Observations from a recent metal show

[Auspuff]

Let night I went to a local metal show. I was introduced to a Scottish metal group, Bleed from within. They were great. Not new, but new to American soil touring.

Takeaways from their set.

• Not an amp to be seen
• Tight, clean, very tastefully done tracking/triggering
• Bassist playing a beautiful high end ibanez 5 string soundgear, 34" scale

Devil wears Prada went next.

• Not an amp to be seen
• Tracks were a bit overdone and obvious
• Sound mix was strange
• Bassist played Dingeall D-Roc 4&5, but his tone was very muffled.
• Guitarists played Dunable and Reverend!

Headliner August burns red

• Not an amp to be seen
• Great sound, tight, clean
• Kiesel basses, and one guitarist. Lead guitar had beautiful gold metal flake Ibanez

No amps at all. I didn't see a pedal board either. I think they ran there entire sets through processors (likely fractal), controlled by midi/computers. They interacted, played skillfully, focused on the crowd, and no one knew the better.

This is the present and the future. Flame on, old farts!

True. People don't know any better.

 

[Auspuff]

If you're lucky, you'll get to be an old fart one day. Then you can lament over long gone days of IEM's and ampless stages that have been replaced by nmonic implants that emits the pitch perfect, multi instrument, music, from the microchip in your cerebellum and sent via thought to the synthetic speaker system in everyone's spinal colum... that you must pay in weekly instalments to Silicon Valley Investers or face switching off or cryogenic hibernation for late payments... all the while, the youth of the day abuse you telling you you're an old fart, you smell like asparagus and moth balls and frightened by change.
Enjoy it while you can for tomorrow you may not be you.

Amen!!!

 

[micguy]

Unless you’re a major touring band, amps make no sense nowadays. If you’re trying to do shows and not lose money doing it, a guitarist with a guitar in a gig bag in one hand and a Kemper in the other is a much more practical approach than moving and caring for tube amps on the road. It’s also far more consistent, and you can dial things in easier at FOH when you’re not fighting stage wash. So, more practical, and it sounds better. Why wouldn’t you do it that way?

 

[DaveParker39]

I do plenty of gigs with top sound and I still use an amp for reasons mentioned before, namely not wanting to hear it out of monitors or ears.

There's a difference between "plenty of gigs with top sound" and "using the exact same sound system and engineer every night" and I was referring to the latter, although it was not clear with my post.
That said, even people touring with the same sound system and engineer still use amps... I'd just as soon not.

 

[sean_on_bass]

it's fascinating to me that metal performances seem to have more in common with an EDM show these days than classic rock. Hit play on Ableton and go. The amp dying mid performance is now replaced with the laptop deciding to run an update.

 

[ElectroVibe]

I respect anyone who can play to a click track. I could never do it.

 

[socialleper]

Bingo.

Worse still is going ampless in a small club that has a PA with poor coverage - people next to the stage get that "empty hole in the middle" vibe when a band doesn't have backline.

Don't get me wrong, I'd love not to have to load my gear for 30 minutes of play time, but for us bottom feeders it just ain't happening.
What I need to figure out is an independent IEM system that doesn't rely on the venue.

 

[scuzzy]

it's fascinating to me that metal performances seem to have more in common with an EDM show these days than classic rock. Hit play on Ableton and go. The amp dying mid performance is now replaced with the laptop deciding to run an update.

Pop, metal, jazz fusion, wedding bands, corporate bands, cover bands.... I've seen them all run Ableton.

I would bet most of the successful tribute acts around me use it as well, playing Zeppelin, Tom Petty, and Pink Floyd.

 

[DaveParker39]

Pop, metal, jazz fusion, wedding bands, corporate bands, cover bands.... I've seen them all run Ableton.

I would bet most of the successful tribute acts around me use it as well, playing Zeppelin, Tom Petty, and Pink Floyd.

There might be some point at which the music recorded by, say, Pink Floyd, was done on synths that are virtually impossible to recreate without software emulation in 2023.

 

[chazsundance]

Cool thing about Metallica live, I was in the Snakepit during Hardwired tour and each member has their own monitor mix that follows them along the stage as they move. Kirk kept running by and his guitar would come through the monitor he was closest to even if it was just for a few seconds, same with James and Robert. \m/ Maybe that's pretty common nowadays.

 

[Windreaper]

No they don't - next question.

The bars around me want minimal gear and hassle, because otherwise you're disturbing their dinner service, where the real money is made.

Again, does anyone here actually gig in the REAL world?!

Gotcha, understand your position now. Sounds like those bars should be providing better equipment or booking acoustic solo/duo acts.

The most hilarious misbooking I've been involved in was when my metal band was contracted to play during a Christmas dinner. Doubt started to creep in during load-in when we noticed there were only posters of dance bands in the lobby. Well, we tried to play as quiet as possible, but the genre probably wasn't a good fit with the audience, and people started leaving. The remaining guests enjoyed the performance and came to thank us afterward, though

 

[Dincrest]

Sick lineup!!!!

Bleed From Within is a killer band. I'm listening to their songs "Flesh and Stone" and "Invisible Enemy" right now. I like the variety of shouts and growls the vocalist does.

