before I make something. Thanks.

 

[Beej]

Do you have any pics of your router fixtures, or a thread with pics?
I have a nice piece of polished aluminum square stock that's 1 x 1.5 x 32 that I plan to use as a string path sanding block and also a straight edge for jointing with the router. Would love to see your setup before I make something. Thanks.

There's a few in here:
Router Planing Fixtures

 

[TerribleTim68]

Wow, I feel like I started a mess with this thread. I'm not looking for a jointer to answer all of my surface prep solutions. But I do a lot of general woodworking so when it comes to things like gluing up cutting boards or dizzy bowl blanks for woodturning or even multi-lam neck blanks, I think it's gonna be an invaluable tool. I'll eventually build a router sled for wide stuff, but I'm not gonna drag all that out to mill up some narrow stock. I think each tool has a use, I'm always amazed at how many people insist that "this is the only tool you should ever use for this..."

 

[rudy4444]

I was given a Saf-T-Planer head, one of the newer Stew-Mac ones. I've done some experimenting with it, in one of my milling machines. Yes, it is a very interesting device, and I can see how it could be useful for many specialty planing jobs.

I also happen to have this giant old Buffalo 20" drill press, from the 1930's, which I picked up about 5 years ago for $100. It's sitting in my back room storage area, with all my other giant old drill presses. But it's in running condition, just needing a motor rigged up to it.....

View attachment 4218745

I've been thinking of moving it over into my woodworking shop and rigging it up to be my Big woodworking drill press. Big Forstner bits, etc.

And then I started thinking about the Saf-T-Planer.....This old monster could be just the machine for it, with the sturdy frame and big crank-up table. A Sup-R-Saf-T-Planer Press!

I used to use one exactly like it at my old workplace. The Safe-T-Planer really needs about 3000 rpm to work correctly. It's absolutely night and day between running it at lower speeds and using the higher rpm.

I'm not sure I'd like to see the old Buffalo running at 3K, though... *

*I AM joking of course...

I'm such a staunch advocate of the STP that I contacted one supplier of insert tooling to suggest they market a insert version of the STP using square carbide inserts such as those used in the helical cut planers. The STP scares people silly for some reason, even though the geometry of the cutter ensures that there's such a slight depth of cut that it won't kick back if used correctly. Those same folks who shudder when they see a STP don't think twice about using a large diameter router bit that has none of those same safety features built in to the tool.

 

[rudy4444]

Wow, I feel like I started a mess with this thread. I'm not looking for a jointer to answer all of my surface prep solutions. But I do a lot of general woodworking so when it comes to things like gluing up cutting boards or dizzy bowl blanks for woodturning or even multi-lam neck blanks, I think it's gonna be an invaluable tool. I'll eventually build a router sled for wide stuff, but I'm not gonna drag all that out to mill up some narrow stock. I think each tool has a use, I'm always amazed at how many people insist that "this is the only tool you should ever use for this..."

I don't think it's a mess. I just hate to see someone plodding down the same road I jumped away from so many years ago. Heck, I've seen folks who insist you can make perfectly good glue joints with a hatchet.

If there's one thing I have an absolute certainty of it's that very few forum readers are going to modify their work methodology by observing what someone else does.

You can lead a horse to water...

 

[TerribleTim68]

So, for those interested, at $80 and the dang thing runs like a purring kitten, I brought the Powr-Kraft jointer home with me this morning. The tables are straight and true and it was actually in much better condition than the photos looked. The tables do have some surface rust, but it's not bad. I've begun squirting everything with PB Blaster before I start trying to take things apart. I'll keep giving it some squirts over the next few days before I try to bust anything loose .I'd like to remove the tables and clean them up off the machine, which would also give me some access to clean the areas under the tables as well as the table "slides".

I'm assuming this thing is much like every other jointer and operates and adjusts the same. It appears to have some sort of set screw above the table adjuster wheel shafts, is that normal?

Also, @Bruce Johnson, you might be interested to know, my early research has found this to be a re-badged "Sprunger NJ-600". I'm searching for a manual for that, because I might have better luck there.

 

[Beej]

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[Gilmourisgod]

The set screws may be to lock the table adjusters in place, mine has threaded knobs doing the same thing on my Jet. Once the outfeed table is perfectly level with the cutter head, you want it locked in place so it doesnt move. Lots of good sources for.setting these up online, but ive been using Mark Duginske Mastering Woodworking Machines for years, havent found anything better. Anybody reading this is probably a tool geek, photos of the restoration mandatory!
https://www.amazon.com/Mastering-Wo...ng+woodworking+machines&qid=1617018133&sr=8-3

 

[Gilmourisgod]

That Vintage Machinery site is awesome, they hooked me up with original owners manual link for my Grandads 1947 Craftsman drill press rehab. All this stuff is available online now, though finding actual parts may be unobtanium. I had to re-use the original quill recoil spring on my drill after heating and bending it a bit, it may fail eventually, but I’ll work it until it does. If you are lucky, it won’t need any parts.

