My Dirt Bender - Another Jounal

[el murdoque]

Having researched things for a couple of days now, I'm far from an expert on the topic, but let me contribute something new about 4 knob 3BOD variants:

There are 4 knob pedals that do not have Futura written on them, and these are not Futuras.
The pedal I pictured above is from Joe's Pedals (a shop in the UK, check it out, it's great!).
It is a 3BOD Blueberry, but it has an additional treble control. If you turn the treble knob fully CCW, it is cut from the circuit and the pedal behaves just like a normal Blueberry. Turning it up results in a mild treble boost after the clipping circuit.
It is designed to be mild enough that even cabs with tweeters don't sound harsh - so instead of a real boost, it is more a device to flatten the low pass nature of the Blueberry a bit.

(source: The Man himself)

 

[el murdoque]

...and such a device should be on its way to my doorstep pretty soon.


I'm excited.

 

[StayLow]

Having researched things for a couple of days now, I'm far from an expert on the topic, but let me contribute something new about 4 knob 3BOD variants:

There are 4 knob pedals that do not have Futura written on them, and these are not Futuras.
The pedal I pictured above is from Joe's Pedals (a shop in the UK, check it out, it's great!).
It is a 3BOD Blueberry, but it has an additional treble control. If you turn the treble knob fully CCW, it is cut from the circuit and the pedal behaves just like a normal Blueberry. Turning it up results in a mild treble boost after the clipping circuit.
It is designed to be mild enough that even cabs with tweeters don't sound harsh - so instead of a real boost, it is more a device to flatten the low pass nature of the Blueberry a bit.

(source: The Man himself)

You went from zero BJFe to expanding the known universe overnight!

The Joe’s Pedals site is a great find too.

OK… if the Master says it’s a Blueberry with 4 knobs, then it is.

I can’t grasp how it’s a normal Blueberry if “B: Adjusts the output of low frequencies” unless that equals “N: tilt-EQ adjusts the tonal nature”.

*AND* the “T” is post-drive? I’ve never heard of a Blueberry variant (or any BJFe drive?) with anything post-Drive other than Volume.

This seems to have its own unique branch on the BJFe / Blueberry bush. Epic!!

Thank you for your service. Very much looking forward to your impressions of it.

 

[TwototheValley]

You went from zero BJFe to expanding the known universe overnight!

The Joe’s Pedals site is a great find too.

OK… if the Master says it’s a Blueberry with 4 knobs, then it is.

I can’t grasp how it’s a normal Blueberry if “B: Adjusts the output of low frequencies” unless that equals “N: tilt-EQ adjusts the tonal nature”.

*AND* the “T” is post-drive? I’ve never heard of a Blueberry variant (or any BJFe drive?) with anything post-Drive other than Volume.

This seems to have its own unique branch on the BJFe / Blueberry bush. Epic!!

Thank you for your service. Very much looking forward to your impressions of it.

Yes, very interesting.

So is the description on the site referring to it as a Futura not accurate?

 

[StayLow]

You went from zero BJFe to expanding the known universe overnight!

The Joe’s Pedals site is a great find too.

OK… if the Master says it’s a Blueberry with 4 knobs, then it is.

I can’t grasp how it’s a normal Blueberry if “B: Adjusts the output of low frequencies” unless that equals “N: tilt-EQ adjusts the tonal nature”.

*AND* the “T” is post-drive? I’ve never heard of a Blueberry variant (or any BJFe drive?) with anything post-Drive other than Volume.

This seems to have its own unique branch on the BJFe / Blueberry bush. Epic!!

Thank you for your service. Very much looking forward to your impressions of it.

Correction with apologies.

Something I’d forgotten: Futuras do have post-drive “T”.

Too late to edit post above.

The mystery murkifies like slamming a Blueberry with “N” fully CCW.

 

[StayLow]

Yes, very interesting.

So is the description on the site referring to it as a Futura not accurate?

Supposedly so, says Bjorn himself, though how inaccurate remains to be seen or heard.

 

[TwototheValley]

Well, I spent some time A/Bing the Blueberry and Silver Bee again today.

It reinforced my views expressed above…the BBBOD I prefer for low to medium gain, but also with flats on either a P or J…it has a more “vintage” character. It’s still fantastic with rounds though. Turning the “tone” control on mine to the left injects more lows before the gain stage, it can get quite massive and actually boost or “fill out” the low-low mids. If you want a passive bass, especially a jazz, to have more grunt and authority, the BBBOD really shines in this role.

