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Low Down Sound Club, Part Four

#281
atrapp said:
How was this resolved?
Click to expand...

I had an issue with the last cabinet that Don built for me (wrong dimensions.) While it was a frustrating experience to deal with, Don handled it well. He allowed me to keep the misbuilt cab while he completed the new cab, shipped it to me, and covered the cost of returning the first cab. I won't lie and say that he didn't try to talk me into keeping the first cab, but he didn't try very hard and made sure to let me know that we was going to make me happy in the end. He was willing to do exactly what it took to make it right.

Building a custom cab can be a challenging experience. Even with a talented builder like Don, you have to have some working knowledge of cabinet construction relative to what you want and what your tonal desires may be. You might find out that, in the end, the concept you created with your builder might not exactly be what you were looking for. The key is communication. Whether it's Don, or anyone else, you have to clearly communicate your goals for the cab and make sure you stay consistent with those goals throughout the build.

Building a custom cab isn't for everyone. If you want absolute predictability and consistency, then there are a number of proven designs that you can buy off the shelf today. But, if you have unique need (either tonal or asthethic) then a custom cab can be a rewarding experience.
 
#282
guy n. cognito said:
Well, yes, when that person says they want sub-like performance. I try not to be in the business of telling people they don't want what they want.
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When it comes to bass players, I'll be honest and say I just tune it out when they say they want "sub like performance" until they have a really super good reason for it.

Maybe that makes me a jerk, and maybe it makes me a realist, but honestly, what makes the Kappalites so awesome is producing 60hz with authority and handling huge transients gracefully. Going down to 45hz is a nice perk, but not necessary for 9 out of 10 people.
 
#283
rpsands said:
When it comes to bass players, I'll be honest and say I just tune it out when they say they want "sub like performance" until they have a really super good reason for it.

Maybe that makes me a jerk, and maybe it makes me a realist, but honestly, what makes the Kappalites so awesome is producing 60hz with authority and handling huge transients gracefully. Going down to 45hz is a nice perk, but not necessary for 9 out of 10 people.
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Different people have different desires. Typically, trying to talk them out of something that they really want isn't going to be very fruitful.

While I would agree that I don't have much use for "sub-like" range in my bass rig either, some play a style of music that makes it more appropriate. A 3015LF application would allow that person to experiment lower into sub-frequencies, yet still get solid full-range performance if they change their mind. The TC, OTOH, won't allow that person to experience the lows they may think they need. Said another away, it's better to have it and not use it than to not have it at all.
 
#284
These next-gen cab threads are so bitchy, sheesh. :rollno:

Anyways, I get tons of grind and mid presence from my bass and from my head (an AG500,) and I really like the sound of my head into monitors. The idea of having that sound live is a nice one for me, plus getting the volume of a huge cab in an 80lb-ish medium sized cab.

Otherwise I'd just get another GS412.
 
#286
Don will build you just about anything. I asked him to build me a fridge, and he came through with flying colors. It was a bitch to ship, though.
 

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#289
::::BASSIST:::: said:
He built me a pair of 3012HO 112s which I was displeased with. Chuffing in the ports with low-end I like to dial in. Some said the ports were too small.

They sure did look nice though...

LDScabs013-1.jpg
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I remember those. KILLER sounding cabs. I was still living in Detroit when you had the 'chuffing' issue. As you remember, when you sent one back for evaluation, I actually tried to replicate your issue, and even with a 15 db boost with a 40hz shelving control on my F500, I could not replicate the chuffing. Given that the RH450 you were using at the time was very attenuated down low, our guess was it was some sort of sympathetic vibration going on in the room you were playing in (edit: or , as I posted below, some strange interaction between technique, amp, bass, EQ that just lined up to do funny things with that particular cab design... it does happen).

That being said, the small 3012HO cabs are VERY midrange present, and given that you now totally dig a 15/6, that is pretty much night and day difference. So, these were just not the cabs for you. I absolutely loved them for my tone, and I believe the new owner is thrilled with them. I prefer the slightly more open sound of the similar box that Don makes with the 3015 nonLF driver, but two of the 3012HO boxes stacked is a dream rig for those who are more interested in definition and 'hearing the windings on the E string' versus big, open low end with no midrange bump.

Don is exceptional at providing after the sale customer service, and even works with customers who just 'don't like the cab he built', even if there isn't an actual problem.:smug:
 
#290
KJung said:
I remember those. KILLER sounding cabs. I was still living in Detroit when you had the 'chuffing' issue. As you remember, when you sent one back for evaluation, I actually tried to replicate your issue, and even with a 15 db boost with a 40hz shelving control on my F500, I could not replicate the chuffing. Given that the RH450 you were using at the time was very attenuated down low, our guess was it was some sort of sympathetic vibration going on in the room you were playing in.

