Need it louder. Guitar players super loud.

[willsellout]

This’ll do it. I am in a loud band. We practice at loud volumes because we like it that way. Playing live would be a lot different but we like it loud so overkill is where we landed. Never been happier. Live I could easily get by with an efficient 410. With PA support a 212 would do just fine. I’ve also had to work with my EQ a bit to find my place in the mix but once I did that it’s been glorious.

 

[groove pump]

OP here.
First thank you to everyone for the suggestions.
All the guys in the band are great guys. No one's being a jerk. When I asked him to turn down they do, but then the volume creeps back up.
A few more details that might help. It's not a rock band, it is blues primarily however that doesn't make it any less loud.
From a physics standpoint, assuming similar sensitivity and the same amplifier, would a 2*12 4ohm cab put out more sound than to 112 8-ohm cabs. Either way the amp sees four ohms and it's the same surface area.
Maybe 2 8 ohm 2*10 cabs?
This band has not started making money yet, so I don't want to spend ridiculous money.

I can say that I've been using a pair of "premium" 2x10 cabs in a vertical stack - different brands, but both are rated for 350 watts RMS and 8 ohms - and these are Godzilla loud for me when I'm driving them with nothing more than a GK MB 500 head. I've even used this layout for outdoor gigs without PA support for my sound and it's done great.

It took me a long time to finally try this sort of a rig, but after I kept coming across one recommendation after another here, I gave it a go and quickly found some next-level performance with my amp. A single 2x10 can work fine for smaller settings, practices with the band, or quiet practice at home. Both cabs together give me all I need for my gigs. Even though transporting these requires one extra trip for loading in/out, these boxes are entirely manageable for me (at age 57).

More good news with my story: When I went shopping for decent cabs only a few years ago, I found these from two different sellers and both were priced at only $200 each in very good condition.

While there's more than one "right" answer for your needs, this is one idea that could be workable for you. If you're using a single cab at your loud practices, I agree with trying to elevate that cab up closer to your head so that it's probably easier to hear in that setting. Your loud guitar player should also do this if his amp is blowing his sound past his knees. If you can get him to point that thing at his own head so that it's easier for him to hear his awesome self, he may not need to turn up so much.

Earplugs!!... even at practice if it's loud. No shame there

 

[groovaholic]

One of my bands has been battling volume - but in this case I blame acoustics and physics more than the guitarist.
He was playing through a horizontal 2x12, and standing relatively close to his amp - 3-5 feet.
Like most people, his ears are not on his calves, so he wasn't hearing it.

Two rehearsals ago, I recommended that he and I swap where we stand in the rehearsal room.
He ended up turning WAY down - then said he could hear himself (and everything else) a lot better.

That might help you, but I think using a single 12" in any loud-ish band situation is asking a lot.

Going from a single 8-ohm 112 to a 4-ohm 212 would double your wattage AND double your speaker cone area - that would probably gain you about 6 dB, and the top speaker would be closer to your ear.

The Aguilar 112 is a great-sounding cab - so maybe look for a used, 4 ohm "big cab" that you can leave where you rehearse and keep the Aguilar as your at-home cab?

And earplugs; just find a comfortable set and get used to how they affect the sound

 

[KevinDBassist]

This will teach him a lesson .

 

[johnnynitro]

I am in a band were the guitarist is pretty loud (Marshall) But I have an SVT Classic with the 610s. If I match his volume (easy) I'm too loud. So I EQ it with the Bass way down (below noon, Mids up (2 o'clock or more) treble a bit past noon ( pretty much my normal setup with a HPF). But In my opinion. Your bringing (speaker wise) a knife to a gun fight. He may be too loud. But your not filling it in with your small speaker setup.

 

[HelpImaRock]

I dont know guitar amps. Looks like a big tube head on a 2*10 or a 2*12.
The head looks like an SVT.

While I've seen guitarists use Ampeg V2 and V4 amps before, the most likely answer is a 70s Silverface Fender. Possibly something like a Bandmaster or Bassman with a matching 2x12. If that's the case, there's no getting that rig to a reasonable volume. They start loud and only get louder from there. And they don't really break up into distortion until you're driving them hard.

Having played guitar through a giant 70s Fender head/cab before, the unfortunate answer here is the guitarist needs to learn how to control their rig or get a smaller amp. No matter what you bring, the level of the band will continue to be super loud until they do.

 

[agedhorse]

OP here.
First thank you to everyone for the suggestions.
All the guys in the band are great guys. No one's being a jerk. When I asked him to turn down they do, but then the volume creeps back up.
A few more details that might help. It's not a rock band, it is blues primarily however that doesn't make it any less loud.
From a physics standpoint, assuming similar sensitivity and the same amplifier, would a 2*12 4ohm cab put out more sound than to 112 8-ohm cabs. Either way the amp sees four ohms and it's the same surface area.
Maybe 2 8 ohm 2*10 cabs?
This band has not started making money yet, so I don't want to spend ridiculous money.

Volume creep is a very real challenge, something that experience and acknowledgment helps control.

A second 8 ohm 112 (2 x 112's = 4 ohms) will make your speaker system equivalent to a single 4 ohm 212.

The watts are much less important than the speakers. Adding your second cabinet will help, a 4ohm 112 on its own will make very little difference.

A single 4 ohm 112 is not likely to survive for very long either.

They’re not joking. People around here must not play out much, since (if they’re taking their own advice) they seem to be quitting every band at the slightest provocation and/or firing drummers and guitarists left and right.

