Jointer Size?

[Jeff Siddall]

Another consideration is that a router sled can thin a portion of a board (like the contoured portion of a neck) whereas none of those other tools can easily/safely.

Can't say I am not jealous of the giant jointer/planer/sanders though. That four sided one sounds awesome.

 

[Bruce Johnson]

Those big machines are wonderful for fast production of a lot of boards. No question.

But one thing that router fixtures are really good at is straightening the grain. Taking a strip of wood and cutting it down to size while shifting it at a slight angle to get the grain going straight down the middle. That's fairly tricky to do with a power-feed machine or a wide-belt sander or even a conventional jointer. With a router fixture, you can put the flat plane of the cut exactly where you want it.

Something I've thought of is modifying a jointer so that a sled fixture rides over it. Picture this: Take a pair of steel strips 1/16" thick x 1" wide. Screw them down to the infeed table, spaced apart to the edges. Leave a 4" wide gap between them. Set the outfeed table as normal, just even with the blades. Set the infeed table so that the top surfaces of the strips is dead flat even with the outfeed table.

Then build a fixture similar to a router fixture, but upside down. Two MDF side plates with straight edges, the wood workpiece is clamped between them. You slide the fixture down the strips and outfeed table, and anything hanging down below the fixture side rails will be cut away. In a straight flat plane.

Same idea as the router fixture, but using the jointer head to make the cut instead of the router. The path of the cutter head would be set by the fixture rails, not by the existing edge of the workpiece board.

I have a small Delta 4" jointer that I hardly use. I've thought about converting it like that, to use sliding fixtures. Just for straightening body board edges and neck lamination strips. But I'm not sure it would be any faster than using a router on the fixture. But it's an idea.

 

[Bruce Johnson]

On the subject of jointing boards: You may have seen on the other thread that I'm clearing out an estate of a woodworker/cabinetmaker, sorting out and selling off all his tools and machines. One little jewel that I found and am keeping for myself is this:

It's a little old Porter-Cable electric block plane, from back in the days when power tools were smooth shiny die-cast aluminum. A cute little tool.

I had a flash of an idea to adapt this machine to a special fixture! Because I like special fixtures! Similar to the router fixtures for jointing: two straight edge boards with the wood workpiece clamped in between them. This little guy rides along on the edge boards, sliding on some blocks or rollers. Would it be faster or better than a router? I dunno.

 

[rudy4444]

I had a flash of an idea to adapt this machine to a special fixture! Because I like special fixtures! Similar to the router fixtures for jointing: two straight edge boards with the wood workpiece clamped in between them. This little guy rides along on the edge boards, sliding on some blocks or rollers. Would it be faster or better than a router? I dunno.

A couple of days ago I happened to come across a Youtube video where someone was demonstrating exactly that. It detailed how a portable plane was fitted with rails that spanned a wood frame to surface plane what appeared to be a solid body guitar blank. There's probably more of those types of demo videos and it shows that others are doing the same thing with the portable hand planes that we are doing with a router.

I had thought about picking up one of the better ones, but I'm not sure how useful it would be. I'm not much on having tools around that I'm not going to use.

Here is the video that I saw, but there are other examples that come up with a Youtube search. It wouldn't be how I would do it, but it looks like it works for them.

 

[Plain Old Barry]

A couple of days ago I happened to come across a Youtube video where someone was demonstrating exactly that. It detailed how a portable plane was fitted with rails that spanned a wood frame to surface plane what appeared to be a solid body guitar blank. There's probably more of those types of demo videos and it shows that others are doing the same thing with the portable hand planes that we are doing with a router.

I had thought about picking up one of the better ones, but I'm not sure how useful it would be. I'm not much on having tools around that I'm not going to use.

I own a Bosch power plane and 12 routers in my furniture shop.

I think the router, and it's rotary cutterhead face would be far better in a surface planing sled, which is why so many use routers on slabs. The power plane would work great on straight grained stock, but would probably leave figured stock looking like a herd of beavers just left. Don't like those birdseyes? The power plane will rip them out in no time for you.

Basically, anything that a stationary jointer or thickness planer with straight knives would tear up will also get eaten by the power plane. Power planes are mainly used on softer woods by finish carpenters, so they usually have a low angle cutter edge grind. The more figured the stock, the higher of a cutting angle you want.

That said, a power plane can be used in varying directions to match the grain, to quickly take off large face or edge variations before switching to another tool. I'll sometimes do this with highly figured stock before moving to a drum sander. I also use the power plane on doors that are difficult to hold on site, as hand planes require a solid workholding device for best results.

Now if someone ever makes an aftermarket spiral cutterhead for a power plane, THAT would be great in a sled.

 

[dwizum]

Now if someone ever makes an aftermarket spiral cutterhead for a power plane, THAT would be great in a sled.

But what advantage would that have over a router in a sled?

Just faster material removal?

(Perhaps this is an ignorant question!)

