Congrats on your find. I have the patience of a hyper 5 yr old. My point is, if you need a bass and you have a max of $500 or so, Squier CV and VM is the way to go. Over MIM, Ibanez, Schecter, Dean, Epi's. To be honest, if I got a MIA for $600, I'd turn around and try to resell it for $900. If it was in good shape. JMO
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New Squier? Or used Fender?
- Thread starter Adam Bomb
- Start date
Congrats on your find. I have the patience of a hyper 5 yr old. My point is, if you need a bass and you have a max of $500 or so, Squier CV and VM is the way to go. Over MIM, Ibanez, Schecter, Dean, Epi's. To be honest, if I got a MIA for $600, I'd turn around and try to resell it for $900. If it was in good shape. JMO
Yeah but then what are you gonna do with that $300 other than blow it on more bass gear? Just keep the bass.
okcrum
in your chest
Sorry, but it still isn't. What's not comparable between two electric four-string solid body basses made by the same company 29 yearsp) apart?
Aside from wood, hardware, electronics, build quality, finish, and tone, not much, I guess.
Heck yeah!
Folks don't seem to realize that a $600 MIA Fender is a relatively rare statistical outlier. Average prices on the used market are closer to $1000. You can buy a new $300 Squier VM or CV at any retailer an hour from now. This isn't exactly an apples-to-apples comparison.
I once bought a mint '66 Mustang for $10,000 from a hard up new divorcee who had to pay his lawyer. (If you're patient you can find a deal like this too!) It would be foolish to use this as the basis of comparison against a new Camry.
okcrum
in your chest
And you'll be getting a $100.00 instrument. I'm sorry, I've picked up some of the newer Squiers and while they are much better than they used to be, to me they are not worth buying when there are decent Fenders out there much more worth the extra coin.
I'll tell you what, the next time I'm looking to buy a used bass it'll be a Fender or something comparable. Squiers won't be on my radar screen and I've owned a couple!
If I was a student just starting out, yes the Squier is probably just the ticket. But as a player I want something more and if re-sale means anything at all then I'm sorry there just isn't any comparison.
loved my squier VM jazz. regret trading it.
REALLY love my squier deluxe active jazz V. play it/gig it constantly.
when i was bass-less for a few weeks (stupid, stupid...will never do again) the local mom-&-pop store i ordered my deluxe from lent me an 89(?) MIM jazz. i hated it. mainly the neck was too chunky & it was heavy as heul.
i'm a big fan of the VM series. if it were me i'd personally choose a brand new VM vs any used MIM. but thats just me. i'm not big on the affinity tho.
someday when i have $299 laying around (yeah right) i'll re-buy that VMJ
REALLY love my squier deluxe active jazz V. play it/gig it constantly.
when i was bass-less for a few weeks (stupid, stupid...will never do again) the local mom-&-pop store i ordered my deluxe from lent me an 89(?) MIM jazz. i hated it. mainly the neck was too chunky & it was heavy as heul.
i'm a big fan of the VM series. if it were me i'd personally choose a brand new VM vs any used MIM. but thats just me. i'm not big on the affinity tho.
someday when i have $299 laying around (yeah right) i'll re-buy that VMJ
Let's see how close my initial guesstimate is. Here are the first five MIA Fenders listed in the TB Classifieds:
$850
http://www.talkbass.com/forum/f126/f-s-2003-mia-fender-jazz-sunset-orange-736104/
$1000
http://www.talkbass.com/forum/f126/f-s-only-fender-usa-hot-rod-precision-sunset-transparent-736990/
$675
http://www.talkbass.com/forum/f126/2005-mia-fender-jazz-5-shipped-737331/
$1075
http://www.talkbass.com/forum/f126/fs-fender-60th-anniversary-precision-bass-american-nos-736638/
$1400 (ok, this is a fiver, so we'll take one more for balance)
http://www.talkbass.com/forum/f126/fs-ft-fender-precision-deluxe-v-mia-735943/
$900
http://www.talkbass.com/forum/f126/fs-ft-feeler-2007-mia-fender-jazz-w-dimarzios-735138/
Hardly scientific, but maybe close to representative, yes? Average going price for used MIA Fenders in this sample is $983.
To the OP: I'd jump on that $675 Jazz if things like "wood, hardware, electronics, build quality, finish, and tone" matter to you
I just made a thread about an Affinity Bronco Bass that I got for $90 (and then put a spare pickup in) that apparently some people think sounds better than a stock Mustang Bass, so what about that.
At this point, I think the only thing it could really use is better tuners.
okcrum
in your chest
If you can't tell the difference, buy the cheaper one.
Sometimes I think that should be Squier's marketing theme...
Sometimes I think that should be Squier's marketing theme...
Actually, I am. I'm curious to know what qualities of the wood used in the construction of current Squier basses as vs Fender (or in your example, old MIJ Squiers) warrants the price differential in your opinion? Same question for electronics, particularly pots, wiring, jacks and caps, but also pups. Bridges?
