New SQUIER VM series! (Part 2)

[steve_rolfeca]

Some schematics for Squier basses show 500K pots instead of 250K. Tone control capacitors on P-basses have changed over time as well.

One piece of advance preparation that you can perform yourself, is to pull the pickguard, and see what components are in there now. A pot stamped with 250KA is an audio taper pot, for example. If the tone control capacitor has 683 printed on it, then it's a 0.068mfd cap.

Once you know those numbers, it's easier to determine whether you want to go up or down in value...

If you don't have soldering equipment/skills, you might want to talk to your tech in advance about setting you up with some clip leads and different components. That way, he can set you up in a corner while you noodle around with different capacitor and/or pot values. No point paying him to solder it all up until you've found a setup that's a keeper for you.

Just to be clear, here are your options:
- Change the capacitor size. Changes how far down into the midrange the tone control operates. Smaller values leave more of the mids present when the control is rolled all the way off. Possible values might be .1mfd, .068mfd, .047mfd, .033mfd or .022mfd.
- Change the potentiometer slope. Changes how quickly the highs ramp off as you roll the knob back, and how much fine control you have at the extremes. Pots can be linear or audio taper.
- Change the potentiometer value. As mentioned previously, 250K loads the pots down for a smoother, more "vintage" tone. 500K lets a little more treble through, for extra bite.
- Another option is to either use a "no-load" pot to take the tone control right out of the circuit when it's wide open, or install a mini-switch to do the same thing. Disabling the tone control in this way unloads the pickups still further, giving some extra grind when you're in a punky mood.

Note that none of these mods change the tone when the knob is turned all the way down, without affecting the tone control's performance through the rest of the rotation.

If already you like the tone control action everywhere except fully counter-clockwise, why not simply back it off a bit?

Most passive basses that I've owned, including my $2,000-plus Dingwall, are a bit too bassy for my taste when rolled all the way off. Most people are more concerned with the taper and sound between wide open and about 25%...

 

[awilkie84]

Some schematics for Squier basses show 500K pots instead of 250K. Tone control capacitors on P-basses have changed over time as well.

One piece of advance preparation that you can perform yourself, is to pull the pickguard, and see what components are in there now. A pot stamped with 250KA is an audio taper pot, for example. If the tone control capacitor has 683 printed on it, then it's a 0.068mfd cap.

Once you know those numbers, it's easier to determine whether you want to go up or down in value...

If you don't have soldering equipment/skills, you might want to talk to your tech in advance about setting you up with some clip leads and different components. That way, he can set you up in a corner while you noodle around with different capacitor and/or pot values. No point paying him to solder it all up until you've found a setup that's a keeper for you.

Just to be clear, here are your options:
- Change the capacitor size. Changes how far down into the midrange the tone control operates. Smaller values leave more of the mids present when the control is rolled all the way off. Possible values might be .1mfd, .068mfd, .047mfd, .033mfd or .022mfd.
- Change the potentiometer slope. Changes how quickly the highs ramp off as you roll the knob back, and how much fine control you have at the extremes. Pots can be linear or audio taper.
- Change the potentiometer value. As mentioned previously, 250K loads the pots down for a smoother, more "vintage" tone. 500K lets a little more treble through, for extra bite.
- Another option is to either use a "no-load" pot to take the tone control right out of the circuit when it's wide open, or install a mini-switch to do the same thing. Disabling the tone control in this way unloads the pickups still further, giving some extra grind when you're in a punky mood.

Note that none of these mods change the tone when the knob is turned all the way down, without affecting the tone control's performance through the rest of the rotation.

If already you like the tone control action everywhere except fully counter-clockwise, why not simply back it off a bit?

Most passive basses that I've owned, including my $2,000-plus Dingwall, are a bit too bassy for my taste when rolled all the way off. Most people are more concerned with the taper and sound between wide open and about 25%...

The first thing I do with most basses is swap any audio taper pots for linear taper. I hate that 1st 1/2 of the pot doing nothing and then having a steep climb to full in the last 1/4 of the pot.

Some basses even get a 500K pot treatment.

 

[dave_bass5]

There is also the grease bucket system, as used in the Fender Highway series. This stops the slight low end bump that you get when the tone knob is rolled right off.
No idea how it works but I didn't feel it sounded right when I had mine.

For what it's worth I really like how my PJ sounds with the stock pots etc.

