+1. Ultimately it sounds like the beginning of the end to me. Never goes well after that crap starts.
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Passive-aggressive behavior
- Thread starter LBS-bass
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Honestly, just reading your posts in this thread, i get the feeling your problems with this guy isn’t only his fault, and conflicts rarely are due just to one.
You say you gave up the band leader type functions to another one in the band, but then later posts seem to indicate it’s at least not entirely so.
All that aside, as often as not, into each band some drama must fall.
You say you gave up the band leader type functions to another one in the band, but then later posts seem to indicate it’s at least not entirely so.
All that aside, as often as not, into each band some drama must fall.
agreed.
and to the OP…..there is some slight irony in the fact that by somehow allowing himself to set his own trap if you will, you too are acting somewhat passive-agressive. And I have to agree w Ron, this an exercise in time wasting by dragging this out. Everyone’s time and energy should be valuable enough to not have to deal with people playing stupid adult games. Y’all needs to address the elephant in the room some way some how.
There are plenty of examples but it’s not important enough to me to waste time with it
Please read the article I posted about passive-aggressive behavior and how it is defined and how it should be handled.
It seems that many here have never dealt with a person/situation like this before and would love for me to make some serious rookie mistakes. There are pages and pages of clear explanation back there for why this is probably not the best approach, and the expert opinions I've looked into affirm my thoughts on it.
At this point I'm not going to keep responding to blamers who won't see the actual problem here and would like to blame the person who is hoping to develop a solution that doesn't cause the band to implode. The band may well implode anyway, but at the end of the thing I am going to walk away knowing that it was, in no way, my own fault.
For those late to the party, please read this post because we're going over very old territory here and it's not really providing anything new that's of any value.
Passive-aggressive behavior
Passive-aggressive behavior
I’m not super interested in reading a random article about how I should respond to someone else when they’re acting like a butthole to me. However, life has taught me taught me that more often than not, especially when it’s in a work type environment, the issue needs to be addressed. And in you’re response, it seems as though the the only reason you choose not deal w it is so that you and others can see that it wasn’t your fault. Kind of selfish to waste everyone’s time so you get that satisfaction in the end. Again, if you’re the band leader, lead the band and deal it. Especially since it seems to be something everyone else is noticing
Sigh. Read the rest of my posts in here. I'm not the bandleader. I'm not NOT the bandleader. I'm the person who took on work nobody else wants to do and I'm kinda done with that. If you can't be bothered to read through the additional posts on a thread where so much has already been discussed, maybe just stay out of it?
If anyone wants to keep discussing this and brings in something new, I'll be chilling in the back but I'm not going over old territory anymore.
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so up until a recent moment you handled most everything correct? And everyone expect the offending member has mentioned this to you correct? So you handed off administrative only duties? Sorry, but the band IMO still views you as the leader. If not, someone would have taken care of this by now.
Best of luck. Update this thread and let us all know if you’re still a band in 2-3 months.
Not going over all this again. I'm going to ask the mods to close this thread, there's nothing substantial being added at this point.
My drummer's breath smells like cat food.
I don’t get it….you’ve clearly read the manual on how to handle the situation. So why did you post a question on how to handle it?
When personalities override professionalism things get dicey. Is this a band with intent to record original material and tour? Or simply a band cover band intent on making some extra money playing locally? I ask because that would make a major difference in whether I continue to be a member of the group.
That's actually answered in other posts, too. But I'll answer anyway.
Sometimes it helps to see things more clearly when you lay it out and then discuss it. I wasn't sure if what I wanted to do was the best approach or if there were other ways to view it that I hadn't considered, and I thought I'd get some clarity through having a bit of talk here. Which I did.
I also got some great advice via PM from a few folks who are professionals. The person I've handed this off to in the band also has expertise with conflict resolution, and I'm incorporating some additional insight that I received from some folks here.
So it's been very helpful, mainly to help me feel better about my decisions to step back a bit, but as one can expect, there are always a few who'd rather just kick someone around a little bit and pile on that way. So I've asked the mods to nip that in the bud, because I don't feel like there's anything unresolved in my plans at this point, and I'm not going to be so gracious if the pile-ons continue.
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I don't have much experience with bands and gigging, but I do have a lot of personal experience with problem personalities.
Let's start with Wikipedia because it's important to get the full context:
"Passive-aggressive behavior is characterized by a pattern of passive hostility and an avoidance of direct communication.[1][2] Inaction where some action is socially customary is a typical passive-aggressive strategy (showing up late for functions, staying silent when a response is expected).[2] Such behavior is sometimes protested by associates, evoking exasperation or confusion. People who are recipients of passive-aggressive behavior may experience anxiety due to the discordance between what they perceive and what the perpetrator is saying.[3]
...