My experience with current VM and CV Squiers (and a few late-'80s MIK models) is that the build quality and finish rivals Fender's. I've seen some pretty bad finish flaws in MIA Fenders. Haven't you? There are plenty of complaints about current Fender QC.
My point here for the OP is that the Squier will get you 90% of the value for 50% of the cost of the Fender. I'd further posit that the additional 10% of the "value" is in resale and a HSC, not in playability, reliability or sound, and that's all that really matters.
I bought a used Schecter Stiletto Custom 5 for $300 and I like it better than my MIM 5 J-bass (which I like better than the Squires I've played). For my money, Schecter makes one of the best "bang for the buck" basses out there. They are light, have a killer B string and play like buttah. Mine was built in China and finished in the US.
okcrum
in your chest
Less than six months ago, folks on this board were raving about how good the Fender MIA, MIM, and Squier QC had gotten. So I'm not sure where you're coming from with that, unless you figure 0.1% or so failures by the time the instrument reaches the user (that would be after shipping twice, being warehoused, and possibly sitting in a store subject to further abuse) and a good return policy are insufficient. I don't buy into samples of one when judging how well an instrument is built or how it sounds.
I've played enough Squiers, MIMs, and MIAs (and other brands) to know there are construction, tonal, and playing differences in them all, even among examples of the same basses. I also know that the wood today isn't the wood from 30 (or 29, or 40) years ago. Agathis isn't basswood isn't ash isn't alder, and plywood isn't laminated body pieces (I know the higher end Squiers are not ply). It can't be, even if it were the same wood from the same stand of trees, since wood ages. Neither are the rest of the parts or the finishes. We're talking about cheaply mass-produced basses here. Every part comes from a different manufacturer than it did back in the 80s, and costs less. It's a fact of manufacturing life. Some of this is the economy of scale, but some of it is just cheaper parts.
10 minutes' playing in a music store makes lots of basses seem to be the same, but try living with an instrument for awhile and working with it. The little things start to come out, such as the ability to stay in tune, or take a knock. Even the MIJ Squier basses from the 80s play, sound, weather, and set up nothing like the Squiers of today. If you can't see past the fact that the bridges are metal, the bodies are wood, and the like, then they will seem the same to you. Oh well.
If you like Squier, that's fine. If you think the Squier you buy today will be worth 10x the purchase price in 20-30 years, then you're free to believe so. History seems to say you'll be lucky if it's worth 1-2x the price. If you want to believe you have to pay at least $900 for a used MIA, or $550 for a used MIJ to prove why a CV or VM is better, so be it. I'm not going to convince you otherwise.
Like I said, if the OP can't tell the difference between a $500 Fender and a $200 Squier, he should buy the Squier. But he shouldn't think he's getting an MIA or MIM, or anything else.
Including Deluxe models and Anniversay editions is inappropriate when the discussion is about what he could get an MIA Fender for.
At least, I don't recall anybody suggesting that he could get a Deluxe or Anniversay model in the $600 range. But, Am Std and H1s are both MIA and that's all that was suggested. Multiple people (here on TB) got brand new H1s recently for $442. I'm pretty sure I've seen more than one in the Classifieds here since then for LESS than $600 - in like new condition.
At least, I don't recall anybody suggesting that he could get a Deluxe or Anniversay model in the $600 range. But, Am Std and H1s are both MIA and that's all that was suggested. Multiple people (here on TB) got brand new H1s recently for $442. I'm pretty sure I've seen more than one in the Classifieds here since then for LESS than $600 - in like new condition.
Let's see how close my initial guesstimate is. Here are the first five MIA Fenders listed in the TB Classifieds:
$850
http://www.talkbass.com/forum/f126/f-s-2003-mia-fender-jazz-sunset-orange-736104/
$1000
http://www.talkbass.com/forum/f126/f-s-only-fender-usa-hot-rod-precision-sunset-transparent-736990/
$675
http://www.talkbass.com/forum/f126/2005-mia-fender-jazz-5-shipped-737331/
$1075
http://www.talkbass.com/forum/f126/fs-fender-60th-anniversary-precision-bass-american-nos-736638/
$1400 (ok, this is a fiver, so we'll take one more for balance)
http://www.talkbass.com/forum/f126/fs-ft-fender-precision-deluxe-v-mia-735943/
$900
http://www.talkbass.com/forum/f126/fs-ft-feeler-2007-mia-fender-jazz-w-dimarzios-735138/
Hardly scientific, but maybe close to representative, yes? Average going price for used MIA Fenders in this sample is $983.
To the OP: I'd jump on that $675 Jazz if things like "wood, hardware, electronics, build quality, finish, and tone" matter to you
That's why I very specifically qualified my statements:
"Here are the first five MIA Fenders listed in the TB Classifieds"
and
"Hardly scientific, but maybe close to representative"
I was replying to the contention that MIA Fenders priced at $600 or less are commonplace. They aren't,; they are few and far between.
While I am in love with the new crop of Squiers, and rank them over MIM Fenders, I do think that people are getting a little carried away with them. There are plenty of basses in the sub-$600 range that are better than Squiers. Yamaha, Peavey, and Ibanez are a few examples.