The Silver Bee is great with emphasising the “character” of a passive jazz, especially when bringing forward the growl of rounds with some pleasant “crisp” distortion added…it can sound pretty vintage (not as much as the BBBOD with the post-gain presence roll-off/filtering) if you wind back the “T” but also more modern as well if you turn it up. Cranking the “T” to the right also brings out some string clank and fret noise…a bit like what the Daring Audio Edge Activator used to do. There’s something interesting going on with both the “T” and “B” controls on this pedal…I could be wrong, but they don’t feel like simple cut and boost at set frequencies…you can cut the mud with the “B” without thinning out the sound too much, and bring back some heft with downstream EQ.

Here’s the thing I about the BBBOD, or at least the one I have…it has a much lower output than the Silver Bee, however…it stacks REALLY well with other higher gain pedals, especially those that are a bit harsher and edgier and might lose a bit of low end…feed one of these into the Blueberry and you can enrich or restore those lows and add a layer of tubey character. The 4 knob Blueberry sounds like might get you there by itself…I’m interested to hear if that’s the case.

One more thing….there’s quite a bit of chat at present on the forum about tube boosts…..I have a few of these, but found that when I have the Blueberry in my signal chain they become essentially redundant and unnecessary, which is good for conserving space.

These observations were made using a preamp with a Fender tonestack.

 

[el murdoque]

it stacks REALLY well with other higher gain pedals, especially those that are a bit harsher and edgier and might lose a bit of low end…feed one of these into the Blueberry and you can enrich or restore those lows and add a layer of tubey character. The 4 knob Blueberry sounds like might get you there by itself…I’m interested to hear if that’s the case.

One more thing….there’s quite a bit of chat at present on the forum about tube boosts…..I have a few of these, but found that when I have the Blueberry in my signal chain they become essentially redundant and unnecessary, which is good for conserving space.

These observations were made using a preamp with a Fender tonestack.

Tasty food for thoughts, thank you for observing and sharing!

My secret weapon in stacking drive pedals is the Fuzzrocious BDPG, which can make a drive that feels a bit anemic on its own and give it back some bottom end, or it can take a well rounded drive and make it massive.


Regarding tube boosts:
I think tubes, in a bass setup, can be used in three ways.

1. You can use them for their special character when breaking up, literally as a form of "deluxe clipping diode".

2. You can use them for "injecting the magic bullet tube mojo" into your sound.

3. You can add them to the setup, light them with an amber LED and not really let them do much, but raise your price for the product and have it say 'tube driven' on the box.

The devices that fall into #3 should be ignored.

#1 is to be treated like any gain stage in ones setup. Tubes, if done well, can have a special little something that I want to call organic in the way they add harmonics, dirt and compression to a signal when driven.

#2 is the interesting one. I've only seen it done with rather expensive gear. However my observation on it is:
You can inject that particular kind of magic bullet mojo but once. It does not stack.
If I were to put my Noble preamp and my LA-1A comp into a signal chain and add The Small Trees in front of that, I don't get thrice the mojo.
One of these is good enough to saturate the signal, and by definition "saturated" means it can't take any more.

I'm talking about this effect that is elusive when one has to use words to describe it. People often say the sound becomes more three dimensional and has a very special clarity to it. When I played through a Noble for the first time, all these obscure descriptions suddenly made sense to me.

 

[Mr. voodoobass]

I think those tube observations are correct. I play my digital based(line6) board through the fx return of my tube amps(peavey and mesa boogie).
I’ve tried through the front end of those amps(set as flat as possible).
Didn’t really add more mojo than what I set up on the board.
Tried the board through different and much more powerful power amps.
Tighter and more powerful bottom, but didn’t have the same punch in the mids and the slight grit my tube amps have.
It does add something sweet.

 

[TwototheValley]

Tasty food for thoughts, thank you for observing and sharing!

My secret weapon in stacking drive pedals is the Fuzzrocious BDPG, which can make a drive that feels a bit anemic on its own and give it back some bottom end, or it can take a well rounded drive and make it massive.


Regarding tube boosts:
I think tubes, in a bass setup, can be used in three ways.

1. You can use them for their special character when breaking up, literally as a form of "deluxe clipping diode".

2. You can use them for "injecting the magic bullet tube mojo" into your sound.

3. You can add them to the setup, light them with an amber LED and not really let them do much, but raise your price for the product and have it say 'tube driven' on the box.

The devices that fall into #3 should be ignored.

