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New: Zoom B3n Multi-Effects

#2,321
Hello All!

2 week owner of a B3n, with previous experience of modelling limited to 6 months with a Bass Pod XT and a TC Electronics amp with two Toneprint Modules. Late to the party, but ready to participate!

So far, having a lot of fun. After reading all 116 pages of this Forum (over the last week), had a couple questions:

First, am I correctly/incorrectly understanding how the B3 worked with it's Amp and Cab Models -- that they were matched together, whereas the B3n, you can mix/match? I'm asking only to maybe explain to myself why the whole library of Models was not ported over (or, taking long to do so)-- thinking that they had to have a total re-write to separate the Amps from the Cabs.

Second, I find it odd that there is no Cab model for a 1x15 solution. Glaring, even. Hopefully, that can be taken care of if/when Zoom ports over the Ampeg B-15 Amp and Cab set. Not sure if this makes me weird, but I always favored the sound and design of the 1x15.

Lastly, what's on your wish list? Personally, if they did a model of the Alembic F2-B, I'd be gushingly happy.

--T
 
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#2,326
trekster0721 said:
First, am I correctly/incorrectly understanding how the B3 worked with it's Amp and Cab Models -- that they were matched together, whereas the B3n, you can mix/match? I'm asking only to maybe explain to myself why the whole library of Models was not ported over (or, taking long to do so)-- thinking that they had to have a total re-write to separate the Amps from the Cabs.

Second, I find it odd that there is no Cab model for a 1x15 solution. Glaring, even. Hopefully, that can be taken care of if/when Zoom ports over the Ampeg B-15 Amp and Cab set. Not sure if this makes me weird, but I always favored the sound and design of the 1x15.
Click to expand...

You can mix and match the cabs, I don't know if you could do that on the B3 but I think you could on other Zoom bass pedals. The delays are more likely because these are new, higher quality sims being written from the ground up. At least that is what we'd all like to think!

No 1x15 and maybe you have already done this but if you download the February (or was it the May/June?) "patch" update you can install an AC370 sim and it comes with a 1x18 cab sim.

I'd like to see them port over all the effects/amps/cabs they had on the other bass pedals for a start. I don't ask for much, do I? But I am quite happy with the pedal as it is so I am not dying to see that done. I suspect they will do that over time.
 
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#2,327
Goteky45 said:
An Orange model would be great. I never ser them on these devices. An Hiwatt would also be nice. And an SWR Interstellar overdrive...

I'd also like more 1slot synth and dirt options. Most of the better sounding ones to me ocupy 2 fx slots
Click to expand...
Orange and Hiwatt are on the guitar pedals.

jimfist uses the G5n Hiwatt in his bass patches. Perhaps it's available on the MS-50G?
 
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#2,328
Finally got myself a Pedaltrain Metro 20 for my B3n...

WIN_20170904_05_20_47_Pro.jpg


I was actually contemplating whether to get the Metro 16 or the 20, cause I had wanted my next pedal set to be on the compact side as I already had 2 bigger sets. I was almost certain that I was getting the 16, but turned out local dealer only had it in the hard case version that I didn't prefer as it would be bulkier and cost more.

But with the 20, there's an empty space on the left side of the board...

So, I've been thinking to get one of the following to fill it with:
  • the zoom FP02M expression pedal, which I might need as a simple volume pedal when I decided to bypass onstage (rented) amp's preamp/went strait to amp's effect loop return, where I usually lose the ability to control the amp's volume, since on most amp, connecting straight to the effect loop return means that the amp's vol knob is also bypassed. But luckily B3n has a knob on it's top right which functions as master vol knob when in stomp or memory modes, so I might not need the FP02M after all;
  • a pure DI box such as the Radial or any others, which I might need when gigging ampless;
  • any preamp pedal with built-in DI, same as above, but it would be a slight redundant with the Zoom's amp modelling, although it would be quicker to have a preamp on it's own to shape the overal tone.
Any input?
 
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#2,329
Aidil said:
Finally got myself a Pedaltrain Metro 20 for my B3n...

...I've been thinking to get one of the following to fill it with:
  • the zoom FP02M expression pedal...
  • a pure DI box such as the Radial or any others, which I might need when gigging ampless;
  • any preamp pedal with built-in DI... it would be quicker to have a preamp on it's own to shape the overal tone.
Any input?
Click to expand...
I would do a good passive DI. Keeps the power supply requirements simple, gives you a reliable backup.

The only reason I can see for an external preamp, would be you like to use a lot of effects and sometimes run out of FX slots in the B3n.

If that were the case, then it would be advantageous to have an external preamp/DI- you could free up at least a slot or two on the B3n by using the tone shaping features of the other pedal.
 
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#2,330
steve_rolfeca said:
I would do a good passive DI. Keeps the power supply requirements simple, gives you a reliable backup.

The only reason I can see for an external preamp, would be you like to use a lot of effects and sometimes run out of FX slots in the B3n.

If that were the case, then it would be advantageous to have an external preamp/DI- you could free up at least a slot or two on the B3n by using the tone shaping features of the other pedal.
Click to expand...
Yes, filling the space with a good passive DI would keep the board simple indeed.

I don't think I'll ever run out of the 7 slots or the processing power of the B3n.
 
#2,331
Aidil said:
Yes, filling the space with a good passive DI would keep the board simple indeed.

I don't think I'll ever run out of the 7 slots or the processing power of the B3n.
Click to expand...
It happens easier than you think :


1. Znr
2. Boost/dirt
3+4. Amp
5. Modulation (chorus/flange/phase)
6.delay
7.cab

What if you want a filter, reverb, compressor or eq in that patch?


It CAN happen!