 

[Gorn]

Thanks for the advice gentlemen, but honestly, it all went right over my head. My tech is a family friend who I give stuff to and say "make this better", and he always does. He really doesn't charge me for anything, especially if I'm bringing him parts. If he tells me it won't make a difference then there'll be a stew mac wiring kit for a pbass in the classifieds next week.

 

[dave_bass5]

Sometimes its too easy to get hung up on figures and forget to use your ears.

Right, after 48 hours with my PJ i must say how happy i am with it. Ive done a set up, shimmed the neck and put XL's and strap locks on it.
Its a lot more playable than it was, and the strings make it feel more familiar. Ive got an annoying rattle coming form somewhere but only when i play certain notes, and its not coming through my amp so ill work that out if and when i can be bothered.
I dont think the foam under the P pup is doing its job, if i raise the pup it doesn't move unless i pull it up. Ill take a look at that soon, but for now its fine.

I cant put my finger on it but the bass feels cheap to me. I cant find any fault with anything, not evne the neck pocket or finish, so maybe its just the weight, or lack of, that's giving this impression. Whatever it is its not a big deal, just an observation.

This will definitely be my only gigging bass from now on, unless something happens to it.

Squier Vintage Modified PJ Bass by Invalid Link Removed, on Flickr

Squier Vintage Modified PJ Bass by Invalid Link Removed, on Flickr

Squier Vintage Modified PJ Bass by Invalid Link Removed, on Flickr

 

[jasonbraatz]

I don't know if it's the lightness - it's still heavier than one of my Stambaughs and that thing doesn't feel cheap - but maybe it's the tiny bit of neck dive? I bet a switch to lighter tuners would make it feel "right."

Otherwise, I don't know. The nearly-identical SX I had before this one felt *cheap.* This one just feels "normal."

 

[dave_bass5]

You could be right. The neck dive is a bit more than I'm used to. I do plan on putting a Gotoh 201 on it, although the stock bridge seems pretty big compared to the usual BBOT.
I'm really only comparing it to my CVP and CV jazz, not higher end basses, but after some thought I think it is to do with the neck. The edges feel a bit sharp (not the frets though) and a bit un refined, even compared to the CV necks, although again, there is nothing actually wrong with it.

Not that I'm really complaining, just something I noticed.

 

[steve_rolfeca]

Tried a CAR VM Precision V at my local dealer for the second time today. It's a little heavy for my tastes, but it feels very good for the most part.

I don't like the thick, plasticky feeling of the finish on the neck, but damn it's nicely put together.

I've seen worse fret ends on $1,200 instruments.

 

[Thundar]

Ok AWILKIE84 and VOSTRE ROY....somebody gimme the scoop on the VM Jag 5... I keep eyeballing them and wanna know what ya think! Or did I miss reviews in the previous thread?

 

[petrus61]

Looks like I'm back in the club. Was searching for a cheap backup bass when I stumbled upon none other than a VMP5...in CAR. There was a flea market and someone there had some musical equipment for sale. Just to compare to the one I sold, I decided to play around on a the P5 he had there (I suppose for testing equipment). Probably a whole pound lighter than the one I owned and just slightly less neck-divier. The tone pot wasn't working. I offered him $120 and he took it! Got it home and opened it up. Couldn't really tell what was wrong so I just ripped everything out and replaced the innards with two full size Bourns 250k pots, some push back wiring and a switch craft jack. It's alive! One thing I did was install a .068 Sprague Orange Drop 225P to see if I could tame some of the harsh high end I was getting from my previous and this one. It seemed to do the trick in place of the stock .047, but I'll do some experimenting with other values through my decade box and rig tonight.

Has anyone noticed that the guts on these are wired with shielded Gibson type wire? I'd never seen a P bass wired as such. They seemed to have taken extra steps to eliminate noise on these. From some help here, I gathered that the wiring was a bit of overkill since the cavity was shielded with conductive paint in addition to the shielded wire. I guess it's nice, but arguably unnecessary on a P bass, since the pickup in circuit tends to be relatively quiet anyway. But then I got to wondering if the pickups were perhaps not wax potted and that is why they took the extra steps in shielding. Can anyone confirm this?

Anyway, glad to have one that's a little bit nicer (same color!) than my other one. It was too cheap to pass up and felt and sounded much better than the first one I had, so here goes round two.

 

[Vostre Roy]

Ok AWILKIE84 and VOSTRE ROY....somebody gimme the scoop on the VM Jag 5... I keep eyeballing them and wanna know what ya think! Or did I miss reviews in the previous thread?

