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Mic'ing bass amp for live shows?

#121
BIG +1

Horns, tweeters, ports, ALL of the components for the so called high end cabinet would make micing a nightmare, unless you miced all of them. But a single 15 cab like Jimmy's portaflex, or a single 10" from a sealed 810 - piece of cake and perfectly understandable.

And maybe that's where the discussion should be headed; how would some of you guys treat a 210/115 stack? Multiple mics? Mic or mics plus DI? DI and call it a day? I was intrigued by the comment one guy I spoke to made, when he said that he preferred it when the bass amp had a good DI - He felt that it gave him a fuller tone to work with.

Also, how do multiple basses fit into the equation? Micing a cab would seem to be a better - or at least simpler way to go than a DI per bass, unless of course the amp had a DI out. I guessing that there would still be level issues though...
 
#122
esoxhntr said:
..maybe that's where the discussion should be headed; how would some of you guys treat a 210/115 stack? Multiple mics? Mic or mics plus DI?
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Good point.

I was going to say that if your tone is what goes IN to the amp, with the amp simply serving to monitor that sound then a DI is your best bet. otoh, if your tone is what comes OUT of the amp, that is any distortion and/or coloring that the amp provides, then mic'ing the amp seems the better choice.

Back to the quoted question. My large rig is a 210/115 stach powered by a Yamaha power amp. In my case, the tone going IN to the poweramp is the tone. So I run a line from my pedal board to the DI. The coloring comes from a Sansamp VT Bass pedal. I use the same set-up DI with IEM's and no amp on stage.
You better believe that If I were using a SVT or B15, I'd be micing the cabinet.
 
#123
With some kind of amp+cab simulator, be it stomp box, rack, or some VST plugin, the tone you want is going to be at the DI. Unless your cabs response is flat like a PA, its only going to ruin it, IMO.

If you prefer the sound you get simulating one amp then having it plugged in to another integrated amp (non-power amp only, ie a Bass POD xt into a Ampeg B2RE), please by all means use a mic. You'll be chasing ghosts trying to figure out why your DI tone is nothing like what you hear from your cab.
 
#124
TL5 said:
Good point.

I was going to say that if your tone is what goes IN to the amp, with the amp simply serving to monitor that sound then a DI is your best bet. otoh, if your tone is what comes OUT of the amp, that is any distortion and/or coloring that the amp provides, then mic'ing the amp seems the better choice.

Back to the quoted question. My large rig is a 210/115 stach powered by a Yamaha power amp. In my case, the tone going IN to the poweramp is the tone. So I run a line from my pedal board to the DI. The coloring comes from a Sansamp VT Bass pedal. I use the same set-up DI with IEM's and no amp on stage.
You better believe that If I were using a SVT or B15, I'd be micing the cabinet.
Click to expand...

Thats more like it. Now where are the experts on this so I can be enlightened.
 
#125
If I used a 210/115, I'd probably mic a 10" and forget about the 15". Or vice versa. But that's just me.

Anyway, I rocked both a mic and a speaker DI on my gig last night using my B-15N. The verdict...I liked some aspects of the DI, but it just didn't come to life until the mic. The DI had a real edgy high end that's higher than the usual 5k rolloff I go for, but it didn't sound nearly as unpleasant as a straight DI, and it had a nice fat bottom, but the soundman ended up making it mic heavy because he liked the low mid boost and the angrier upper mids. Going to do some recording tests with it in the next couple days. We'll see what happens...
 
#126
esoxhntr said:
Horns, tweeters, ports, ALL of the components for the so called high end cabinet would make micing a nightmare, unless you miced all of them.
Click to expand...

You do NOT ever need to mic a port. Ever. Really, some of you need to learn your basic acoustic principles and learn more about enclosures too. Either that, or stick to DIs. And if a mid and a tweeter and a woofer are all in the same enclosure and it is properly designed and you have the right mic you don't need to go mic-crazy there either.
 
#127
fokof said:
Damn !!!

All those years carrying 8/10 for nothing when I could have done it with only one 10"......
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FWIW, if I'm not mistaken, that's exactly how Gene Simmons does it, with--despite the towers of speakers for show only--a mic'd 1x10 isolation enclosure replicating one cell of an Ampeg 8x10.

Not that he's a tone monster. But yeah, ya coulda.
 
#129
I found the article (Bass Guitar Fall 2003). He uses SVT-II's, one into an 8x10 on stage for reference, then the other goes into an "isolated cabinet with a single miked 10-inch speaker, although [the tech] explains that the remaining seven speakers...are daisy-chained so that the head sees a full load." So I'm not sure if that means the speakers are there and audible or not. Either way, I stand corrected (hey, it's been six years!). The article goes on to say he use 18 extra 8x10 dummy cabs for the backline...
 
#131
DeluxeRed said:
I found the article (Bass Guitar Fall 2003). He uses SVT-II's, one into an 8x10 on stage for reference, then the other goes into an "isolated cabinet with a single miked 10-inch speaker, although [the tech] explains that the remaining seven speakers...are daisy-chained so that the head sees a full load." So I'm not sure if that means the speakers are there and audible or not. Either way, I stand corrected (hey, it's been six years!). The article goes on to say he use 18 extra 8x10 dummy cabs for the backline...
Click to expand...
Doesn't sound like you stand corrected to me...sounds like I'm the one who stands corrected more than you.
 
#134
You guys will love this - I stumbled across this post while researching mics to be used for bass cabs over on PSW:

"I use a Radial Pro48 for bottom and definition. Of the mics I have, the D4 would be the one for a bass cab. (Or an RE20 if I had bucks.) But honestly, I've yet to work with a bass rig that had sufficient character to warrant capturing it with a mic. I usually need the DI to give me all the good stuff, cause there ain't none comin' out of the bass rig. I find it useful to try switching the polarity, to see which blend of stage sound and PA gives the best bottom."

Link Removed
 
#136
Jazzdogg said:
You guys will love this - I stumbled across this post while researching mics to be used for bass cabs over on PSW:

"I use a Radial Pro48 for bottom and definition. Of the mics I have, the D4 would be the one for a bass cab. (Or an RE20 if I had bucks.) But honestly, I've yet to work with a bass rig that had sufficient character to warrant capturing it with a mic. I usually need the DI to give me all the good stuff, cause there ain't none comin' out of the bass rig. I find it useful to try switching the polarity, to see which blend of stage sound and PA gives the best bottom."

Link Removed
Click to expand...
That's his opinion and he's welcome to it. My opinion is that he's FOS ;)
 
#138
JackANSI said:
Your point to the contrary is also just your opinion, should it carry the same weight as his?
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Around here, by track record? No contest.

My problem with that original quote is that the guy obviously can't get a good sound out of a bass rig. While being able to get a good sound direct might be a benefit, not being able to get a good sound out of a (decent) rig sounds like a drawback. Or he's never tried a decent rig.
 

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