Psychology
Further information: Passive–aggressive personality disorder
In psychology, "passive-aggression" is one of the most misused of psychological terms[citation needed]. After some debate, the American Psychiatric Association dropped it from the list of personality disorders in the DSM IV as too narrow to be a full-blown diagnosis and not well enough supported by scientific evidence to meet increasingly rigorous standards of definition[citation needed]. Culturally, the ambiguous "passive-aggressive" label is misused by lay persons and professionals alike[citation needed]. The removal of the passive-aggressive personality definition from the official diagnostic manual was in large measure because of the frequent misapplication and because of the often contradictory and unclear descriptions clinicians in the field provided[citation needed]. Most of the definitions which follow (which had previously been classified as passive-aggressive) are often more correctly described as overt aggression, or covert aggression (which is the correct definition to describe subtle, deliberate, calculating and underhanded tactics that manipulators and other disturbed characters use to intimidate, control, deceive and abuse others).
The outdated definition rejected by the American Psychiatric Association is as follows: Passive-aggressive behavior is characterized by a habitual pattern of non-active resistance to expected work requirements, opposition, sullenness, stubbornness, and negative attitudes in response to requirements for normal performance levels expected by others. Most frequently it occurs in the workplace, where resistance is exhibited by indirect behaviors such as procrastination, forgetfulness, and purposeful inefficiency, especially in reaction to demands by authority figures, but it can also occur in interpersonal contexts.[4]
Another source characterizes passive-aggressive behavior as: A personality trait marked by a pervasive pattern of negative attitudes and characterized by passive, sometimes obstructionist resistance to complying with expectations in interpersonal or occupational situations. Behaviors such as learned helplessness, procrastination, stubbornness, resentment, sullenness, or deliberate/repeated failure to accomplish requested tasks for which one is often explicitly responsible.[5] Other examples of passive-aggressive behavior may include avoiding direct or clear communication, evading problems, fear of intimacy or competition, making excuses, blaming others, obstructionism, playing the victim, feigning compliance with requests, sarcasm, backhanded compliments, and hiding anger.[6][7]
Conflict theory
In conflict theory, passive-aggressive behavior can resemble a behavior better described as catty, as it consists of deliberate, active, but carefully veiled hostile acts which are distinctively different in character from the non-assertive style of passive resistance.[8]"
Note that since passive aggressiveness is no longer categorized as a psychological disorder, it follows that passive aggressiveness is a symptom of other psychological disorders, since it is a dysfunctional behavior. Also note that the focus shifted from the passiveness to the aggression.
Does your bandmate have a substance abuse problem, a personality disorder, or a mood disorder? If so, you might want to consider distancing yourself from this person and possibly also distancing yourself from the band.
It sounds from the couple of pages that I read that you have a lot of history and sunk cost with these people. Consider the possibility that one or both of the other two members may be enabling the third. That's a sick situation all around and could be damaging to you emotionally, personally, or professionally.
By allowing this person to successfully maneuver you out of the responsibilities that you used to own, you have also enabled this person and weakened your position within the band. The claim that you are 'pushy' when all you did was ask for confirmation of availability for a gig indicates that this person may be undermining you behind your back. I'd expect a significant degree of lying, focused on character assassination, especially if you are already taking note of the gaslighting. Is this person a prima donna? Is there narcisssism involved?
This thread mushroomed quickly and I can't possibly devote the time to reading all of it, but I'll take a stab at it from the little that I did read. I won't be able to respond interactively because I have issues of my own, so I'm giving a data dump based on what I've learned about human behavior as a layman enduring it in spades.
There's a difference between a mood disorder and a personality disorder. A mood disorder is an endocrine thing. A personality disorder is a neurological thing. They can resemble each other but have differing flavors.
I have found that personality disorders and mood disorders rarely come in singles. If a person is malfunctioning in one area, they are usually malfunctioning in multiple areas. I'm not detecting any personality disorders in you, based on your reporting (I'm not a psychologist so take my feedback for what it's worth). You seem to be actively working things out and that's not what problem people do. I'd ignore the claims that your reporting is one-sided and not second-guess yourself. It is one-sided but it is also apparently objective IMO and again if there has already been some gaslighting going on that's not a subtlety, that's a huge red flag that you are dealing with a narcissist.