:
Click to expand...

That's interesting. Good of you to stop in. ;)
 
#291
guy n. cognito said:
That's interesting. Good of you to stop in. ;)
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Spec'ing out and ordering a pure custom cab is a risky business, and Don knows it. He (as you know) is VERY good about dealing with issues, whether it is his screw up (which happens), or damage to a box in shipping, or even, as above, a player who ends up just not liking the box or experiences issues that can't be replicated (and that doesn't mean the issue isn't there either... there is a huge interaction among technique, bass, head, cab, volume, EQ, etc.. Sometimes a 'perfect storm' happens that ends up making a piece of gear just not work for a given player. Don realizes that 100%).

I know my buddy Chef (who has VERY good ears) had chuffing issues with the Bergantino AE410. It turns out a few others have had that issue also, while the vast majority don't (I also couldn't replicate chuffing on the AE410, no matter what I did, and I almost blew up my box trying to replicate it). I am 100% convinced Chef 'heard what he heard', and even though that box works wonderfully for the vast majority of players, for some, like any piece of gear, it just doesn't.
 
#292
Chef; BergAE410....
Yeah; true story.
Sound guy at the venue wouldn't mic the cab because of it, so it wasn't "just something only I was hearing."

Drag, because aside from that, I loved the cab.
I never boost bass eq, and in fact had it cut at that point.

I've got "fat fingers" or something.

The first "supercab" experience I had was a 15/6 Don built.
It had grill cloth.
For whatever reason, I was able to make the grill cloth flap so hard I couldn't mic that one either.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Currently, I have a 4x8+horn, 2x8+horn, 2x8+5" mid driver that have served me perfectly for years and years.
And, the 12/6/1+12 sub totally kicks it.
 
#293
Chef said:
Chef; BergAE410....
Yeah; true story.
Sound guy at the venue wouldn't mic the cab because of it, so it wasn't "just something only I was hearing."

Drag, because aside from that, I loved the cab.
I never boost bass eq, and in fact had it cut at that point.

I've got "fat fingers" or something.
Click to expand...

It happens.... lots on 'non-linear' type interactions between all this stuff that results in some very good gear having issues sometimes for individual players. The Markbass initial gain stage is another one. For 99% of players, it works fine. For those few players who dial in massive bass at the instrument, and have very aggressive technique, there is some compression that happens at the input stage that you just can't really dial out given those situations.

The cool thing about Don is that he realizes, with the pure custom thing, that this sometimes happens through no fault of anyone really.
 
#298
KJung said:
I remember those. KILLER sounding cabs. I was still living in Detroit when you had the 'chuffing' issue. As you remember, when you sent one back for evaluation, I actually tried to replicate your issue, and even with a 15 db boost with a 40hz shelving control on my F500, I could not replicate the chuffing. Given that the RH450 you were using at the time was very attenuated down low, our guess was it was some sort of sympathetic vibration going on in the room you were playing in (edit: or , as I posted below, some strange interaction between technique, amp, bass, EQ that just lined up to do funny things with that particular cab design... it does happen).

That being said, the small 3012HO cabs are VERY midrange present, and given that you now totally dig a 15/6, that is pretty much night and day difference. So, these were just not the cabs for you. I absolutely loved them for my tone, and I believe the new owner is thrilled with them. I prefer the slightly more open sound of the similar box that Don makes with the 3015 nonLF driver, but two of the 3012HO boxes stacked is a dream rig for those who are more interested in definition and 'hearing the windings on the E string' versus big, open low end with no midrange bump.

Don is exceptional at providing after the sale customer service, and even works with customers who just 'don't like the cab he built', even if there isn't an actual problem.:smug:
Click to expand...

+1. Don built built me a vertical 212/horn cab with the 3012HO's and it is killer for my needs. No problem whatsoever cutting through a dense mix, and still able to hear myself, even outside gigs. One cab I can use for just about everything.
 
#299
Hey guys, I'm intrigued by this thread and the LDS website.

I want/need to lighten the load.

I've shrunk my set up to the TH 500 driving a MESA PH 210/8 ohm or a Scout 12/4ohm.
The PH is 53 pounds and I love the bottom end and punch. It takes me two hands and/or a small dolly. The Scout is 38 pounds and I love the voice/growl I get and can carry one handed; yet it's awkward.

I don't need a huge rig anymore around town and if needed, they'll backline a rig for me. Don't use my 1989 SWR 410 anymore, but I'm not gonna part with it.

That being said I saw the 3x8s on the LDS site and am curious of the 12/6 or 15/6 vibe.
I play fingerstyle predominently, occaisonal pick and/or slap.

Your thoughts???
 

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