#1 is to be treated like any gain stage in ones setup. Tubes, if done well, can have a special little something that I want to call organic in the way they add harmonics, dirt and compression to a signal when driven.

#2 is the interesting one. I've only seen it done with rather expensive gear. However my observation on it is:
You can inject that particular kind of magic bullet mojo but once. It does not stack.
If I were to put my Noble preamp and my LA-1A comp into a signal chain and add The Small Trees in front of that, I don't get thrice the mojo.
One of these is good enough to saturate the signal, and by definition "saturated" means it can't take any more.

I'm talking about this effect that is elusive when one has to use words to describe it. People often say the sound becomes more three dimensional and has a very special clarity to it. When I played through a Noble for the first time, all these obscure descriptions suddenly made sense to me.

Well said….agree with all of it. As has been mentioned elsewhere, the tube character really just comes down to compression, harmonics, clipping, and EQ in varying proportions, and how these respond to the variations in the input signal.

It’s interesting that pedals with a tube in them seem to sit at top of the TB totem pole in terms of desirability and the prices they command. I’m certainly guilty of dropping some coin on them, both readily available and unobtainium ones, curious to see whether they delivered on the hype. I found that they fell into the three categories you describe, with those in category #2 actually sounding rather similar…these were typically running the tubes at higher voltages. Does this imply that they were more “authentic” in terms of what they’re trying to achieve? I guess you have to be the judge, based on your own setup and comparisons to tube amps you’ve played.

I’ll still dip a toe in the water to try new offerings, but having a few category #2 pedals has convinced me that I can’t really achieve anything by getting more of them other than some subtle changes in the character of those elements mentioned above, which I’m specifically listening for and most others probably wouldn’t notice or care about, ESPECIALLY in a live situation. True corksniffing.

I suspect, though I could be wrong, that the reason many people keep wanting to load their boards with tubes for overdrive/distortion duty to achieve “that sound” is that the preamp type tube pedals have got them in the ballpark, but not quite all the way, and that special quality they’re really seeking is power amp distortion.

 

[Charlie Tuna]

that special quality they’re really seeking is power amp distortion.

And this is where the Fake Plastic Trees comes in and ends the conversation until (if) something else comes along. Note: Somehow it is NOT tube-based.

 

[TwototheValley]

And this is where the Fake Plastic Trees comes in and ends the conversation until (if) something else comes along. Note: Somehow it is NOT tube-based.

I’ll be able to update you on that front shortly.

Re: not being tube-based….that is where I think the genius of Björn’s designs comes to the fore. He manages to either use JFET emulation and clipping to emulate the “holistic” soundscape of certain amps (or amp/pedal combos) or he designs pedals to specifically pair with certain types of amps to achieve a desired result. It requires a flair for circuit design and a great ear, and he has both.

Of course, you might find that the Blueberry just doesn’t float your boat, so everything I’ve said can be taken with a giant pinch of salt. It largely depends on personal tastes, and subject to their variation between people, and over time. There are lots of builders out there.

 

[Charlie Tuna]

I’ll be able to update you on that front shortly.

Re: not being tube-based….that is where I think the genius of Björn’s designs comes to the fore. He manages to either use JFET emulation and clipping to emulate the “holistic” soundscape of certain amps (or amp/pedal combos) or he designs pedals to specifically pair with certain types of amps to achieve a desired result. It requires a flair for circuit design and a great ear, and he has both.

Of course, you might find that the Blueberry just doesn’t float your boat, so everything I’ve said can be taken with a giant pinch of salt. It largely depends on personal tastes, and subject to their variation between people, and over time. There are lots of builders out there.

Thanks for the confirmation of Bjorn's pedals. I'll look into them more as well. Most of the Blueberry demos I've heard sound very "cut through the mix" almost like a Stingray sound. Your description above seems to say the BB can retain all the lows if one desired, which alleviates the main concern my ears have heard in the demos. More digging and of course I'll be looking forward to Murdoque's impressions as well.

OK, I found a clip that shows off a big sound. It's a Bearfoot model so I don't know where that stands in the BJFE family, perhaps not at all but it's what I found:

 

[StayLow]

What a fantastic, entertaining thread, recently taking a hit of nitrous and moving at a break-wallet pace.

Do we agree that the Barbershop excels at power tube vibe, and if so does the FPT bring that vibe?

I too find stacking BJFe variants works super well, and if all one needs from their Blueberry variant or Crimson Red is more pronounced highs or better upper-mid punch definition; the Barbershop can add that perfectly.

