Sounds like there may be something wrong with it or perhaps the gain was set too high. I have used mine many times at 4 to 5 with my Berg AE410 and it's loud as hell and no distortion.
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MarkBass Little Mark Tube 800
- Thread starter Red Planet
- Start date
Are you sure it wasn't your drivers breaking up. While I didn't totally dig the tone of the 800, it was just loud as heck and clean as a whistle through my cabs (AE410 and 410UL). Something not quite right IMO and IME.
HOWEVER, when I had my SD800 (which again, to me ear, is very similar in tone profile to the LMTube800), I found that, in a mix, it actually was not as loud as my LMII, given the different nature of the low end (wider and deeper, but not particularly punchy). Also, the upper mid harshness of that amp just killed me, and if you don't dial the upper mids back a LOT (like almost to 9 o'clock), the amp can actually sound 'distorted' up there... that very raspy, clanky, hump at around 1K or so. So, that amp, when set flat, has a strange combination (again, to my ear) of 'deep bass, polite low mids, and very goosed upper mids', which is exactly the yin yang of my tone goals.
So, if you didn't have the upper mids dialed down, you might have had that big upper mid bump sitting right on the top end of those 15" drivers, which can get real ugly really quickly.
IMO.
- Aug 21, 2003
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Makes me just want to stay with the LMII
BTW I have not had a gig yet where LMII did not supply enough volume (Those days are over) I'm always sending a line to the house anyways.
Makes me just want to stay with the LMII
BTW I have not had a gig yet where LMII did not supply enough volume (Those days are over) I'm always sending a line to the house anyways.
The volume thing, I think, depends a bit on the instrument and voicing/tone goal. For example, Tommy Kennedy uses an SD800, and with his 'soap bar bridge pickup only, dig in super hard at the bridge' tone, that head and his MB 410 cabs supposedly just screams. He would probably destroy the LMII.
However, for my 'softer' technique, and my wider tone (typically a J bass with both pickups on full), the SD800/LMTube800 was too much of a good thing (i.e., the 'deep lows, polite lower mids, upper mid bump sort of voicing sat too close to my ash/maple instruments, making the whole rig sound 'unbalanced' to my ear).
So, again, it probably seems like I'm doggin' the LM800/LM800Tube/SD800 pretty hard, but what I'm trying to do is describe the tone, which did not work for me, but which might work VERY well for others with different tone goals, cabs, and especially basses/technique.
IMO as always!
Did I ever mention how much I love, love, love the F1/F500
So confused! The MarkBass website claims the LM 800 as a LMIII with more power...but apparently it just doesn't sound the same? All I'm trying to do is get the mojo of an LMII (now III) with a little more power and possibly a few more features.
Per my many other posts, the LM800 is NOT an LMIII with more power. Totally different class D versus class A/B design, and a very different tone (not better, not worse, but different). The only thing 'LM" about it to my ear is the box size/footprint.The LM800 is just an LMTube800 with a few less features, and should sound identical to the LMTube800 in '100% SS mode' (I haven't tried the LM800 though, but did spend a bit of time with the LMTube800 in full SS mode, which sounded 94% the same as in 100% tube mode
).Put another way, the best way to think of the LM800 is that it is an SD800 in a smaller box without the semi-parametric mid EQ controls.
IMO and mostly IME.
Edit: The SA450 is basically the LMII with more features (although no more power). That might be an option for you. It's basically the LMII in a larger box with the fully featured DI (that is not included in the LMIII spec), and the semi-parametric mid controls. It's still very light, sounds virtually identical IMO to the LMII when set flat, and gives you those few additional features that are pretty useful. No more power though.
I was on the same search for you a while back, and bought an SD800 using the same logic (i.e., I loved the LMII, and figured if I could get that tone in a super high powered but still lightweight unit with more features, I would die and go to heaven). I ended up being very disappointed for the reasons sited in my other posts above. I finally ended up with an F1, which is 'similar' to the LMII, but is tighter, quicker, and a bit louder (it has yet another class D amp design, and the slightly tighter low end and the more present mids makes the notes 'jump out' of this head a bit more than the LMII, which at least gives the impression of more absolute volume, and definitely more 'presence in the mix'. IMO again!