 

[TerribleTim68]

Thanks @Beej! Much appreciated! I would have eventually found it, but currently I'm busy at work watching this NASCAR dirt disaster at Bristol.
#Priorities

 

[Bruce Johnson]

I used to use one exactly like it at my old workplace. The Safe-T-Planer really needs about 3000 rpm to work correctly. It's absolutely night and day between running it at lower speeds and using the higher rpm.

I'm not sure I'd like to see the old Buffalo running at 3K, though...

Hey Rudy;

Okay, that's good to know. The testing I did was at about 700 rpm in my mill/drill machine. It worked okay, pretty smooth surface and wasn't grabbing or chunking or trying to kick. My engineering brain says that you want to have it in a good rigid frame, so it doesn't do any fine chattering.

No, the old Buffalo isn't going to do 3000 rpm. That would be scary. Its factory top speed is around 470 rpm. Low-Low speed is 17 rpm. Saf-T-Planing would be tedious at that speed.

I'll try it out at 470 when I get the old monster up and running. I'm thinking that it might be the right rig for planing surfaces in hard to reach areas, like the back surfaces of tilt-back headstocks.

 

[Bruce Johnson]

Since this thread was originally about Jointer Size:

You may have seen on the Secret Underground Lab thread that I'm currently cleaning out the estate of Brian Hay, a woodworker who was renting a shop space here. Brian passed away in February, and his family gave me the responsibility of disposing of all his tools and machines. A huge and sad job.

Anyway, this monster jointer is one of Brian's machines. I'm just about to list it on CraigsList. I doubt any of you are seriously interested in it, but I knew you'd want to see it. I thought about keeping it for myself, but I really don't need a jointer of this size, or have the room for it. I have two nice jointers now.

This is a Wadkins Bursgreen 8" x 7' heavy jointer. Made in England, not a brand you see often here in the States. It's about the equivalent of an Oliver in construction and quality. Made for all-day heavy use. It weighs about 900 lbs. I made up a quick heavy duty dolly with casters for it, and lifted it on with my engine hoist. It's 3 phase, 2 or 3 HP.

A beautiful machine. I hope I can find a good home for it. It needs some electrical work before it can be fired up and tested. Also the knives are missing. They may be packed away somewhere in Brian's stuff, but I haven't found them yet. They appear to be standard 5/8" x 8" Plain knives, which are commonly available.

 

[Flying B]

Guess I'm a bit spoiled, working in a joinery shop.
We have a four sider - four cutter heads so you feed rough sawn wood in one end and it comes out planed and square all four sides.

Also there's a guy who rents a corner of our shop who has a thicknesser- planer, like this

You plane one face and one edge across the top then it flips up and you can accurately thickness the other two edges underneath. This also has a spiral cutter head so very clean finish, and will take a board over 400mm wide.

We also have this beast. Our wide belt sander which will take up to 1100mm wide.

Between these three machines I haven't felt the need to build a router planing jig so far.

 

[Beej]

Guess I'm a bit spoiled, working in a joinery shop.
We have a four sider - four cutter heads so you feed rough sawn wood in one end and it comes out planed and square all four sides.

View attachment 4261700

Also there's a guy who rents a corner of our shop who has a thicknesser- planer, like this
View attachment 4261701

You plane one face and one edge across the top then it flips up and you can accurately thickness the other two edges underneath. This also has a spiral cutter head so very clean finish, and will take a board over 400mm wide.

We also have this beast. Our wide belt sander which will take up to 1100mm wide.

View attachment 4261702

Between these three machines I haven't felt the need to build a router planing jig so far.

I dunno, I still think you’re missing out by not having a router sled.

 

[Plain Old Barry]

Since this thread was originally about Jointer Size:It's 3 phase, 2 or 3 HP.

Three phase can be the real rub in resale. It's great if you can get it, or if you wind a buyer with a converter, but three phase machines that are similar to single phase machines often sell at a significant discount to single phase machines.

It'll really be about three factors, location, location, and location.

 

[Bruce Johnson]

I dunno, I still think you’re missing out by not having a router sled.

Yeah, the router sled is for when the other guys are busy running pallet loads of boards through the machines.