Need to smooth the tart ragged edge of a Blackberry? Put it before a Diamond bass comp, which in turn livens up the Diamond’s optical comp “blanket over speaker” vibe, and with the Diamond’s tilt EQ you can access big lows without pushing the Berry’s drive too hard.

50’s, 60’s, 70’s, Motown, classic rock, single-gtr mix, warm punch, etc.: Crimson Red or Blackberry -> Barbershop
90’s, nu/metal, 2-gtr mixes, funk-rock, slap, SansAmp, sizzle, etc.: Blue 360 -> Diamond

Want the Berry cork-sniff nuance but it’s juuuust a little toooo much of… something? Put a *clean* tight, non-optical comp before it like BOSS or Duncan.

The quickest, easiest, least expensive path to “perfection” may be to put two of the best pedals together.

Then, of course, continue The Quest, because not even two of the best paired can ever be “The One”.

 

[StayLow]

Thanks for the confirmation of Bjorn's pedals. I'll look into them more as well. Most of the Blueberry demos I've heard sound very "cut through the mix" almost like a Stingray sound. Your description above seems to say the BB can retain all the lows if one desired, which alleviates the main concern my ears have heard in the demos. More digging and of course I'll be looking forward to Murdoque's impressions as well.

OK, I found a clip that shows off a big sound. It's a Bearfoot model so I don't know where that stands in the BJFE family, perhaps not at all but it's what I found:

IMO that’s one of the best bass gear demos ever.

I don’t have a BJFe Blueberry, but like many I crossed into Bjorn’s wonderland through the Bearfoot mirror.

The Bearfoot Blueberry is awesome. Full stop. No lack of lows at all, and a mids presence that’s unmatched.

By all accounts of those who A/B’d it with a BJFe Blueberry, the Bearfoot has a touch more brightness / mids presence and a hair less hair in the early travel of the Drive knob which could make it more ideal for the lightest of drives or more dynamic inputs… and that’s quite alright by me.

 

[el murdoque]

What a fantastic, entertaining thread, recently taking a hit of nitrous and moving at a break-wallet pace.

Do we agree that the Barbershop excels at power tube vibe, and if so does the FPT bring that vibe?

I too find stacking BJFe variants works super well, and if all one needs from their Blueberry variant or Crimson Red is more pronounced highs or better upper-mid punch definition; the Barbershop can add that perfectly.

Need to smooth the tart ragged edge of a Blackberry? Put it before a Diamond bass comp, which in turn livens up the Diamond’s optical comp “blanket over speaker” vibe, and with the Diamond’s tilt EQ you can access big lows without pushing the Berry’s drive too hard.

50’s, 60’s, 70’s, Motown, classic rock, single-gtr mix, warm punch, etc.: Crimson Red or Blackberry -> Barbershop
90’s, nu/metal, 2-gtr mixes, funk-rock, slap, SansAmp, sizzle, etc.: Blue 360 -> Diamond

Want the Berry cork-sniff nuance but it’s juuuust a little toooo much of… something? Put a *clean* tight, non-optical comp before it like BOSS or Duncan.

The quickest, easiest, least expensive path to “perfection” may be to put two of the best pedals together.

Then, of course, continue The Quest, because not even two of the best paired can ever be “The One”.

Darn it, you make me want another Barbershop.

 

[TwototheValley]

Yes to the Barbershop…I have the big box, the milennium and the Modele B…the last is what is currently serving pseudo-power amp emulation on my small board, tucked in between two other pedals. While not as “fat” as the Blueberry, I’ve never found it to get to kazoo-ey in my setup, unlike others.

Sounds pretty accurate from my recollection re: the Bearfoot vs the BJFE…I’ve played both, but not owned them at the same time so as to permit a direct comparison. I reluctantly traded the Bearfoot away a while back to acquire a rare bird.

Edit: Oh, forgot to add, absolutely agree being selective with the compressor choice…that’s why I have a few very clean, quiet, uncoloured VCA or OTA types just for the purpose you describe.

 

[StayLow]

Yes to the Barbershop…I have the big box, the milennium and the Modele B…the last is what is currently serving pseudo-power amp emulation on my small board, tucked in between two other pedals. While not as “fat” as the Blueberry, I’ve never found it to get to kazoo-ey in my setup, unlike others.

Sounds pretty accurate from my recollection re: the Bearfoot vs the BJFE…I’ve played both, but not owned them at the same time so as to permit a direct comparison. I reluctantly traded the Bearfoot away a while back to acquire a rare bird.

