Novel take on "dead spots"

[Raman]

None of my many headless basses have deadspots and they're of different constructions.
However, the above is my theory only and is not proven, and is based on my own experience, but makes sense to my engineer's brain. Hopefully it gives you and others something to think about.

PS: what is your avatar pic? Makes me think of Sean Rowe.

My avatar pic is a drawing of my actual self. A friend drew it.

 

[Watchootognbout]

It's been reported that dead spots occur more frequently on 4 string basses. It has to do with how the whole instrument vibrates. Mass, size, type of bridge and type of strings, the tension on the neck, etc. All that matters into the equation. And apparently, 5 and 6 string basses have enough mass to nullify the "dead spot" issue.

I knew that.
I wondered if anyone else knew it.

 

[Phlipper]

Does one brand/style suffer from dead spots more than others?

I've owned more than 10 Ibanez SRs and only one suffered from it. An SR370. It drove me nuts cuz I'm autistic and OCD. Changed strings, had new nut cut, changed pickups ... no help. Finally sold it.

Had no idea that it could stem from weight distribution.

 

[Ric Vice]

On a Double Bass there can be what we call a wolf tone (usually on the A string) where the note just doesn't sustain like the notes above and below it. We use what's affectionately called a "wolf eliminator" to help correct the problem.
Whether or not that would work on a EB I'm not sure. You have to be careful with them so you don't damage the string putting them on. They come in different weights. If someone's handy with metal work it might be a way to solve dead spots
Since most EB's really don't have a tailpieces with string after lengths below the bridge I'm not sure how it would even work on a bass guitar, but it's an interesting idea.

 

[bass12]

It's been reported that dead spots occur more frequently on 4 string basses. It has to do with how the whole instrument vibrates. Mass, size, type of bridge and type of strings, the tension on the neck, etc. All that matters into the equation. And apparently, 5 and 6 string basses have enough mass to nullify the "dead spot" issue.

As a primarily five string player I wish that was true!

 

[bass12]

None of my many headless basses have deadspots and they're of different constructions.
However, the above is my theory only and is not proven, and is based on my own experience, but makes sense to my engineer's brain. Hopefully it gives you and others something to think about.

PS: what is your avatar pic? Makes me think of Sean Rowe.

The worst dead spot I have ever encountered (without exaggeration) was on a headless, graphite-necked bass. It was so bad I returned and exchanged it for another (which also had a dead spot in a similar location).

 

[takeout]

I've posted it elsewhere, but I have a working theory that 4-in-line headstocks, being asymmetrical, are partially to blame. Different string attachment points, coupled with different string tensions, creating some sort of tiny torsional twist in the neck that introduces things like this.

I'd be interested to hear from anyone with a reverse headstock Fender neck - does the G string still have the dead spot somewhere around frets 5-8? Do new dead spots get introduced elsewhere?

 

[Snert]

The worst dead spot I have ever encountered (without exaggeration) was on a headless, graphite-necked bass. It was so bad I returned and exchanged it for another (which also had a dead spot in a similar location).

That tells me it was a design flaw on the part of that manufacturer, not inherent to headless. I have PKs testimony and my own experience of 34 and 32 headless, in a number of construction types with zero issues.

 

[bass12]

That tells me it was a design flaw on the part of that manufacturer, not inherent to headless. I have PKs testimony and my own experience of 34 and 32 headless, in a number of construction types with zero issues.

A design flaw? Maybe, though Status Graphite has been in the game a while. It does, regardless, prove that headless basses can have dead spots.

 

[Snert]

A design flaw?

In that particular model made in that period. Where are the other people with the same making the same claim? For all you and I know there was something wrong, they found it and corrected it.

Maybe, though Status Graphite has been in the game a while.

Sure, and they're not perfect either.

It does, regardless, prove that headless basses can have dead spots.

Sure, in some models of some designs. Most flat construction 4IL headstocks on Fenders seem to have an issue in the same spot, but other brands don't seem to. That tells me it's most likely the way Fender construct their headstocks, and not an issue with all 4ILs.

