Lets talk about 'Mint'

[Fuzzbass]

But you have to bear in mind the age of the instrument. For a 1975 it is in excellent condition. And if I'm not mistaken, guides like 'Blue' books & The Vintage Guitar Price Guide do factor age into condition ratings.

If so, that's a shame. I'll say it again: I'm glad I no longer lust after vintage instruments (or cars or whatever).

That aside: the claims of "near mint" and "undisturbed since it left the factory" are just plain ridiculous even when age is taken into account.

I'm delighted that it was resolved to the buyer's satisfaction.

 

[electracoyote]

If 'Mint' doesn't mean 'Mint' at any age or vintage, there is no common ground between buyers and sellers on what the actual condition of an instrument is. Just because a rare, vintage instrument is in 'Very Good' condition, it doesn't mean that it can be deemed 'Mint' just because there aren't many examples of them to be found. Otherwise, ratings become arbitrary and meaningless instead of a unifying standard.

That's the point. Terms like "mint" "EC" "VGC" etc. will always be very subjective and subject to the individual's interpretation and ulterior motives.

Anyone who assesses and buys an instrument based on those kinds of descriptors is setting themselves up for disappointment. If any reader of this thread takes anything away from this experience, it should be: DON'T PUT ANY STOCK IN THE ABBREVIATED OR CLICHE'D DESCRIPTORS SELLERS USE SUCH AS "MINT" OR "EC." It's only window dressing, and potentially misleading.

You should be getting specific details of any and all flaws separating the instrument from "mint", no matter how minor, and they should be supported by quality pictures. Especially when we're talking about a significant sum of money.

Then YOU can make up YOUR own mind as to the true and accurate condition of the item, instead of trusting nebulous terms like "mint." You have a duty to protect yourself.

Moral Of The Story: In this case, the seller did provide a lot of evidence that the bass was not "mint" despite his misuse of that term. Yet the buyer was a bit gullible, got seduced, and laid his money down anyway. I think the buyer has to accept part of the blame for the misconception. He ignored or downplayed the warning signs. If the buyer had ignored the flowery language and window dressing, and looked at the concrete evidence instead, the misunderstanding could have been avoided and any price negotiations could have been made pre-sale.

The buyer admits he was aware of some of the flaws before he bought the bass--well, that's not "mint," yo!

 

[Yango]

Guy bought a bass.

Ha, ha, ha! Good one. Thank you very much!

 

[AltGrendel]

Best I would give it is "near mint".

Nice bass though.

 

[Coolhandjjl]

Gotta luv TB. OP already has things resolved with the seller, and the thread keeps going on and on......

 

[Jeff Scott]

Gotta luv TB. OP already has things resolved with the seller, and the thread keeps going on and on......

Satisfaction guaranteed!

 

[GBassNorth]

Despite the fact that I'm sure it's riveting, I can't be bothered. Please give me the Reader's Digest version. Congratulations on your induction into the "Thread Police Force", by the way.

Actually the blow by blow goes something like this...
-Seller lists a vintage bass with very misleading headline claiming its in "mint" condition but then clearly states in the body of the ad that's its "near mint" and proceeds to show photos and provide descriptions of the various dings and damage.
-Buyer sees headline and all the pretty pictures and is seduced into believing its mint so he buys it at what he feels is fair for a mint condition bass.
-Buyer receives the bass and is surprised at the amount of wear and damage on the bass.
-Buyer turns to TB to get a better understanding of what "mint" is and how much the bass really is worth vs what he paid and provides close up pictures of all the damage along with his interpretation of what condition the ad said the bass was in.
-With only the buyers half of the story and no link to the sellers ad a "well informed" TB lynch mob quickly forms and proceeds to verbally rip the seller a new one.
-A level headed TBer finds a copy of the ad and posts it which clearly shows how the seller carefully crafted the ad to mislead but covered his butt with some pics and disclaimers on the actual condition.
-meanwhile the lynch mob has gained momentum and the piling on effect continues
-The buyer contacts the seller and explains his dissatisfaction and they agree on a reduced price for the bass vs the seller having to return it.
-The seller is now happy with the reduced price and the 1975 P Bass which most would agree is in very good condition considering its age.
-And they all lived happily ever after.

 

[Jeff Scott]

Actually the blow by blow goes something like this...
-Seller lists a vintage bass with very misleading headline claiming its in "mint" condition but then clearly states in the body of the ad that's its "near mint" and proceeds to show photos and provide descriptions of the various dings and damage.
-Buyer sees headline and all the pretty pictures and is seduced into believing its mint so he buys it at what he feels is fair for a mint condition bass.
-Buyer receives the bass and is surprised at the amount of wear and damage on the bass.
-Buyer turns to TB to get a better understanding of what "mint" is and how much the bass really is worth vs what he paid and provides close up pictures of all the damage along with his interpretation of what condition the ad said the bass was in.
-With only the buyers half of the story and no link to the sellers ad a "well informed" TB lynch mob quickly forms and proceeds to verbally rip the seller a new one.
-A level headed TBer finds a copy of the ad and posts it which clearly shows how the seller carefully crafted the ad to mislead but covered his butt with some pics and disclaimers on the actual condition.
-meanwhile the lynch mob has gained momentum and the piling on effect continues
-The buyer contacts the seller and explains his dissatisfaction and they agree on a reduced price for the bass vs the seller having to return it.
-The seller is now happy with the reduced price and the 1975 P Bass which most would agree is in very good condition considering its age.
-And they all lived happily ever after.