We are all a little crazy in our own unique way. Mental health practitioners don't diagnose based so much on disorders as much as they diagnose based on how much the person's behavior is interfering with their function. That's an explicit criterion on every diagnosis: the dysfunction. Since passive aggression isn't an indication of a dysfunction in its own right, we can only presume that the dysfunction is something more serious. Your band mate appears to be disrupting your band and I'd call that a problem. If you are perceiving it as passive-aggressive (it certainly sounds like it) I'd venture a guess that it's also a symptom of a diagnosable disorder that is causing significant dysfunction in this person's life overall and not limited to the band context. Let's run with that assumption because otherwise I don't have much to add over what's already been discussed, and keep in mind I could be completely off base in this assessment, so feel free to incorporate or ignore any part of it as you deem appropriate.
Wisdom on the street is that there are two archetypes of emotionally dysfunctional people bookending the spectrum. One is for the most part born, and the other is for the most part made by undue life stress. Both tend to be liars, because people with problem personalities compensate for their deficiencies by lying to assert control over the situation. Don't be at all surprised if this person is running around bad-mouthing you to your bandmates with made-up stories while telling you to your face that they have nothing but good things to say about you, or at a minimum strongly biasing their reporting on you by omitting essential facts and incidents while talking about you outside of your presence.
I am perceiving that this person has singled you out as vulnerable, possibly because of your gender, possibly because as a woman-doer you take on more than your fair share of work, and decided to take advantage of you emotionally for personal kicks. That's sick, so don't buy into any gaslighting by this person or any other band member that it's your fault.
The born type of problem personality is someone with a personality disorder who is lacking in normal emotion and quite comfortable being a jackass. It's like the person is missing something inside that the rest of us take for granted. You expect one sort of response (e.g. getting back to you with gig availability to avoid guilty feelings after sabotaging you) but they ignore you instead because they feel no guilt, with the goal being to undermine you while acting out resentment. This sort will keep cool and methodically destroy you if given the opportunity. Unblinking inappropriate eye contact is a hallmark of this sort, so trying to detect lies by watching for accelerated eye blinks doesn't work with this one. This sort also studiously feigns normal behavior once clued in that they lack normal emotions (usually in late adolescence when puberty means they have to get along with others to get laid). Part of feigning is deliberately blinking more and breaking eye contact to avoid creeping people out with the sociopathic stare, and then there's the insincere apology after a cold temper tantrum. Being around people like this is awkward because it's like they aren't living life as much as they are play-acting it. If this sort becomes enraged, murder is definitely on the table because this sort feels no remorse about anything and has no bounds, especially when feeling an unusual amount of emotional arousal that is otherwise alien to them.
In contrast, the made type of problem personality has a severe mood disorder and is essentially suffering from PTSD from severe early life trauma or deprivation, and coping with it poorly by withdrawing in fear alternating with launching on massive bipolar swings. Just about the only predictability in this type of personality is that they quickly resort to rage and violence if frustrated. This type will exhibit a short fuse and blow up regularly because their emotional response is drastically heightened by the chronic anxiety that was induced by their prior trauma. This type will find any excuse, any at all, to provoke a confrontation, because they are neurologically conditioned for conflict from that prior exposure to trauma. The person craves endogenous stimulation (adrenaline) like an addict, and needs interpersonal conflict in order to initiate that 'fix' and dump their adrenals into the bloodstream. This type will exhibit dramatically improved behavior immediately after blowing up because they got their 'fix', unless the conflict resulted in more frustration when their anger wasn't victorious, and then this type will escalate to temper tantrums and even violence in a quest to substitute a prolonged adrenaline binge for satisfaction of the whim that originated the adrenaline binge in the first place. Their lies can be transparently obvious and grandiose, or subtle and couched, depending on whether they have recently gone on a manic binge of adrenaline or not. The aftermath of a prolonged violent adrenaline binge is likely to be withdrawal and depression once the high wears off, but seldom remorse.
Since both types are lacking in appropriate boundaries, they lie routinely as a violation of the personal bounds of others in order to assert control. The only way to detect their lies reliably is to observe behaviors in a context of verifiable facts that are independent of the liar, most especially when the liar isn't feeling any remorse inside and has learned to feign normal behavior, or when the liar is feeling calm and centered in the eye of the storm and can focus on the lies. People who claim to be born lie detectors perform poorly in clinical studies of their ability to detect lies. There's no such thing as a lie detector. Lying is a survival trait that all people learn to master eventually to some degree or other. Even machinery can be fooled by a good liar and it doesn't take any special training to learn how to fool a machine, all it takes is a willingness to lie without remorse and keep cool under pressure plus some simple tricks to tweak the autonomous response. Always verify lies with independent sources that are objectively verifiable.