Sorry for the time the answer took to arrive, haven't checked this board at all during the weekend.

As I stated in the previous thread, I ain't a bass reference since my only other bass I owned/played on is my Ibanez SR305, wich is about on par quality wise. So when I compare them:

- The Squier sound very nice. I bought it so I can experiment with both a Precision and a Jazz pickup, both sounds good and have their own character, I removed the bass boost because I like having the fewes knobs possible on my instruments, but it did gave a nice little clean boost on its own and the bass added didn,t drive it to mudland.

- The neck is awesome. I played my Soundgear for over a year and my left hand thumb always got cramped at some point, the Squier neck profile feels way better in my hands, but thats down to preference

- Hardware wise, the tuners and the bridge are fine, not too fancy but eh, what can you expect from a 250$ instrument lol. Pots respond well, jack is a stereo one (for the active bass boost) and the strap location allows to play stand up pretty nicely. Not much of neck dive, I think, but I'm used to my baritone Telecaster wich neckdive like an olympic diver.

- Finish is awesome, period. Couldn't believe how good the sunburst looked in real

All and all, worth every penny, as stated I ain't a reference but I like every bit of it. Might upgrade the pickups, pickguard, bridge and neck at some point, but I enjoy it stock so much that I'm not in a rush for doing those.

Cheers!

 

[Thundar]

Sorry for the time the answer took to arrive, haven't checked this board at all during the weekend.

As I stated in the previous thread, I ain't a bass reference since my only other bass I owned/played on is my Ibanez SR305, wich is about on par quality wise. So when I compare them:

- The Squier sound very nice. I bought it so I can experiment with both a Precision and a Jazz pickup, both sounds good and have their own character, I removed the bass boost because I like having the fewes knobs possible on my instruments, but it did gave a nice little clean boost on its own and the bass added didn,t drive it to mudland.

- The neck is awesome. I played my Soundgear for over a year and my left hand thumb always got cramped at some point, the Squier neck profile feels way better in my hands, but thats down to preference

- Hardware wise, the tuners and the bridge are fine, not too fancy but eh, what can you expect from a 250$ instrument lol. Pots respond well, jack is a stereo one (for the active bass boost) and the strap location allows to play stand up pretty nicely. Not much of neck dive, I think, but I'm used to my baritone Telecaster wich neckdive like an olympic diver.

- Finish is awesome, period. Couldn't believe how good the sunburst looked in real

All and all, worth every penny, as stated I ain't a reference but I like every bit of it. Might upgrade the pickups, pickguard, bridge and neck at some point, but I enjoy it stock so much that I'm not in a rush for doing those.

Cheers!

Thanks very much....Im really excited about these...I have a black VM Jag4 and am really wanting a black 5 string to match. I am a sucker for a P/J five string bass, and Jags too!

 

[Alistair R]

Just picked up a CAR P5. This is hands down one of the best basses for dollar value I've ever bought & I've played just about everything under the sun.

The neck, fit & finish, weight is all bloody good. I simply can't get over the quality of this bass for the price point. Don't really see any point in buying MIA Fenders anymore unless you're after specific vintage reissues, these things are as every bit as good as the standard MIA models.

Hell, even the B string has great definition. I find it has a really distinct P bass character tone all of its own. Compared to my NP4 loaded MIJ 90s P, it's got a lot more aggressive in the midrange and up high. Really has a nice growl to it with the tone rolled off. Probably won't be swapping the standard pickup out of this, it's great!

As for weight, well it's lighter than my $2000 Sandberg P5 which I got a few months ago..

All I can say is, GO BUY ONE!

 

[Marko 1]

I’ve been complaining for years that Fender wouldn’t put out a MIM or Squier Precision V, but in the meantime I got other basses I like, which makes this purchase more difficult to justify-- but for the price, it’s hard to resist.

I want the sunburst one, but I’m wondering, if I buy it on-line, what would be the odds that I’d get poorly matched grain.

If I were wise I’d probably go to GC so I can see/play one; the slightly-extra cost might be worth it.

I’m still considering the white one, though.

In any case, it’s wonderful to read the positive reviews.

 

[Alistair R]

Just get a CAR one, no mis-matching grain with a solid paint job!