 

[Lenny JG]

It's been reported that dead spots occur more frequently on 4 string basses. It has to do with how the whole instrument vibrates. Mass, size, type of bridge and type of strings, the tension on the neck, etc. All that matters into the equation. And apparently, 5 and 6 string basses have enough mass to nullify the "dead spot" issue.

I never encountered a dead spot until I purchased my 2 six string basses. I've played, 4s and 5s.

On Mr. Potato, if my neck truss rod is pulling the neck even slightly more than flat, I automatically have about 3 dead spots. On my Legator same thing but only like 2 dead spots. If I barely nudge my truss nut left when this happens, the dead spots go away.

 

[bass12]

In that particular model made in that period. Where are the other people with the same making the same claim? For all you and I know there was something wrong, they found it and corrected it.

Sure, and they're not perfect either.

Sure, in some models of some designs. Most flat construction 4IL headstocks on Fenders seem to have an issue in the same spot, but other brands don't seem to. That tells me it's most likely the way Fender construct their headstocks, and not an issue with all 4ILs.

I'm just relaying my experience. Take from it what you will.

 

[Snert]

I'm just relaying my experience. Take from it what you will.

Sure, and you should do the same with mine. We're discussing anecdotes here, not evidence being put before a court.

 

[RichterScale]

My name literally means "judge".
So, if you need me to settle something or make a ruling,......

 

[Snert]

My name literally means "judge".

If the next word is Judy, I'll pass, but Judge Jeanine I think is sexy so I'm willing to take my punishment.

Apologies to those I've now traumatised with that mental image, as I know it will stay in your heads a long time.

I'm wondering which now.

 

[RichterScale]

I dunno, I think Judy's kinda hot.

 

[Snert]

I'm grading on a curve, so to speak.

 

[Ric Vice]

Sure, in some models of some designs. Most flat construction 4IL headstocks on Fenders seem to have an issue in the same spot, but other brands don't seem to. That tells me it's most likely the way Fender construct their headstocks, and not an issue with all 4ILs.

Very interesting, by way of comparison, a Double Bass doesn't have a 4 IL headstock, because it's not part of the "tradition". So, could you tell me where the "dead spot's" in a Fender 4 inline headstock are usually at?

 

[Snert]

Very interesting, by way of comparison, a Double Bass doesn't have a 4 IL headstock, because it's not part of the "tradition". So, could you tell me where the "dead spot's" in a Fender 4 inline headstock are usually at?

Plenty of threads and mentions of it here for you to discover yourself, but here's the Kubicki article. But so you don't need to expend any effort F5 or F6 G string.

 

[Lobster11]

Alright. We all know it’s been over discussed:
The dreaded “dead spot”.

I’ve been blessed for 30 years. I played bass without suspecting the existence of “dead spots”.
My 1st bass was headless. For many years, I strung it BEAD. My next main bass was an Ergodyne 5-stringer. And finally, I’ve mostly played a G&L L-2500. All have been completely free of “dead spots”.

Then, I entered the realm of the P bass. And suddenly, “dead spots” were a thing.

Let’s go over the common knowledge about the phenomena:

-“Dead spots” appear most frequently on the G string, between the 3rd and 7th fret.
-They consist in a note played on that part of the neck that dies prematurely.
-The note at that fret plays softer and dies faster, quickly going into decaying harmonic frequencies.
-A “dead spot” has to do with the bass vibrating in a way that absorbs the fretted string’s frequency.
-Playing the same note on the D string, rather than on the G, will not trigger the same “dead spot”.
-The problem is not confined to a few basses: it’s very common.
-Changing strings (lighter gauge) and neck tension is often mentioned as a solution.
-Adding weight to the headstock is often quoted as a possible solution too.
-Most solutions involve “moving the dead spot” around the neck, rather than resolving it.
-As the theory goes, playing with the weight and mass of the instrument has an effect.

And last but not least:
-Most bassists learn to live with “dead spots”, so should you.
-You don’t need that one note to sustain forever.
…

I don't have anything to add to the discussion, but just wanted to compliment you on an excellent summary of many years of TB threads on this topic.