I'm not big on Devil Wears Prada, but respect what they do. I'm listening to their new song "Ignorance" and I like how lushly textured the music is. Their shout vocalist has one hell of a scream.

And August Burns Red is amazing. Their recent album "Death Below" is currently my favorite album of 2023. Dustin Davidson is much better bassist (and musician) than a lot of people give him credit for.

 

[scuzzy]

Sick lineup!!!!

Bleed From Within is a killer band. I'm listening to their songs "Flesh and Stone" and "Invisible Enemy" right now. I like the variety of shouts and growls the vocalist does.

I'm not big on Devil Wears Prada, but respect what they do.

And August Burns Red is amazing. Their recent album "Death Below" is currently my favorite album of 2023. Dustin Davidson is much better bassist (and musician) than a lot of people give him credit for.

Agree on all counts. Bleed from within blew the doors off. Excellent band.

Interesting you mention Dustin. He played lead guitar on about 4-5 songs in the middle of the set and killed it. He was tapping and shredding all over. I was blown away. The rhythm guitarist played bass. They sounded really good in that arrangement too.

 

[Dincrest]

I feel like there's a growing under-the-radar bloom of Dustin Davidson memes along the lines of "when your bassist is a better lead guitarist than your lead guitarist."

But, yeah, dude is a monster musician. And I love in interviews how humble the band is. Like when that one YouTube channel was doing Rig Rundown interviews with everyone in August Burns Red, Dustin's energy was like that person you meet at an event who's just genuinely happy to be there and totally in that moment talking to you.

 

[scuzzy]

I feel like there's a growing under-the-radar bloom of Dustin Davidson memes along the lines of "when your bassist is a better lead guitarist than your lead guitarist."

But, yeah, dude is a monster musician. And I love in interviews how humble the band is. Like when that one YouTube channel was doing Rig Rundown interviews with everyone in August Burns Red, Dustin's energy was like that person you meet at an event who's just genuinely happy to be there and totally in that moment talking to you.

And props to Brubaker, who is a MONSTER player, for being humble and self-secure enough to share that limelight.

They are a unique group. I like them more each time I see them.

 

[pglaser01]

That’s like sooo 2021. The latest thing is AI generated music, didn’t you know? All backing tracks with no humans. Your cutting edge metal show is stuck in the past.

ugh……here I thought I was being replaced on bass by a guy named Chet Gepuhtee

 

[Dadum]

That’s like sooo 2021. The latest thing is AI generated music, didn’t you know? All backing tracks with no humans. Your cutting edge metal show is stuck in the past.

That’s called Heavy Silicon you Carbon Head

 

[Admiral Akbar]

Whatever works. Personally I massively prefer the feeling of playing real tube amps and I will never get rid of my amps. I might feel different about this if I still did a lot of touring though. Especially after several weeks of dragging 8x10 fridges up narrow staircases at 3 am...

From what I've seen this also varies a lot between different genres of music. I mostly see the ampless approach with event/cover bands (presumably for fast/easy setup) and with metal bands. I'm not sure why more metal bands seem to move towards ampless setups than other genres but metal guitar/bass tone is usually more about clinical precision than "feeling" the dynamics of the amp/cab. I suspect this might be part of the reason: Easier setup with no real loss of tone/feel (with "feel" being the key word). With other genres that use less distorted/compressed tones the difference in "feel" might be more of a compromise. At least compared to real tube amps (rather than more modern types of amps).

The most surprising thing to me is that GUITAR players embrace this technology. Bass players have always been more open to stuff like Class D amps and other new technology and we've been using DI-based setups on stage for decades. Guitar players are generally a lot more conservative about their equipment.

(Btw, I used to play metal and I still love metal music so this is not in any way intended to suggest that metal is an inferior musical genre where "feel" doesn't matter at all, it's just my personal observations based on what I've seen in my local area.)

So - this is metal and rock, and of course, pop.

I wonder if we would ever see this genres like jazz or blues. I can’t imagine a blues guitarist playing through an amp modeler. Nor a jazz cat.

 

[Artman]

Well, not exactly. He always had an Orange AD200B in his rack system, along with Avalon U5s and Tech21 RBIs/RPMs, all combined on the mixing desk. It was just off-stage. No cabs anyway, that's correct.

Same for Dusty Hill: amps in an off-stage rack and cab in an iso-box.

Even John Petrucci has all his gear off-stage, amps, Fractal FX units and miked cabs, just because they're not on stage it doesn't mean no amps at all.

I stand about 1/2 corrected.
There was one amp head, no cabs at all....for a while.
Confirmed from 18:00 to 22:35

Of particular note is the segment at 20:14
"Beginning in 2002, Geddy dispensed with traditional bass amplifiers in favor of the already mentioned DI units and In Ear Monitors."

 

[retslock]

So - this is metal and rock, and of course, pop.

I wonder if we would ever see this genres like jazz or blues. I can’t imagine a blues guitarist playing through an amp modeler. Nor a jazz cat.

Recently a blues guitarist friend played through a Quilter Tone Block and loved it. Perhaps not exactly what you’re referring to but definitely not your usual blues gear. He has always used conventional amps and always has a great sound but he said the Quilter gave him everything he needed.