Sorry KJ, you did explain that right below. I'm getting confused by the wide variety of names from MB. So the answer is - if you want the same tonal qualities as the LMII/III with more power...The F1/F500 I suppose. Frustrating; has me looking at TecAmp, etc. I love the sounds of the big Mesa rig, but I can't stand moving it for short (1 hr) shows.
That is TBer Vic's recommendation.
And yes, since I like the MB stuff so much, I've kind of forced myself to go to school on the names, and have played quite a few of the executions (I've owned the SD800 and SA450... again, like you, looking for that elusive 'LMII but just a bit more' magic).
The best way to think about it IMO is to lump the MB amps into 4 groups (ignoring the big tube head).
The 'LMII' sounding group: LMII, LM250, LMK, SA450, LMIII, LMTube. These are the class A/B power amp models (there are other ones with special features like tube compressors, etc., but I put them in a separate bucket) that have IMO that warm, organic but even and full tone that many LMII owners rave about. Power ranges from 250 to 500 watts RMS into 4ohms.
The 'SD800' sounding group..... SD800, LM800, LMTube800, SD1200. These are the higher powered class D amps, and have that more wide low end and more aggressive upper mid response to my ear... a 'less warm' tone IMO. The '800' name models are 750 watts into 4ohms. The 1200 is not surprisingly more powerful (haven't played that one, not sure when it will hit the US. I ASSUME it will be a more powerful but similar sounding SD800, but who knows).
The F1/F500.... my favorites... yet another, different class D power amp, and the tone is closer to the LMII than the SD800. Quicker and tighter than the LMII, and a bit more aggressive in the upper mids and treble, but much punchier and 'warmer' than the 'SD800 class' amps. The F500 is just the F1 with more features... identical tone. These are both 500 watts into 4ohms, but again seem to have a touch more 'ooomph' than the class A/B LMII class of amps.
All others.... This is my lazy way of lumping all the other executions that have stuff I'm not interested in... tube compressors/pre's (501/503.. which do have the nice LMII type class A/B power amp, but are more expensive with the tube type features), multiple distortion channels (Studio Pre 500), special hybrid designs meant to more closely mimic tube amps (R500).
What gets confusing is that the four new 'LM' heads are grouped together (IMO) based on footprint, not tone.
Whew.... a little compulsive on my part, but that's the way I keep all of these in some sort of 'tonal order'.
Edit: I wonder what the 600 watt Momark power module sounds like. If it's a more powerful F1 type tone.... whoa nelly!
Man oh man, I'm sitting here with a brand new LM3 and the MB bag for it setting on the chair in my music room. I haven't even opened them factory seals still intact. I must say I got what I thought was a great deal from MF. Given they're great satisfaction policy I can sure send the LM3 back and get the LM tube 800.
But I am so torn thinking the LM800 tube "looks like the way to go" now. I really can't find much data to make a decision with and what I do is about equally positive for both. I have my Epi UL410s and can't help but think the 800 watts is better suited to the Epi specs. But the LM2 I had sounded so good (before my Epis) I'm just undecided and confused. ??????
Any help in the search for data on these 2 heads gentlemen?
Hi. I've had the 410UL SI cab and also owned the SD800, which is supposed to be very much like the new LM800. IMHO it was NOT a good match at all. Alternatively, I still own my LMII and it was excellent with the Epi 410 cab. I think you've got a winner there.
- Aug 21, 2003
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- 18,593
- Disclosures
- A-Designs Mike Lull GK Tsunami Cables GHS Strings RMI Basswitch Nordstrand Pickups Darkglass
I'm not completely up with everything MB is doing right now, however I tried my friends F1 with it digital power amp and swap it out with LMII and could hear the difference in the upper low end register a bit.
I don't think the LM Tube 800 would work for me knowing that it uses digital power.
I don't need tighter sounding amps (based on my technique with my right hand further back then most and already playing brighter then average sound basses).
I don't think the LM Tube 800 would work for me knowing that it uses digital power.
I don't need tighter sounding amps (based on my technique with my right hand further back then most and already playing brighter then average sound basses).
Dr Funk
"If you ain't appearing then you be disappearing"
I read stuff like this and want to run out and buy more MB amps just to try them out myself!
