Double Bass Motown D.I.

[Ric Vice]

Anyone get one of these? I'd love to try one and compare with a radial.

Mark,
I checked out your profile, and was wondering, do you play upright as well as electric? As I recollect, Jump Cat moved the discussion over to the EB side of the forums, where it would
make more sense. Incidentally, I'm diggin' your Guild Thunderbass rig, I played through one of those amps and it's matching cabinet when I was in college it's got a great tone.

Ric

 

[thejumpcat]

Check with James (or Jim) Simonson here on TB.

 

[cruzrad58]

Hey hey all. I have been playing the Acme Wolf Box III live now for a while. Super buttery and smooth, but low gain. Got the Motown DI for studio use recently and yes it sounds spot on, and again low gain. Love these guys for BG use. Best DB DI I have ever used, and I have used a lot, is the SansAmp Bass Driver DI. Hope this helps fellow bass brethren. Also, check out the new Ampeg SCR-DI too. Good for both BG and DB.

 

[Thomas Thorson]

To the degree the box has a "sound," then it is "voiced," meaning that it intentionally does not have a flat response. I understand that many find that desirable. Personally, I try to steer clear of "baked in" tone-shaping, preferring that the circuit be flat so that I can control the tone-shaping at will. To avoid misunderstanding, as I've said in the past, there's no valid reason to target an overall flat system response after tone-shaping in live settings because the reality is that cabs and room interactions essentially demand that the response be touched up. For recording, I would still would not want a baked-in response. The descriptions of these boxes make it quite clear that voicing is what it's all about. Hey, if that floats your boat, then go and be happy.

I'd have to disagree, to some extent. Harmonic distortion patterns have a huge impact on sound, and might not appear at all on a frequency plot. Looking at EQ alone tells only part of the story when it comes to describing the sound of an audio transformer.

 

[drurb]

I'd have to disagree, to some extent. Harmonic distortion patterns have a huge impact on sound, and might not appear at all on a frequency plot. Looking at EQ alone tells only part of the story when it comes to describing the sound of an audio transformer.

If you are pushing a device into distortion, then sure. I think it's fair to say that most amplifying a DB have no interest in doing that. In other applications, a device is intentionally overdriven as part of the sound one desires. That's not typically done via a DI box. The preceding discussion about the sound of these devices was, as I read it, not about the distortion profile. Transformers, being the reactive devices they are, often produce response anomalies that absolutely show up in the long-term spectral profile. Those account for the bulk of the "sound" of a transformer. Furthermore, harmonic distortion certainly shows up in the spectral profile as well. Of course, manufacturers, appropriately, don't often provide such measures under conditions of overload such as core saturation.

 

[Sink Pisser]

Just found out about this DI. I see this thread has been dormant for a couple years. Anyone using these and prefer these over other DI's?

 

[mikeGJ]

Discussion moved to the EB side by the OP, long ago.

Motown D.I.

Not much there, either!

I found some other threads, too:

ACME Motown D.I. WB-3

Motown DI - anyone try it yet?

Is it me...Or is this a realistic price?

There may be more.

 

[beans-on-toast]

Here is a gut shot that is apparently one used in the Motown studios.

A Triad A-11J or A-12J transformer mounted in a box. A 1/4” jack on the input, a three-pin XLR balanced out on the output.

 

[markjazzbassist]

Here is a gut shot of one of the early ones used in the Motown studios.

View attachment 2815213


A Triad A-11J or A-12J transformer mounted in a box. A 1/4” jack on the input, a three-pin XLR balanced out on the output.

That's a UTC transformer.

 

[project_c]

I posted one of those threads and eventually bought one. I still love mine, I use it every single day. On a passive bass going direct it makes just the right amount of difference for me. It adds a nice but subtle characteristic to the direct tone. It won't necessarily change your life, but it's a great little box.

 

[beans-on-toast]

That's a UTC transformer.

It looks like a UTC A-11. This transformer was used in DI's.

Came from here: Invalid Link Removed
It could be a later revision of the box.

 

[markjazzbassist]

I’ve got a DI using an old UTC O-10 right now, doesn’t go as low frequency wise as an A-10 or 11 but it’s got that transformer saturation that’s lovely. Once I get some more cash im going to get an old a-10 and build a box around it.

