Need opinions and guidance building a space elevator.

[mcglyph]

Out of interest, why this approach? Why this one group?

The financial point you raise is one that I have to question too, well, not so much the point, I agree that finances are important for any project. I'm just interested in why they choose not, or why they have not, attained funding through any other means.

I'm not sure exactly why the Kickstarter.com campaign. I did hear they intend on taking the money, experimenting and creating a very big demonstration, going to 1000 ft I think, and thus generating some real money interest. They are also either working with, or planning to work with, SpaceX.

 

[Tituscrow]

Man this awesome, a real discussion is going on here. Love it.

I can fully understand soe of you not wanting to support it.

Being the highly educated, credentialed peoples asome of you are, you can probably understand that though you carry all of these certifications, etc, your continued blanket statements contradicting my assertions, isn't a discussion. It's a display in counterweights, yes? I believe this you believe that. So there is no discussion there. You say it is never going to happen or it's so far in the future, clearly this idea is laughable, silly, or at worst a scam. I say it isn't. The truth is you don't know. YOU DON'T KNOW. And in fact there is plenty of evidence as to how you can be replete with all these awesome degrees, experiences, etc, and just still don't got a clue whether you are right or I'am or not. You don't know whether it's going to happen in ten years anymore than you know the sun is going to rise tomorrow. Simple really. So you have your opinions, strong as they are, and I have mine. I don't have any answers, never claimed I did, in fact I didn't claim anyone had ALL the answers or even many of them, as clearly right now, no one does. Thus, this thread is exactly what is, despite your self assured assertions, just a man telling people about this fantastic, incredibly challenging project going on and pointing a finger toward the knowledge book if they want to seek it out. Simple, yes?

The sun WILL rise tomorrow. There WILL NOT be a space elevator in ten years.

Simple.

 

[mcglyph]

The sun WILL rise tomorrow. There WILL NOT be a space elevator in ten years.

Simple.

Haha. Thank you for your participation. Really.

 

[dj150888]

Man this awesome, a real discussion is going on here. Love it.

I can fully understand soe of you not wanting to support it.

Being the highly educated, credentialed peoples asome of you are, you can probably understand that though you carry all of these certifications, etc, your continued blanket statements contradicting my assertions, isn't a discussion. It's a display in counterweights, yes? I believe this you believe that. So there is no discussion there. You say it is never going to happen or it's so far in the future, clearly this idea is laughable, silly, or at worst a scam. I say it isn't. The truth is you don't know. YOU DON'T KNOW. And in fact there is plenty of evidence as to how you can be replete with all these awesome degrees, experiences, etc, and just still don't got a clue whether you are right or I'am or not. You don't know whether it's going to happen in ten years anymore than you know the sun is going to rise tomorrow. Simple really. So you have your opinions, strong as they are, and I have mine. I don't have any answers, never claimed I did, in fact I didn't claim anyone had ALL the answers or even many of them, as clearly right now, no one does. Thus, this thread is exactly what is, despite your self assured assertions, just a man telling people about this fantastic, incredibly challenging project going on and pointing a finger toward the knowledge book if they want to seek it out. Simple, yes?

I haven't made any blanket statements, I've been very precise with my comments.

For example, I justified my assertion that the timescales proposed were impossible for the from earth elevator, due to my knowledge of material chemistry. You'll notice also, I haven't tried to throw down any credentials, or play the intellectual heavyweight. Its all widely available information you can easily look into yourself and the fact is, CNTs won't be produced to the level required for a from earth space elevator within 20 years.

Your example is perfect actually. If you want to be totally precise, I don't "know" this any more than I know the sun won't rise tomorrow. I'm pretty much at the same level of confidence on them both. I won't bet my money on the sun not rising tomorrow either.

And you're not pointing the finger towards all the information needed for the reader to make an educated opinion. You're directing them towards LiftPorts marketing material, which, by the nature of being marketing material, is massively biased and doesn't paint a full picture, as I've highlighted before and you've glazed over.

 

[Gaius46]

I'm not sure exactly why the Kickstarter.com campaign. I did hear they intend on taking the money, experimenting and creating a very big demonstration, going to 1000 ft I think, and thus generating some real money interest. They are also either working with, or planning to work with, SpaceX.

What would building a 1000' elevator prove? It's analogous to asserting you can build a 747 by putting together a paper airplane. As a technology demonstrator it would prove nothing. As a stunt to impress gullible people....well that's something else.

 

[mcglyph]

I haven't made any blanket statements, I've been very precise with my comments.