You forgot to add at the end:

-The lynch mob continues on it's mission.............

 

[GBassNorth]

You forgot to add at the end:

-The lynch mob continues on it's mission.............

LOL - ain't that the truth!
And to think, the only reason there's even a lynch mob is because the OP cried wolf when in reality it was just a coyote. There should be a TB rule that states if your going to claim foul on a misleading ad you need to at least post the ad your referencing and preferably invite the seller to defend their position. Then at least the TB mob knows which direction to throw the rocks.

Seems like when these types of issues are brought up on TB it usually starts out like a mass spectator wave at a stadium (fairly orderly but all like minded) and then degrades into a mosh pit in the infield . But I guess that's life.

 

[10cc]

1. I wouldn't want mint anything. I'm too rough on things.
2. I'd wonder why an instrument 40 years old is mint.
3. I'd never pay over $1500 for any Fender from the mid seventies on.
4. That bass in not mint. (of course we ALL know this)

Damn just realized I was late to the rumble. Hahahaha

 

[Sixgunn]

What are those black abominations where some nice steel rounds are supposed to be?!?!?!?

 

[Tom Howland]

To me this bass is not mint. It is a 1975, in very good+ to excellent. It is a 40 year old bass, all original.
If this were say a 1960-Precision in this shape, it would be an excellent rated due to the added age.
They are getting harder to find. Period.

 

[jmpiwonka]

2. I'd wonder why an instrument 40 years old is mint.

based on most of the descriptions in this thread of what "mint" is
there exists not a single vintage fender bass that could possibly be "mint"

 

[10cc]

based on most of the descriptions in this thread of what "mint" is
there exists not a single vintage fender bass that could possibly be "mint"

Yeah maybe seafoam but not mint.

 

[Spinal Tapper]

I'm curious - I need a point of view from some of you guys who are into 'mint' stuff...are you really gonna play it or just hang it on a wall?

What happens if you bump the headstock into a cymbol, or the straplock comes loose and the bass goes crashing to the floor? Do you then sell the instrument because it is no longer mint condition?

 

[GBassNorth]

based on most of the descriptions in this thread of what "mint" is
there exists not a single vintage fender bass that could possibly be "mint"

Yep!
To some collectors of fine coins, mint might even imply it has never been touched by human hands. Probably aren't any vintage basses that can make that claim.

 

[Mastermold]

I'm curious - I need a point of view from some of you guys who are into 'mint' stuff...are you really gonna play it or just hang it on a wall?

What happens if you bump the headstock into a cymbol, or the straplock comes loose and the bass goes crashing to the floor? Do you then sell the instrument because it is no longer mint condition?

That brings up a good point--the fact these are instruments, not wall art. They should be taken care of and not abused, but they should be played. Billy Gibbons still plays his $250,000 50's Les Pauls. Stradivarius violins are still played.

 

[GBassNorth]

I'm curious - I need a point of view from some of you guys who are into 'mint' stuff...are you really gonna play it or just hang it on a wall?

What happens if you bump the headstock into a cymbol, or the straplock comes loose and the bass goes crashing to the floor? Do you then sell the instrument because it is no longer mint condition?

I have some basses and guitars that I would call mint (in a discussion, not as a descriptor in sales) and I play some of them regularly, while others are in a vault and only get out for scheduled maintenance. Some of my basses will never leave my home others will get played out but will never leave my sight. I don't really own any beater basses right now but have considered getting an SG standard so I can preserve the quality of my SG Supreme. I guess people that like to judge other people might consider me evil. Why do you ask?

 

[Spinal Tapper]

I really just want to keep the thread going even though the issue is resolved with the OP and seller.

I see a lot of threads of guys wanting to return their bass because it came with a tiny chip, or some who are afraid to buy used instruments because it might have a TEENY-TINY scratch on it when it arrives - even if it looks like a great score (to me).

I guess I just look at an instrument as a tool and not a collectors item or a piece of artwork. I gig all three of my pre-CBS Fender basses, and my 1975 P is my trusty workhorse. So a new wear mark or a scuff is like a badge of honor to a guy like me who plays out a lot.

What do you guys do when the back of the neck starts to show player wear or the back of the body - just from normal, every day playing. Do you stop using that instrument all together? Go get it repaired/refinished?

 

[bevan lurrito]

Mint tastes "minty" because of menthol. Menthol is an organic compound which is a waxy or crystalline, and is solid at room temperature. The main form of menthol occurring in nature is the (1R,2S,5R) configuration. Menthol has local anesthetic and counterirritant qualities. Menthol also acts as a weak kappa opioid receptor agonist.