 

[beans-on-toast]

I’ve got a DI using an old UTC O-10 right now, doesn’t go as low frequency wise as an A-10 or 11 but it’s got that transformer saturation that’s lovely. Once I get some more cash im going to get an old a-10 and build a box around it.

I look every once in a while and only find completed sales with them going for around $100. Finding the transformers in good shape is the hard part. UTC iron was in studio equipment like the LA-2A as well as preamps. Maybe the UTC A-11 is a possibility. There's one on ebay for $189. Too much to experiment with.

 

[iFingers]

I currently record my electric bass and guitar straight to Logic using an original Apogee Jam, not the 96k version. Do you think getting an Acme, Wolf Box or Sigma DI would improve my tone? Or would I need to get an Apogee Duet or similar with XLRs etc? I don't have the option of recording an amp because of where I live. Plus if DI was the way to go for the Funk Brothers and MFSB, it's got to be good enough for me, right?

Alternatively, has anyone made an Acme/Wolf Box/Sigma Logic plugin? It might not be as good as the real thing, but my guess it would be a lot cheaper...

 

[markjazzbassist]

I currently record my electric bass and guitar straight to Logic using an original Apogee Jam, not the 96k version. Do you think getting an Acme, Wolf Box or Sigma DI would improve my tone? Or would I need to get an Apogee Duet or similar with XLRs etc? I don't have the option of recording an amp because of where I live. Plus if DI was the way to go for the Funk Brothers and MFSB, it's got to be good enough for me, right?

Alternatively, has anyone made an Acme/Wolf Box/Sigma Logic plugin? It might not be as good as the real thing, but my guess it would be a lot cheaper...

you need an interface with XLR input, your jam is DI input.

 

[markjazzbassist]

I look every once in a while and only find completed sales with them going for around $100. Finding the transformers in good shape is the hard part. UTC iron was in studio equipment like the LA-2A as well as preamps. Maybe the UTC A-11 is a possibility. There's one on ebay for $189. Too much to experiment with.

i finally built my "Motown" DI. Got a pair of UTC A-10 from the 60's, just wired it up last night. Compared to a Jensen and to my other UTC O-10 DI this has a lot more low end and is more naturally balanced across the frequency spectrum. Really has some weight in the low, low mid region. I'm really happy with it, cost me less than half what a Motown DI would be. I have one more A-10 transformer too, thinking about wiring another one up and selling it.

 

[beans-on-toast]

i finally built my "Motown" DI. Got a pair of UTC A-10 from the 60's, just wired it up last night. Compared to a Jensen and to my other UTC O-10 DI this has a lot more low end and is more naturally balanced across the frequency spectrum. Really has some weight in the low, low mid region. I'm really happy with it, cost me less than half what a Motown DI would be. I have one more A-10 transformer too, thinking about wiring another one up and selling it.

Sounds like the A-10 can do the job. The prices of the triad 11J and 12J just keep climbing.

 

[beans-on-toast]

I currently record my electric bass and guitar straight to Logic using an original Apogee Jam, not the 96k version. Do you think getting an Acme, Wolf Box or Sigma DI would improve my tone? Or would I need to get an Apogee Duet or similar with XLRs etc? I don't have the option of recording an amp because of where I live. Plus if DI was the way to go for the Funk Brothers and MFSB, it's got to be good enough for me, right?

Alternatively, has anyone made an Acme/Wolf Box/Sigma Logic plugin? It might not be as good as the real thing, but my guess it would be a lot cheaper...

A good wolfbox plugin would be nice wouldn’t it. I suspect that accurately modeling the non-linearities of the original transformer would be very difficult.

A DI takes an unbalanced instrument input and converts the signal to a mic level balanced output. So as was mentioned, you would need an interface box with XLR mic inputs to use a DI.

 

[markjazzbassist]

Sounds like the A-10 can do the job. The prices of the triad 11J and 12J just keep climbing.

they do. i've debated getting one but i'm happy with the A-10, it was used on the LA-2A as the input transformer and that's legendary, good enough for me.

 

[project_c]

i finally built my "Motown" DI. Got a pair of UTC A-10 from the 60's, just wired it up last night. Compared to a Jensen and to my other UTC O-10 DI this has a lot more low end and is more naturally balanced across the frequency spectrum. Really has some weight in the low, low mid region. I'm really happy with it, cost me less than half what a Motown DI would be. I have one more A-10 transformer too, thinking about wiring another one up and selling it.

Awesome! Post some pics!