For example, I justified my assertion that the timescales proposed were impossible for the from earth elevator, due to my knowledge of material chemistry. You'll notice also, I haven't tried to throw down any credentials, or play the intellectual heavyweight. Its all widely available information you can easily look into yourself and the fact is, CNTs won't be produced to the level required for a from earth space elevator within 20 years.

Your example is perfect actually. If you want to be totally precise, I don't "know" this any more than I know the sun won't rise tomorrow. I'm pretty much at the same level of confidence on them both. I won't bet my money on the sun not rising tomorrow either.

And you're not pointing the finger towards all the information needed for the reader to make an educated opinion. You're directing them towards LiftPorts marketing material, which, by the nature of being marketing material, is massively biased and doesn't paint a full picture, as I've highlighted before and you've glazed over.

Clearly this post was not meant just for you. Thank you for your participation.

 

[MakiSupaStar]

Man this awesome, a real discussion is going on here. Love it.

I can fully understand soe of you not wanting to support it.

Being the highly educated, credentialed peoples asome of you are, you can probably understand that though you carry all of these certifications, etc, your continued blanket statements contradicting my assertions, isn't a discussion. It's a display in counterweights, yes? I believe this you believe that. So there is no discussion there. You say it is never going to happen or it's so far in the future, clearly this idea is laughable, silly, or at worst a scam. I say it isn't. The truth is you don't know. YOU DON'T KNOW. And in fact there is plenty of evidence as to how you can be replete with all these awesome degrees, experiences, etc, and just still don't got a clue whether you are right or I'am or not. You don't know whether it's going to happen in ten years anymore than you know the sun is going to rise tomorrow. Simple really. So you have your opinions, strong as they are, and I have mine. I don't have any answers, never claimed I did, in fact I didn't claim anyone had ALL the answers or even many of them, as clearly right now, no one does. Thus, this thread is exactly what is, despite your self assured assertions, just a man telling people about this fantastic, incredibly challenging project going on and pointing a finger toward the knowledge book if they want to seek it out. Simple, yes?

This is similar to the basis of 'faith' that people attribute to religion. 'You just don't know' is not enough for people to go on. They need some educated guesses and hypothesis's before any kind of serious financial backing comes into place. You can argue with the naysayers and their educated guesses of failure all you want, it doesn't instill confidence beyond the level of blind faith.

 

[Funky Ghost]

^^ So it was meant for him AND others. Got it. So you meant it, and it WAS meant for him ( blanket statements comment and all ) but not JUST for him, so it's ok. See?

Man you are amazing at double talk. You sure you're not trying to sell something?

I'm looking for the snake oil, but I'd settle for hip waders and a clothes pin.

This post wasn't meant just for you. Thank you for reading.

 

[mcglyph]

^^ So it was meant for him AND others. Got it. So you meant it, and it WAS meant for him ( blanket statements comment and all ) but not JUST for him, so it's ok. See?

Man you are amazing at double talk. You sure you're not trying to sell something?

I'm looking for the snake oil, but I'd settle for hip waders and a clothes pin.

This post wasn't meant just for you. Thank you for reading.

Thank you really. For your participation and whatever else it is you feel like you've contributed.

 

[mcglyph]

What would building a 1000' elevator prove? It's analogous to asserting you can build a 747 by putting together a paper airplane. As a technology demonstrator it would prove nothing. As a stunt to impress gullible people....well that's something else.

I think the key in this post is, "gullible". My everyone is ready to jump, aren't they? So ready to ferret out whatever it is they can protect everyone from. It is true for me as well. I firmly believe in this project, and one of the main reasons is in fact that I believe it would seriously change our world for the better. Clearly I also am trying to protect our, fragile populace too.

 

[dj150888]

Clearly this post was not meant just for you. Thank you for your participation.

While it may have been "clearly" not meant just for me, since it was a direct reply to me, it should at least be SOMEWHAT relevant to me.

Once more, you glaze over the real points and dodge the questions.

It really is starting to seem like you have some sort of ulterior motive.

If you do, please divulge it. We could at least continue the conversation with intellectual honesty then.

 

[mcglyph]

While it may have been "clearly" not meant just for me, since it was a direct reply to me, it should at least be SOMEWHAT relevant to me.

Once more, you glaze over the real points and dodge the questions.

It really is starting to seem like you have some sort of ulterior motive.

If you do, please divulge it. We could at least continue the conversation with intellectual honesty then.

It is somewhat relevant to you, you assert based on your ideas, etc, the project won't be...! And I contend you don't know. you just don't no one does. Including me, and as repeatedly stated right now, there are multiple question not even thought of yet, much less an answer for them, thus a time frame of ten years.