Edit: Oh, forgot to add, absolutely agree being selective with the compressor choice…that’s why I have a few very clean, quiet, uncoloured VCA or OTA types just for the purpose you describe.

We’ve so many sonic similarities.

The way I hear and experience it, Barbershop can darken and soften the tone via Sag and treble toggle, but it doesn’t add lows. It hits like it looks; hard, tight, and bright (depending on toggle) in the best ways - very power tube - while Sag brings that gorgeous large soft amber light into its tonal color.

Blueberry is its counterpart, in many ways also sounding a lot like it looks too.

Well, I spent some time A/Bing the Blueberry and Silver Bee again today.

It reinforced my views expressed above…the BBBOD I prefer for low to medium gain, but also with flats on either a P or J…it has a more “vintage” character. It’s still fantastic with rounds though. Turning the “tone” control on mine to the left injects more lows before the gain stage, it can get quite massive and actually boost or “fill out” the low-low mids. If you want a passive bass, especially a jazz, to have more grunt and authority, the BBBOD really shines in this role.

The Silver Bee is great with emphasising the “character” of a passive jazz, especially when bringing forward the growl of rounds with some pleasant “crisp” distortion added…it can sound pretty vintage (not as much as the BBBOD with the post-gain presence roll-off/filtering) if you wind back the “T” but also more modern as well if you turn it up. Cranking the “T” to the right also brings out some string clank and fret noise…a bit like what the Daring Audio Edge Activator used to do. There’s something interesting going on with both the “T” and “B” controls on this pedal…I could be wrong, but they don’t feel like simple cut and boost at set frequencies…you can cut the mud with the “B” without thinning out the sound too much, and bring back some heft with downstream EQ.

Here’s the thing I about the BBBOD, or at least the one I have…it has a much lower output than the Silver Bee, however…it stacks REALLY well with other higher gain pedals, especially those that are a bit harsher and edgier and might lose a bit of low end…feed one of these into the Blueberry and you can enrich or restore those lows and add a layer of tubey character. The 4 knob Blueberry sounds like might get you there by itself…I’m interested to hear if that’s the case.

One more thing….there’s quite a bit of chat at present on the forum about tube boosts…..I have a few of these, but found that when I have the Blueberry in my signal chain they become essentially redundant and unnecessary, which is good for conserving space.

These observations were made using a preamp with a Fender tonestack.

Totally agree re: Silver Bee. I hear and feel the “B” control as giving it a big but focused sealed cab 80 Hz vibe, and overall Silver Bee is lighter in the early stages of its Drive. More of a Super Barbershop or power tube vibe than a Blueberry vibe, though the Berry flavor is evident. Perfect in the mix from reggae to classic rock vibes. Totally overlooked, perhaps because it’s not as satisfying at the solo testing cork-sniffing stage.

 

[el murdoque]

I'm fairly certain that I owned a Barbershop and a OC Silver Bee at the same time.
I liked the look and aesthetics of the Silver Bee with white print on aluminium and a milky white LED,
but the Barbershop takes that raw look to a new league. It feels like "If we had put a finish on that pedal, it would have been the most gorgeous finish your eyes ever feasted on. Instead, we left it raw." ... And your eyes feast on that, too.
However, IIRC I tried the Silver Bee and Barbershop at one session during a blues jam and found the Barbershop felt like the better pedal for that at the time. I think I was more satisfied with how it sat in the mix, feeling a bit more polite and less pushy regarding the other instruments.

 

[TwototheValley]

I'm fairly certain that I owned a Barbershop and a OC Silver Bee at the same time.
I liked the look and aesthetics of the Silver Bee with white print on aluminium and a milky white LED,
but the Barbershop takes that raw look to a new league. It feels like "If we had put a finish on that pedal, it would have been the most gorgeous finish your eyes ever feasted on. Instead, we left it raw." ... And your eyes feast on that, too.
However, IIRC I tried the Silver Bee and Barbershop at one session during a blues jam and found the Barbershop felt like the better pedal for that at the time. I think I was more satisfied with how it sat in the mix, feeling a bit more polite and less pushy regarding the other instruments.

As it happens, inspired by this discussion I was playing around comparing the Barbershop to the Silver Bee yesterday. I agree with your take, the Barbershop has a flatter “neutral” EQ and fuller lows…it really does feel, at the risk of using a somewhat controversial term, “transparent”. Consequently, it has wider application than the Silver Bee. I think the Bee is better in a dense mix, or for accentuating “lead bass” type parts…it helps give some definition and snarl.