My solution is to either run a B3 (for comp, delay and verb), stomps ie Comp, EQ and delay, or a MS (70cdr/60b) after it.
I'm still experimenting with that but so far the B3 works well like that.
 
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#2,332
steve_rolfeca said:
I would do a good passive DI. Keeps the power supply requirements simple, gives you a reliable backup.

The only reason I can see for an external preamp, would be you like to use a lot of effects and sometimes run out of FX slots in the B3n.

If that were the case, then it would be advantageous to have an external preamp/DI- you could free up at least a slot or two on the B3n by using the tone shaping features of the other pedal.
Click to expand...
What is a good passive DI for bass?
 
#2,334
I've found a bug!
I've set up a preset, includes the following effect in the same order:
OptoComp - Splitter - BaFsSmile - SuperCho - DI-5 - Exciter - LMT76

The preset was working well, it was set under the 3rd footswitch. Suddenly when I switched to the preset, there was a loud click, and no sound. I switched to another program, and loud click, but sound came back. Switching back, the same thing happened. I've moved to another scenario, to check if the footswitch died phisically, but no, the other presets worked fine.
I've swapped the bugged preset to another position, where it did the same. I've deleted the Optocomp from the beginning of the line, and the preset worked well.
Maybe I've just overflowed the memory, but the strange thing is, that the preset worked before, and unit allowed me to select these effects.

I've sent this on email to Zoom on the 11th of august, but they haven't replied yet, they must be very busy with sg else :)
 
#2,336
Johno Dunn said:
Any experience with the Radial SB-2?
Click to expand...
Not the SB-2 but I can say that I have been involved in the live event staging industry for 35 years now and Radial DI's have become the standard for professional touring sound companies. Radial simply does not make a bad product so I wouldn't hesitate to buy one. B&H has them for $70 and you have 30 days to return it. Such a deal!
 
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#2,337
Johno Dunn said:
Any experience with the Radial SB-2?
Click to expand...
I'm curious to find out what people with practical experience hear when they A/B the SB-2 with the JDI.

There are differences in performance, to the point that Radial hides behind the numbers a bit. The SB-2 gets a simplified set of graphs for the specs page.

For example:
  • THD for the SB-2 is 0.05% at 20Hz, and still pretty noticeable all the way up to 2KHz.
  • They add the JDI's THD to its noise leakage, yet it's still negligible right out to 20KHz.
  • The JDI's THD relative to signal level looks similar on the graph, until you realize that they graph the JDI at ONE Hertz, and again at 20KHz. The SB-2 is only measured at 1KHz.
More telling, is that the FAQ for the Stagebug disagrees with the spec sheet, indicating that it's only flat down to 40Hz.

Still, the only thing I've heard when comparing my JDI to the ProDI, was some extra detail in the low end, and a sense of... weight? on the B string.

It's quite possible that a user might hear the SB-2's lower specs as a pleasing colouration. Or not notice it at all...
 
Last edited:
#2,338
steve_rolfeca said:
I'm curious to find out what people with practical experience hear when they A/B the SB-2 with the JDI.

There are major differences in performance, to the point that Radial hides behind the numbers a bit. The SB-2 gets a simplified set of graphs for the specs page.

For example:
  • THD for the SB-2 is 0.05% at 20Hz, and still pretty noticeable all the way up to 2KHz.
  • They add the JDI's THD to its noise leakage, yet it's still negligible right out to 20KHz.
  • The JDI's THD relative to signal level looks similar on the graph, until you realize that they graph the JDI at ONE Hertz, and again at 20KHz. The SB-2 is only measured at 1KHz.
More telling, is that the FAQ for the Stagebug disagrees with the spec sheet, indicating that it's only flat down to 40Hz.

Still, the only thing I've heard when comparing my JDI to the ProDI, was some extra detail in the low end, and a sense of... weight? on the B string.

It's quite possible that a user might hear the SB-2's lower specs as a pleasing colouration. Or not notice it at all...
Click to expand...
The JDI costs 3x as much and incorporates a Jensen transformer so one would expect superior performance. I think the SB-2 would suffice for most applications, it is still better than most of the DI's out there. BSS and Countryman also offer great DI's, I'm sure there are others. Many have to balance cost to performance.
 
#2,339
Stu_Bass said:
The JDI costs 3x as much and incorporates a Jensen transformer so one would expect superior performance. I think the SB-2 would suffice for most applications, it is still better than most of the DI's out there. BSS and Countryman also offer great DI's, I'm sure there are others. Many have to balance cost to performance.
Click to expand...
I'm sure that the Stagebug will still be superior to Behringer, IMP, the cheapest Whirlwind, etc. If nothing else, Radial products are always going to be more rugged.

Still curious how audible the compromises are with the SB-2, though. According to Radial, the Stagebug gets a cheaper Eclipse transformer than the one in the ProDI.

Yet the graphs indicate that performance is actually marginally better than the ProDI on some specs. If it sits in between the ProDI and the JDI performance-wise, then it really is a steal at $70!
 
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#2,340
In case anyone was waiting, Zoom's September 2017 Guitar Lab update was released and it did not include anything new for the B3n. One can perhaps assume that B3n owners are on a quarterly update plan as opposed to the near-monthly update plan for the Gn series?

To add insult to injury, Zoom NA is currently running a $25-off promotion for the G3n, bringing its street price down from $149 to $125. The red-painted B3n built on the exact same hardware sits firmly at $199.

Rather than accuse Zoom of bassist discrimination and price gouging, I will overlook all of this should they ever decide to open their model library so that B3n users can use Gn series models and vice-versa. In this way, we all can partake in new Guitar Lab updates if/when they occur and never again will Zoom need to defend their stance on not offering a bass product with a built-in expression pedal.

3 form factors, one platform, "We are for all creators!" </rant> ;)

Cheers!
 
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