Mike- Don't ever include the name Joey Harrington in any NFL discussions. To a Detroit fan it's like joking about bombs in the TSA line at the airport.
You can Jeff Garcia, Jon Kitna, and Dante Culpepper to that no discussion list in Detroit too.
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NFL Week #1
- Thread starter mrpackerguy
- Start date
Mike- Don't ever include the name Joey Harrington in any NFL discussions. To a Detroit fan it's like joking about bombs in the TSA line at the airport.
You can Jeff Garcia, Jon Kitna, and Dante Culpepper to that no discussion list in Detroit too.
Westbrook was a fine weapon in his prime, but he didn't contribute meaningfully until 2004, only broke 1,000 yards rushing in '06 and '07 and was too small to be of much use in crucial third and short rushing situations.
Same here. I can't speak to his current ability because I haven't followed him recently. And don't let his goofy remarks in later years color the perception of McNabb as a player in '00-'04.
I'd put him around 5-6 in that time span.
I can certainly see him as bottom end of the top five - but "easy top five" seems to put him above that.
So who is above him during that time span? Don't include up to now. 2000-2004 only. You had Brees before, but you really think he is better than McNabb when he only played two full seasons of the five seasons in our span?
-Mike
-Mike
Exactly between McNabb's rookie year and 2004 (pre Brian Westbrook ) when he was still a "black quaterback" # 5 was a stud.
Far better a football player than a young Drew Brees or a fumbling Dante Culpepper.Once he decided he was a pocket passer he became average, although the addition of Westbrook negated the need for McNabb to run, the decision to do so was a result of a push by his agent to prolong his career.
The QB rating system is skewed in so far as rushing yards, case in point Mike Vick's 98 yards yesterday figure nowhere in the equation even though he got the birds a half dozen 1st downs with his legs
Far better a football player than a young Drew Brees or a fumbling Dante Culpepper.Once he decided he was a pocket passer he became average, although the addition of Westbrook negated the need for McNabb to run, the decision to do so was a result of a push by his agent to prolong his career.
The QB rating system is skewed in so far as rushing yards, case in point Mike Vick's 98 yards yesterday figure nowhere in the equation even though he got the birds a half dozen 1st downs with his legs
I can't agree. McNair was league MVP in 2003, which in theory means that not only was he the best player at his position in the league, but he was also th best overall player out of everyone.
Air McNair was the glue on the offense of a team that never had a great receiver save for Mason. McNabb always had talent around him in Philly.
Stop saying Mcnabb had talent in Philly. He did late in his career, but not even close during his prime.
He had T.O. and Westbrook. Plus a trio of 500 yard receivers and TE's. I'm not saying he had Brady level talent around him, but he certainly had better talent around him than McNair.
jp58 said:
Theory perhaps, but not really. Besides, McNair shared the MVP in 2003 with Manning in the AP award for MVP. It also depends on what MVP award you are referring to. McNair only appeared in the AP MVP, none of the others like Sporting News mentioned him.
-Mike
jp58 said:
McNabb had TO for only one season in the range we are talking about, well that I'm talking about. In 2003, the Eagles set a modern NFL record when only five TD's were scored by WR's for the entire season.
-Mike
It's going to be a long season for Indy fans. No Manning, but he doesn't play defense and they looked pathetic at times.
My optimism is really low this year. The pendulum has swung.
My optimism is really low this year. The pendulum has swung.
Raiders FTW! YES! Also, I think Manning is done. The colts picked the 38 y/o qb to make sure they get a good draft pick next year. I don't even think they will make the playoffs
1. Black QB is derogatory. Scrambling QB is a much better fit. There have been QB's of both races that play that way.
2. The ESPN total QB rating figures everything from rushing yards to when the play occurred in the game. Smart fans also know that the passer rating is only a piece of the puzzle.
Buckhalter, Westbrook, and Duece Staley scored the ball 30 times that season. 20 on the ground and 10 in the air. I feel pretty safe in saying that Donovan had some kind of weapon on that team, even if it was a 3 headed running back Hydra monster. Plus the WR's had 1500 yards as a corps and Donovan shored up 3k through the air.
I don't put much stock in the QB rating, as to if he's good or not. There are too many catchable passes, that are dropped due to receiver error, which helps lower that rating/overall QB stats. Which is also why I would like to see a separate stat for INT's that are due to receiver error rather than the QB throwing a bad ball.
I think ESPN got their numbering completely upside down on this total defense stat, but as I guessed, GB and NOLA aren't going to like being ranked in the bottom third of the league in total D. 2011 NFL Team Total Stats - National Football League - ESPN
What strikes me is the yardage put up by offenses this week and passing yards. Some commentator said it - no doubt it's a passing league now.
What strikes me is the yardage put up by offenses this week and passing yards. Some commentator said it - no doubt it's a passing league now.
McNabb with Moss and Carter vs. Culpepper with the Philly cast of players, who do you think will have the better passing stats?