I have no ulterior motive. None. My one motive is the one I have stated all along. Oh wait, let's go about this another
way, since I've repeatedly stated answers to questions I've been asked to the best of my (rather limited) ability, you tell me what motive I might have and then I can directly refute it again, as I have said repeatedly I in fact don't actually have a motive other than the one previously stated. And while your at it please ask more questions I dont' have the answer to so I can say that again too. Or come up with some more.

 

[EricF]

Hmmm...your thread title asks for "opinions and guidance". Apparently, that's not what you were interested in after all.

 

[mcglyph]

Hmmm...your thread title asks for "opinions and guidance". Apparently, that's not what you were interested in after all.

I'm interested in getting 10000000 people to look outside of their comfort zone. Even for me when I first heard the words, "space elevator", I was a little incredulous. So if the thread title doesn't fit what you think, my apologies.

 

[skychief]

You'd probably want it to go back down the elevator because that presents an opportunity to capture some of the energy used to go up. And you probably can design a two way system that allows one or more to go up while one or more go down.

That's the easy part though. Addressing the materials issue is the real challenge and as others have said we're a long long way from addressing those.

I suppose,, but a two-way elevator was not proposed in the overview on the website.

And if it were a two-way, it would require TWO ribbons each weighing close to 36 million kg each. How the heck could they get the far end out into space? That would have to be one gargantuan balloon. Almost the size of the earth.

 

[hdracer]

I'm interested in getting 10000000 people to look outside of their comfort zone. Even for me when I first heard the words, "space elevator", I was a little incredulous. So if the thread title doesn't fit what you think, my apologies.

Why not just a few investors?
Venture capitalists are always looking to get in on the ground floor of a money making proposals.


Unless they see through the smoke & mirrors BS.

It is a lot easier to BS 10000000 gullible people to kick in a few bucks then it is to BS a savvy investor.

 

[mcglyph]

Why not just a few investors?
Venture capitalists are always looking to get in on the ground floor of a money making proposals.


Unless they see through the smoke & mirrors BS.

It is a lot easier to BS 10000000 gullible people to kick in a few bucks then it is to BS a savvy investor.

The kickstarter.com campaign is clearly NOT going to generate the kind of money this project would require. As previously stated, the whole point of the kickstarter campaign is to get people talking about it, get comfortable with it, stir some interest, AND pay for the project to move forward a bit. It really does take money to do this stuff. This thread has not been and is not about you guys donating bunches of money. I've mentioned money three times in 11 pages.
If you don't want to contribute anything to the project, money, effort, time, brain power, then don't. Just can we stop with the, this is a scam comments? It's been said before, the project has lot's of questions, a few answers, many issues to be surmounted, etc; clearly no one should be mortgaging their house to donate, to, "get in on the ground floor". And thus no one is being encouraged to do so.

 

[bluesblaster]

I personally think the whole idea is a bit whacked, that and the fact you keep hanging in there trying to win us over is a bit suspicious as well. I'm sure folks here are every bit as bright as the next guy but wouldnt this subject be better suited on a scientific chat forum? why so insistant on convincing a lot of bass players. If monetary donations are what your fishing for than as HD racer suggested you could do better elsewhere, we tend to spend most of our spare change on gear.

 

[placedesjardins]

To the OP, your topic title "Need opinions and guidance building a space elevator." was a guise. Going by the content of your first post, you never really wanted opinions or guidance, you are just trying to promote giving money to the space elevator program, a scam to raise money for personal use.

 

[mcglyph]

I personally think the whole idea is a bit whacked, that and the fact you keep hanging in there trying to win us over is a bit suspicious as well. I'm sure folks here are every bit as bright as the next guy but wouldnt this subject be better suited on a scientific chat forum? why so insistant on convincing a lot of bass players. If monetary donations are what your fishing for than as HD racer suggested you could do better elsewhere, we tend to spend most of our spare change on gear.

Imagine for a moment you are a bass player. You spend time on a website forum. One day there is a a project you would like to tell everyone about, one which sounds really outrageous guaranteed to get joked at, poked, at made fun of, and of course accused of being a scam. But this project is one you believe in.

So you start a thread. And just as expected pretty much the response you expected comes along. Most are naysayers, worse, or somewhere in between, and every post, you are trying to say one thing, look at the information, don't keep hating or despising the thing without checking it out. You wish they would check the information out, and then at the very least stop telling you you are wrong. You guys disagree, ok. So every post, you keep basically passing along the same information, check the website, etc. Then they settle on it's a scam, and stop asking us for money. You of course having some pretty basic intentions are surprised when suddenly one of your posters is convinced you have not just ulterior motives, you also have much more information than you are sharing. And you dont. The end.