I'm really happy with my LMII for now. It has enough power for everything I use it for (small clubs, church, recording, etc.) and the tone is perfect (to my ear) with any of my Fender basses (both P and Jazz). Where I don't care for it as much is with my Rickenbacker basses, which seem to sound best with my Ampeg SVT-CL. It's not that they sound bad with the LMII, just not as good. But overall I could probably get away with using my LMII forever and never using another amp head -- that's how much I dig it. They really have nailed the micro amp thing.
When I used the LM Tube 800 I had the gain on the amp set perfect so that the clip light would only go once in a while and that was with very hard playing. I always keep my bass e.q. at center detent. No boost or cut. When I had my LMII I never had any problem with distortion. Even at high volumes and sometime having my bass e.q. turned up a little. Maybe there was something wrong with the LM Tube 800 I bought from G.C.
Even though it came sealed in a box. Either way it's G.C.'s problem now I returned it for a refund yesterday.
I am buying a Genz Benz Shuttle 12.0 next Monday. Also if I have extra money I am going to buy the LMIII and go with something I know works for me.
I have to admit that I was dissapointed that the LM Tube 800 did not have a good tube sound. Even though I am not a big tube fan I wanted to have one head the would have a tube warmth sound. I thought the LM Tube 800 would do that for me without the weight. Oh well.
We shall see what the GB Shuttle 12.0 will hold. I talked with Mr. Genz today. He seems like a nice guy. And it was nice to have the secretary send me directly to him when I asked for someone to talk to about some questions I had about the 12.0.
KJung how do you like your 12.0?
Even though it came sealed in a box. Either way it's G.C.'s problem now I returned it for a refund yesterday.
I am buying a Genz Benz Shuttle 12.0 next Monday. Also if I have extra money I am going to buy the LMIII and go with something I know works for me.
I have to admit that I was dissapointed that the LM Tube 800 did not have a good tube sound. Even though I am not a big tube fan I wanted to have one head the would have a tube warmth sound. I thought the LM Tube 800 would do that for me without the weight. Oh well.
We shall see what the GB Shuttle 12.0 will hold. I talked with Mr. Genz today. He seems like a nice guy. And it was nice to have the secretary send me directly to him when I asked for someone to talk to about some questions I had about the 12.0.
KJung how do you like your 12.0?
Don't own a Genz product. Their voicing and design goals are not my thing. However, the 12 (and 6 Max) seem VERY cool.
I might very well own one some day. It seems to be a great spec, especially if you use two 4ohm cabs! Too many knobs for me though
Ya that is the thing that concerns me, too many knobs. I kinda of an old school GK800 guy. That is why I own an Hartke LH1000. I like simplicity. But I have got to check this out. Plus I am getting a good deal on it.
That's pretty amazing. Maybe it was broken. Just curious... by "6" do you mean six clicks from zero or 6 o'clock?
I may go play one of the Tube 800 just to hear it myself.
There are times I have gotten some considerable distortion out of my LMIII.
The SM 12.0 will rock your world and has better tone than the LMIII IMO. I just really like the footprint of the LMIII over the SM 12.0 (if that makes any sense at all) and the LMIII does sound good.
The SM 12.0 does have a lot of knobs. I discount what Ken was saying about Genz, one can easily dial in LMIII tone with the SM 12.0, easily. The up side (as I see it), the SM 12 can be much more Strategically aimed than any of the LM series (though perhaps this is not fair to compare these specific models) and has waaaayyyy more power on tap. The down side, everyone might run off and leave you while your sighting in the target.
There are times I have gotten some considerable distortion out of my LMIII.
The SM 12.0 will rock your world and has better tone than the LMIII IMO. I just really like the footprint of the LMIII over the SM 12.0 (if that makes any sense at all) and the LMIII does sound good.
The SM 12.0 does have a lot of knobs. I discount what Ken was saying about Genz, one can easily dial in LMIII tone with the SM 12.0, easily. The up side (as I see it), the SM 12 can be much more Strategically aimed than any of the LM series (though perhaps this is not fair to compare these specific models) and has waaaayyyy more power on tap. The down side, everyone might run off and leave you while your sighting in the target.
I tried the LMTube800 and was also dissapointed. The difference btw tube and SS was not very noticable.
I'm hanging on to my LMII
I'm hanging on to my LMII