 

[Plain Old Barry]

But what advantage would that have over a router in a sled?

Just faster material removal?

(Perhaps this is an ignorant question!)

Not ignorant at all.

It would cleanly surface nearly any stock, in almost any direction, while taking a much wider pass, and be more usable hand held on figured woods. I think chip collection would be better than a router, too. Power planes work very well attached to suction.

I could also see an advantage with cheaper, four edged cutters over the router. High quality large router bits are big bucks.

That said, I don't use anything in a sled for instrument sized boards. I already own an 8" jointer, thickness planer, and a 22" drum sander. For table slabs, especially highly figured or burled stock, I think a spiral segmented cutterhead in a power plane would kick some serious butt.

 

[Matt O]

Caveat: I’m a furniture maker, not a luthier, but I like flat and square just as much as you guys

At work I’ve got a Laguna 12” helical jointer, so any big stuff or if I have a pile to straighten out, I’ll do it there. At my home shop, I decided to skip adding a jointer and I don’t miss it. I instead use a track saw for edges and a thickness planer sled for faces. My home planer is helical so tear out isn’t an issue unless the board is highly figured. If that’s the case, I step to the drum sander with a sled. Router sleds are great, but I find I get the job done with those methods quick and easy. The track saw is especially quick on straightening out a board in one pass, and I can also choose the angle of cut to bring the grain into alignment with the edge. Longer board? Add more track. And the edges are often glue ready in a single pass.

 

[rudy4444]

I own a Bosch power plane and 12 routers in my furniture shop.

I think the router, and it's rotary cutterhead face would be far better in a surface planing sled, which is why so many use routers on slabs. The power plane would work great on straight grained stock, but would probably leave figured stock looking like a herd of beavers just left. Don't like those birdseyes? The power plane will rip them out in no time for you.

Basically, anything that a stationary jointer or thickness planer with straight knives would tear up will also get eaten by the power plane. Power planes are mainly used on softer woods by finish carpenters, so they usually have a low angle cutter edge grind. The more figured the stock, the higher of a cutting angle you want.

That said, a power plane can be used in varying directions to match the grain, to quickly take off large face or edge variations before switching to another tool. I'll sometimes do this with highly figured stock before moving to a drum sander. I also use the power plane on doors that are difficult to hold on site, as hand planes require a solid workholding device for best results.

Now if someone ever makes an aftermarket spiral cutterhead for a power plane, THAT would be great in a sled.

Thanks for the info! I don't own a power planer, so I was interested in the opinion of someone who actually uses one.

I'm quite familiar with the inability of straight blades to surface figured wood without potential damage. As you might know, I personally do all my planing with a Safe-T-Planer, and other than leaving a swirl pattern in the wood that's easy to sand away it allows me to work birdseye and other problematic woods with no problem. The STP offers a 2-1/2" wide cut, so it's a good alternative to a router sled, plus depth of cut adjustment is super-easy.

 

[Plain Old Barry]

Thanks for the info! I don't own a power planer, so I was interested in the opinion of someone who actually uses one.

I'm quite familiar with the inability of straight blades to surface figured wood without potential damage. As you might know, I personally do all my planing with a Safe-T-Planer, and other than leaving a swirl pattern in the wood that's easy to sand away it allows me to work birdseye and other problematic woods with no problem.

A cool part of working with wood is that there are often many ways to skin the cat and details like shop size, frequency of an operation, or materials really matter when determining what works best for us. Glad that's working well for you.

Internet PSA - I have two lovely cats that I love as companions and have no plans to skin them.

 

[Flying B]

Caveat: I’m a furniture maker, not a luthier, but I like flat and square just as much as you guys

At work I’ve got a Laguna 12” helical jointer, so any big stuff or if I have a pile to straighten out, I’ll do it there. At my home shop, I decided to skip adding a jointer and I don’t miss it. I instead use a track saw for edges and a thickness planer sled for faces. My home planer is helical so tear out isn’t an issue unless the board is highly figured. If that’s the case, I step to the drum sander with a sled. Router sleds are great, but I find I get the job done with those methods quick and easy. The track saw is especially quick on straightening out a board in one pass, and I can also choose the angle of cut to bring the grain into alignment with the edge. Longer board? Add more track. And the edges are often glue ready in a single pass.

Yes, we use track saws a lot at work. With a sharp blade and correct use you can definitely glue up straight from the saw. And arrow straight and square every time. Also great for cutting the waney edge off a board so you can then rip to width on the table saw too.

 

[Bruce Johnson]

I forgot to mention that the cute little Porter-Cable electric block plane does have a one-piece spiral cutter. That's one of the other things that caught my attention about it. I'm not sure why the cutter is removed and sitting in the case, but it looks to be clean and sharp. So, this little machine is less likely to cause tearout than a normal straight-knife jointer. Although it may not be quite as good as the end face of a router bit. I'll have to test it and find out.