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PA Advice

Discussion in 'Live Sound [BG]' started by Blue, Apr 22, 2012.

  1. Apr 22, 2012 #1
    Blue

    Blue

    Jun 19, 2004
    Southeast Penna
    Not really "Bass" .. but maybe y'all can help anyway: In short - I'm rebuilding my small-band PA. Currently I'm setting up a new dbx PA+ to "coordinate" 2-mains (RCF 200's) with my sub (an EA VL-208) ... and I have a new set of K8's to use as side-fill/fold-back monitors. My Bass goes to a sub-mix which includes the crossover'd PA+ sub-output > QCS amp > EA Cab'. Mains are out front, Bass Cab in the back, K8's (side fills) on stands beside the main speaker stands but pointing back.

    What I'm trying - haven't live tested yet - is sending the same post PA+ signal to the mains and the K8's ... setting crossover / EQ / AFE for the House. The K8's will have the same signal as the mains and - at least theoretically - the stage sound will be what the audience hears - so if out-front a band-mate is way too loud (or soft) it should be apparent.

    I'm concerned about being able to tweak individual levels in the monitor mix - so I plan to use the AUX sends from the mixer into the second K8 channels (AUX-1 Send to the left, AUX-2 send to the right) - in this way I'll be ably to supplement the stage level - if Joe needs more of himself he can get it via .. really a "doubling" of .. that one channel (already going to the mains).

    Am I missing something? Is this really clever or really stupid? fwiw, it'll be only vocals and a tiny amount of guitars (supplementing on stage amps) going into the mains (no drums of bass), and the music is electro-acoustic not loud americana.
     
  2. Apr 22, 2012 #2
    TomB

    TomB Supporting Member

    Aug 24, 2007
    Vermont
    I'm not totally sure I get the question but that won't stop me :). When you talk about sending "the same post PA+ signal to the mains and the K8's", do you mean literally a mains send to both systems, or do you mean roughly the same relative levels to both mains and aux sends so that you're somewhat "duplicating" the main mix levels in the monitors? If the latter's what you mean: channel send to mains, aux 1 to left and aux 2 to right monitors, then it should work perfectly to get whatever level of individual channel + overall aux channel volume level you wish into each monitor, and obviously they'll be EQ'd the same as the mains. It sounds like a great idea as long as you have 2 aux sends & a pair of powered monitor speakers on hand (many of us don't!). Does that get at your question?
     
  3. Apr 22, 2012 #3
    Blue

    Blue

    Jun 19, 2004
    Southeast Penna
    Yes . the K8 has a line-in and also a line-out to provide an identical signal to another line-in - so the mixer output (post PA+ .. which adds (among other things) EQ and auto-anti-feedback ... goes to both. Each (the K8 and RCF 200) has an internal amp with volume control - so I can set their relative level from the same (identical) source. The K8 has a second input which would get aux 1 (left) and aux (right) ADDITIVE to the mains signal also on the K8's.
     
  4. Apr 23, 2012 #4
    TomB

    TomB Supporting Member

    Aug 24, 2007
    Vermont
    OK, I get it now, but I have no idea how it will work. Given that all the experimentation is on the low-voltage side I don't see any harm in trying it. Just bring up your aux masters slowly in case there's some strange artifact or feedback loop. My guess is it should be fine, I'm just not at all sure what advantage you gain other than feedback control, which shouldn't be a big issue anyway at the volumes you describe.
     
  5. Apr 23, 2012 #5
    Blue

    Blue

    Jun 19, 2004
    Southeast Penna
    Thanks ... the other advantage is a sense of relative levels going out to the audience.
     
  6. Apr 23, 2012 #6
    cheapbasslovin

    cheapbasslovin

    Oct 28, 2007
    Portland, OR
    Wouldn't it be easier to go dual mono into the DBX with the mains into one and the aux into the other?

    I wouldn't expect what you hear on stage to sound just like what the audience is hearing for a number of reasons, including speaker type and placement. That will go double when you start tweaking aux out levels. There wouldn't be any gain from getting so creative with the wiring.

    IMO.
     
  7. Apr 23, 2012 #7
    Bardley

    Bardley

    Nov 16, 2007
    Louisville, KY
    I'm not sure I would go this route as if you have an issue such as feedback or need to tweak eq for the house you will have little control over fixing it without pulling down everything. I would feed the K8s with an aux and get the mix similar to the house instead of trying to get the same signal. Not being able to adjust house and monitors individually would be a deal breaker for me. I understand you wanting to feed an aux as well into the K8s but that could lead to some phasing issues and other problems. Also, what if someone want's less of something in the K8s? You have to turn them down in the house as well. Stage monitoring is usually kept separate from the house feed for a reason.
    Best of luck!