 

[petrus61]

Just got back from my first rehearsal with my second try at the P5. I'm floored...I never touched my main bass. Yes, it's a little heavy, but the playability and tone is sick. I was totally expecting to want to change out the pickup, but perhaps not. There is really a singing sweetness to the tone of this bad boy. I really need to replace the strings as the ones that were on it (I think stock) are ok, but could be immediately improved upon. It has really reawakened my love of Fender style 5 strings. The best part was jamming on some stuff that is traditionally more suited to a Jazz. There was this punchiness when I played toward the bridge that can't be had on a typical P bass. I'm very impressed and glad I gave it a second chance...it really is luck of the draw but the second time was a charm for me.

I should add that I think the cap change had a fair bit to do with it as well. I replaced the .047 with a .068 and got to A/B with my decade/varitone box in real time. The .068 lets just enough treble through and retains thickness. The .047 happened to be where the roll off was most dramatic, letting in a hair more high end than I'd like with this bass. For anyone looking to experiment, I'd highly recommend trying out a .068

 

[Alistair R]

Just got back from my first rehearsal with my second try at the P5. I'm floored...I never touched my main bass. Yes, it's a little heavy, but the playability and tone is sick. I was totally expecting to want to change out the pickup, but perhaps not. There is really a singing sweetness to the tone of this bad boy. I really need to replace the strings as the ones that were on it (I think stock) are ok, but could be immediately improved upon. It has really reawakened my love of Fender style 5 strings. The best part was jamming on some stuff that is traditionally more suited to a Jazz. There was this punchiness when I played toward the bridge that can't be had on a typical P bass. I'm very impressed and glad I gave it a second chance...it really is luck of the draw but the second time was a charm for me.

I should add that I think the cap change had a fair bit to do with it as well. I replaced the .047 with a .068 and got to A/B with my decade/varitone box in real time. The .068 lets just enough treble through and retains thickness. The .047 happened to be where the roll off was most dramatic, letting in a hair more high end than I'd like with this bass. For anyone looking to experiment, I'd highly recommend trying out a .068

Agreed. Expected to want to change the pickup, but the stock pup has a great character all of its own.

 

[awilkie84]

Sometimes its too easy to get hung up on figures and forget to use your ears.

Right, after 48 hours with my PJ i must say how happy i am with it. Ive done a set up, shimmed the neck and put XL's and strap locks on it.
Its a lot more playable than it was, and the strings make it feel more familiar. Ive got an annoying rattle coming form somewhere but only when i play certain notes, and its not coming through my amp so ill work that out if and when i can be bothered.
I dont think the foam under the P pup is doing its job, if i raise the pup it doesn't move unless i pull it up. Ill take a look at that soon, but for now its fine.

I cant put my finger on it but the bass feels cheap to me. I cant find any fault with anything, not evne the neck pocket or finish, so maybe its just the weight, or lack of, that's giving this impression. Whatever it is its not a big deal, just an observation.

This will definitely be my only gigging bass from now on, unless something happens to it.

Squier Vintage Modified PJ Bass by Invalid Link Removed, on Flickr

Squier Vintage Modified PJ Bass by Invalid Link Removed, on Flickr

Squier Vintage Modified PJ Bass by Invalid Link Removed, on Flickr

That rattle is likely coming from either a loose tuning peg screw, or your A string's break angle, or the spring on 1 of the saddles not being compressed.

I've had all 3 issues & they're easy fixes.

Tighten the tuning peg screws (the big one on the back of the mechanism)
Over-wind your A string down a couple more rounds so that the break angle is better seated in the nut.
Check the springs and put a longer one in, if any of them are moving.

 

[dave_bass5]

Thnaks for the suggestions. I have tired two of those, I've had my hand over the tuning pegs when plucking, and checked the springs. I'll have another go with the a string though.
It's not a loud rattle, more a sympathetic vibration if that makes sense.

When I first got my Classic vibe Jazz I had a loud buzz. It turned out the one of the plates that you turn on the tuning peg had a very slight gap down the side, I had to put a bit of super glue on it. That was the only issue I had with that bass.

One other thing I've noticed is the bridge pup seems a bit short. You can see in my pic that the G doesn't sit evenly over the two pole pices, but also that you couldn't really move the pup as then the E would be wrong. Even the stock pic on fenders website shows this (although it's the E that's not right). Very strange. It doesn't bother me much, I'm going to put a model J in there as soon as I can find one for sale.

 

[Hank Scorpio]

Is the jazz pickup a neck-sized one? Thinking of picking up a PJ, and would like to try it with SD QPs at some point