As a FOH engineer, I have left (or declined) some high paying gigs and touring opportunities because the volume was high enough that I decided it wasn't worth the risk to my ears (which now make a lot more money designing products which I obviously need to listen to). I focused on gigs and tours that weren't "stupid loud", and looking back that was a veru good decision.

A 4-ohm 112 is not going to make a huge difference. Doubling the amp’s output wattage, all else equal, is only about 3dB higher SPL. Noticeable for sure, but not a drastic difference.

To really fill it out you need more speakers AND more wattage.

By the time raw sensitivity and power compression are factored in, it's possible that a single 4 ohm 112 will have LOWER maximum SPL (until it fails).

 

[lomo]

....would a 2*12 4ohm cab put out more sound than to 112 8-ohm cabs.

No, not if they are made by the same manufacturer / in the same line, in which case the volume and porting will be identical or nearly so. More cone area is the key.

 

[devnulljp]

Invalid Link Removed

 

[Guitalia]

I've noticed that some people saying that they're proud and happy to be playing in a loud rock band aren't in working bands but in rehearsal-only bands.

To the OP: are there any plans to get paying gigs? If so, you might want to check with prospective venues to see whether they have dB limit restrictions. It would be better for your band to get used to playing at lower volume now than to take a gig and then lose future bookings there by annoying the management with uncontrolled volume.

Myself, I'm retired from gigging, but I'd be interested to read about volume restrictions currently gigging people here have encountered.

 

[MCF]

I can’t tell where you are. If you’re in a city with rental gear available, get the biggest, most powerful bass rig they have and show up at rehearsal with it. Then have a conversation about reasonable rehearsal volume.

I’m joking. Kind of. But sit down and have a real conversation about it. Then decide what you’ll do. I do agree that a rock band should play at a volume that fits the music. And wear earplugs.

 

[ProbablyTooLoud]

I'd just bring the second cab to practice.

 

[Paul New]

How do you play while running?

 

[agedhorse]

I've noticed that some people saying that they're proud and happy to be playing in a loud rock band aren't in working bands but in rehearsal-only bands.

To the OP: are there any plans to get paying gigs? If so, you might want to check with prospective venues to see whether they have dB limit restrictions. It would be better for your band to get used to playing at lower volume now than to take a gig and then lose future bookings there by annoying the management with uncontrolled volume.

Myself, I'm retired from gigging, but I'd be interested to read about volume restrictions currently gigging people here have encountered.

Depends on the region (the EU has more general restrictions on volume) and they type of gig (casino gigs for example, even for rock bands generally have significant SPL restrictions)

 

[superheavyfunk]

As a FOH engineer, I have left (or declined) some high paying gigs and touring opportunities because the volume was high enough that I decided it wasn't worth the risk to my ears (which now make a lot more money designing products which I obviously need to listen to). I focused on gigs and tours that weren't "stupid loud", and looking back that was a veru good decision.

I mean, I can’t dispute that and I’d likely make a similar decision if I were in your shoes. But that’s very different than what goes on around this forum, in terms of the constant bad advice to quit or fire someone every time something that can be solved with a simple conversation comes up.

 

[Rickybass4001]

Problem solved. I used to have a flamethrower like this for them loud 6-string fellas. But got tired of lugging it around.
a SVT will also do nicely.
However, just getting the guitar to turn the flip down is the best course of action.
Good luck.

 

[bherman]

I've noticed that some people saying that they're proud and happy to be playing in a loud rock band aren't in working bands but in rehearsal-only bands.

To the OP: are there any plans to get paying gigs? If so, you might want to check with prospective venues to see whether they have dB limit restrictions. It would be better for your band to get used to playing at lower volume now than to take a gig and then lose future bookings there by annoying the management with uncontrolled volume.

Myself, I'm retired from gigging, but I'd be interested to read about volume restrictions currently gigging people here have encountered.

Can’t give you numbers in db but I can tell you that for successful venues where I gig it’s a real thing. One is a brewery with live music 3x/week outside in the warm months, and sometimes multi-band festivals. As a result of complaints early on, the venue reached an agreement with the town on sound levels. At the start of every set, the manager goes out with a sound meter. I’d the band exceeds the threshold they are told to turn down. If they give him problems over the evening, they are not asked back. I am also good friends with a woman whose venue hosts a weekly jam. She has told me directly that when the music gets too loud, patrons leave, and her staff complains. People in bands have to recognize that when they were playing in public, it’s very unpleasant for the audience if the music is too loud. It’s really pretty simple, when people go out, they like to listen to music, but they also like to be able to talk to the people that they are with, and they like to be able to talk to their servers when it’s time to order food or drinks. As often it’s not, it’s the guitar players who are the problem. Big surprise, ha?

 

[MrLenny1]

Raise all the cabs 3 feet at rehearsal. If that doesn't
work quit or get good hearing protection.

 

[singlemalt]

Play nice, nobody gets hurt!

 

[MDBass]

I run an Aguilar tone hammer 700 and a single 112 Aguilar 8ohm cab.
This band that I just joined practices at such a high volume but I can't hear the detail in my playing that I would prefer.
The Aguilar cab is rear ported.
I'm considering a new 4ohm cab so that I can get the full 700 Watts out of the amp.
I do own a second 112 8ohm cab but I hate to have to schlep two cabs and an amp to every rehearsal.
Will a single 4 ohm cab make a big difference? Would a front port vs rear Port make a big difference.
Suggestions welcome.

Switching from a single 8ohm 112 cab to a single 4ohm 112 cab will make zero practical difference, nor will front v rear v non ported cabs.

The only way to compete in a volume war with a guitarist is more speakers.

You’ll either need to bring two cabs or insist he run his rig at a volume where everyone can actually hear themselves.