Thankyou
...Its nice to know that you've got my back Chef...the feeling is mutual about that M9 of yours...Peace...DAcat
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Mesa/Boogie Official Club Thread...Part #2
- Thread starter lobey
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Thankyou
...Its nice to know that you've got my back Chef...the feeling is mutual about that M9 of yours...Peace...DAcat
Ah hem, you had an AE410 and that took care of that problem for me
. I just picked up some DB112s and they sound great with my GK MB2500 and can't wait to try them with the M6. Hopefully tomorrow.
- Apr 3, 2003
- 35,516
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- Editor-in-Chief, Bass Gear Magazine
Ah hem, you had an AE410 and that took care of that problem for me
+1 Well-played, sir.
Chef, I'll hold him down, you can throw ping pong balls at him until he cries for mommy.Ah hem, you had an AE410 and that took care of that problem for me
(multiview of latest boogie gear) Currently just use the 2-1x15s recently loaded w/ eminence kappalite 3015s + M2000 mosfet. Running 2 indentical cabs does = better tone. Found the 2nd 1x15 (no cover) for $125 2 months ago. Took out the JBL pa speaker that was in it.
all my boog stuff in 2005. Ran a 400+ (w/ alesis compressor) into 2x10/2x15. Overkill, (specially to tour w/, but man did it thunder). comments from other bassists, pro to novice.
had to trim some fat, the only piece I bought brand new.
all my boog stuff in 2005. Ran a 400+ (w/ alesis compressor) into 2x10/2x15. Overkill, (specially to tour w/, but man did it thunder). comments from other bassists, pro to novice.
had to trim some fat, the only piece I bought brand new.
Man, classic boogie bass gear and warwick... a match made in heaven. Something about that combo that just TOTALLY works.
Ah hem, you had an AE410 and that took care of that problem for me
+1
Not sure a narrow band 30hz slider is going to do much to tighten up the low end. More importantly, being able to punch up low mids and then lower the volume will more likely than not get you where you need to go. However, the UL/M6 matchup does not seem particularly good to me for the reason you stated... to much low end, not enough low mid punch... the M9 should work much better.
So, don't worry so much about the lowest slider, which again will not act like a hi pass filter (which is probably what is really needed with the M6). However, punching up around 125-250 hz should get you where you need to go, without particularly have to mess to much with rolling off low end.
IMO and a long, many years of IME before I realized 'too much low end' most of the time meant 'not enough low mids'
On the whole M6/UL thing... man I could swear I had really good results by using the bass control, with it's sort of multi-faceted cutting characteristics, and maybe even "worst case", using voicing 4 and then tweaking from there.
From the manual:
"As the BASS control is dialed below 12:00, 55Hz and all associated harmonics are reduced and eventually notched completely out of the signal. Conversely, there is a 6db per octave cut beginning at 55Hz going down to 20Hz where the shelving ends with a cut gain of -20db as the control approaches 7:30 (off)."
This really seems like, if you aren't afraid to roll it off aggressively as needed, it should work pretty well. Maybe rolling it off a lot in conjunction with voicing 4 or even 5, maybe even with some tweaking of the mid control as well?
I may have to mess with this some more, and I know a lot of this is personal pref and playing style, but I've used my M6 with my UL(2)410 a LOT and it's always worked great for me.
From the manual:
"As the BASS control is dialed below 12:00, 55Hz and all associated harmonics are reduced and eventually notched completely out of the signal. Conversely, there is a 6db per octave cut beginning at 55Hz going down to 20Hz where the shelving ends with a cut gain of -20db as the control approaches 7:30 (off)."
This really seems like, if you aren't afraid to roll it off aggressively as needed, it should work pretty well. Maybe rolling it off a lot in conjunction with voicing 4 or even 5, maybe even with some tweaking of the mid control as well?
I may have to mess with this some more, and I know a lot of this is personal pref and playing style, but I've used my M6 with my UL(2)410 a LOT and it's always worked great for me.
I don't think rolling off below 50hz is the issue, versus plugging the low mid hole in both that amp's voicing (IMO) and that cabs voicing (IMO). I find both the midrange knob and the 5 position mid knob set too high to work for this reason, and rolling off the bass control, while useful, doesn't really 'fix the issue' that I have with that combination (and seemingly what Chef is experiencing).
Again, if you are digging the tone, then there is no problem. Just commenting on Chef's post, where he was thinking that cutting a narrow Q 30hz band would make a big difference. IMO, probably not... probably not hearing much down there anyway.
That's what's confusing me tho... 170Hz centered boost is too high?? That seems perfect to me. I would think using voicing 5 to boost the low mids, along with maybe cutting some of the bass to just tighten that up (maybe even just to cap off some of the extra lows added by the voicing), should actually work pretty well.
I've even done this with my UL310 and it's worked very well, and I do agree that these are not mid-forward cabs... especially the 310.
Maybe its the Q on that knob... just sounded mid mid boosted to me, with WAY too much boost to be useful for 'cab/head' matching... sounded much more like an 'effect' to me (not a bad effect... super burpy for sure. Again, if it works for you, it works
Didn't work for me at all with the 410UL, and again, more commenting on what Chef is hearing. IMO and IME!
Per the other comments above, this is a zero issue with the AE410, since that strong low mid voicing yin and yangs very nicely with the M6 without much knob twisting at all (at least for my tone goal of a mid present but not nasal, punchy tone with a relatively tight low end, and a relatively high low mid to deep bass ratio.
I hear ya, honestly. Just trying to figure out how our experiences differed that much. No biggie. BTW, the Q is described as "medium" in the manual, so again, I was thinking it should work ok.Maybe its the Q on that knob... just sounded mid mid boosted to me, with WAY too much boost to be useful for 'cab/head' matching... sounded much more like an 'effect' to me (not a bad effect... super burpy for sure. Again, if it works for you, it works
IMO and IME!
I need to experiment with it again just to re-familiarize tho. It's been a while since I messed with the voicings. I will say tho, that of the voicings, 4 and 5 were my faves, but I did have to "tame them down" a bit with other controls after setting them.
I guess my main question, and really, this probably has to go to Alan, is what kinda' quality time he's spent with the voicings. My curiosity would center around wondering if the strength of the voicing effect shy'd him away before first taking a little time to really explore tweaking out that "preshape" to suit.
Anyway, it could just e a rhetorical question here as well... maybe just food for thought for others.
Chef
In Memoriam
The one night, and the one venue I had the big boomy low end, I tried every voicing, briefly.
I generally prefer voice 2, with bass at about 10 o'clock, and mids at about 2 oclock.
I haven't really had that experience since.
I understand the 30hz isn't the same as a high pass, but I bet it woulda cured that case for me.
I generally prefer voice 2, with bass at about 10 o'clock, and mids at about 2 oclock.
I haven't really had that experience since.
I understand the 30hz isn't the same as a high pass, but I bet it woulda cured that case for me.
And sometimes, if the room is bad enough, it really doesn't matter what the heck you are using and what knobs you are twisting... you are just screwed!
That being said, I think less interactive and more straightforward graphic on the M9 will greatly improve your chances to quickly dial in a good sound in more acoustical context (especially difficult ones), and still keep (and I assume improve) the great, general tone of the M6.
This may be a bit late in the game, and forensic if you won't be back there soon, but it woulda' been really interesting if you had used voicing 5 to boost the low mids, and then just used the mid/bass controls to tweak from there.
On the boost voicings, they seem pretty strong to me, so I generally also had to drop my input gain to compensate, but I could swear I got a nice tight low mid boost effect that way... even with the less mid foward sounding cabs.
Anyway, FWIW.
You know what? I think I have a test case this Friday. I'm sitting in with a progressive country band and we're playing in a converted grain bin with tin walls and a concrete floor. I'll bring the M9 and my UL310... the "worst case scenario" and see what ends up working best. Alan, would a single coil ash/maple Sadowsky J5 be good to try and reproduce what you were using that fateful night? Or maybe the LG5? I'm also gonna' bring a mid forward bass just in case.
Chef
In Memoriam
I had the two Metros:
RV5-PJ
RV5-JJ with HC's
M6>UL410
This was at "Prison Brews," and the building sounds similar to your upcoming deal. Big room, all concrete, no floor or wall coverings, tall ceilings with all uncovered ductwork etc.
RV5-PJ
RV5-JJ with HC's
M6>UL410
This was at "Prison Brews," and the building sounds similar to your upcoming deal. Big room, all concrete, no floor or wall coverings, tall ceilings with all uncovered ductwork etc.
Hmmm, don't have exactly one of those two combos, but clearly, I should avoid the SC's, since that would skew the results "favorably". I'll have to use my ash/maple PJ and JJ/HC and hope the ash/maple doesn't offset your alder/morado results too much. The only alder/rw J style basses I have right now are both SC.
This room is not big, but it's exactly the same deal otherwise, and I've heard it's also boomy as all heck. So while I don't expect to be able to totally fix anything, I should at least be able to see what works decent enough.
Chef
In Memoriam
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