Neither type of problem personality is amenable to psychiatric treatment. They aren't in control of themselves and are largely incapable of asserting that control over themselves, nor are they likely to desire control over themselves when controlling others is so much more rewarding. Taking control away from them is the best way to break their hold because that takes away what they are seeking. However, it can be dangerous for others because they will seek to assert that control elsewhere. They can't help it. So by disengaging you run the risk that they will replace you. Nationalist 'replacement theory' is a political embodiment of the projection of this fear of replacement upon others who are falsely attributed with a desire to replace the currently 'indigenous' majority.
Drug treatments are more a matter of numbing than stabilizing, and these personalities usually won't willingly comply with a treatment regimen. The 'born' sort of problem personality isn't exhibiting classical bipolar behavior and drugs that seek to stabilize emotion won't do much to stop the abusive behavior because it's not based in emotion. The 'made' sort of problem personality disorder may respond to bipolar treatment, but it's not going to heal anything inside. Basically, treatment seeks to drug them both into submission to the control of others so that they aren't as disruptive, and that's what psychiatrists will work toward as a first level of remission, possibly the only level since that's just about all they can observe in a limited clinical setting IMO.
Cannabis could help the healing of PTSD in huge frequent edible doses over a prolonged period (it helped me), but that is predicated on the person also withdrawing from cannabis eventually (like I did) and re-learning behavior without the anxiety response attached. It also is predicated on the person not exhibiting comorbid personality disorders along with the PSTD anxiety mood disorder. Since we are all a little crazy in our own unique way, it's always challenging to heal a psychiatric disorder. Our unique foibles combine into a toxic inner soup.
The thing is, even if someone has the desire and capacity to heal a mood disorder, if there are significant comorbid personality disorders that are innate, such as the narcissism and/or Machiavellianism, healing is a lot harder and a lot less likely to occur. Also, health issues such as aging-related chronic degeneration, acute illness, chronic pain, substance abuse etc. all disrupt the laborious coping mechanisms the person relies on to compensate for their emotional inadequacy, while further destabilizing the emotional keel with extra stress. It's tough healing a mood disorder when there are comorbid destabilizing factors plus personality disorders all wrapped up in a bundle.
Both types of problem personality are probably going to exhibit some of the Dark Triad or Dark Tetrad, with narcissism and Machiavellianism being primary components. They will lack the ability to empathize, they will anger quickly when they don't get their way (although they will express that anger differently), and they will seek control. In the case of the 'born' sort of problem personality disorder, their anger is an outwardly cold expression of intimidation and control more than it is an expression of true emotion, whereas the 'made' sort of problem personality will turn purple with naked rage that overwhelms both the controller and the target.
In the case of the 'made' type or problem personality disorder, they will also express grandiosity, in absolute terms, with words like 'always' and 'never' prominently featured, whereas the 'born' type expresses a relatively flat affectation and may resort to confabulation instead. However, in both types, the key to the narcissism is their single-minded pursuit of their own agenda, and their willingness to do anything, anything at all, to pursue it. These people lack healthy boundaries and see everyone around them as extensions of themselves to be manipulated and controlled like limbs. They can't control themselves because they are emotionally dysregulated, so they focus on controlling others instead of controlling themselves.
Either type can destroy you if you get too involved. Plus, these types exist on a continuous spectrum, as do all things. They aren't mutually exclusive and they aren't absolute. It is all a matter of degree.
Passive aggression is the first line of attack of a problem personality. By withholding information and actively undermining an authority, the problem personality displaces the target and becomes a bigger fish in a smaller pond.
It sounds to me that you have a lot of sunk investment in this person because the band centers around the talent this person brings to your shows. It sounds like this is a 'you or them' situation. Taking a step back and letting others manage the situation is a healthy step, but the end result of letting a problem person control the band is that it becomes a problem band.
Usually I advise giving the problem person control of things that don't matter and cutting them out of things that can trainwreck you. I also advise not encouraging them by playing their games on their terms. By letting others in the band take on the responsibilities that you once handled, you are giving in and playing on their terms. Conversely, by insisting on all interaction between the two of you be routed through third parties, you can turn the tables on them, with the exception being that you aren't withholding information as much as you are directing it around the problem person and letting them be the last in line to be informed.
Taking control away from this person regarding things that can trainwreck your band is basically impossible in a small group situation, so that means giving in on areas that won't cut your soul to ribbons. If this person wants to cut you out of the decision-making process, I don't see a problem with generally ramping down your investment in the band to protect yourself, without disclosing your intention to the band, because acknowledging that you are taking a step back for your own mental health will be seen as/communicated as weakness by the passive-aggressive person rather than as the strong move it actually is. Just do, don't talk. This person won't respond to talk anyway. My most vociferous advice is not to argue with an insane person but instead just do what is necessary to mitigate their dysfunctional behavior.
This person probably thinks that replacing the bass player is easy and that they can get along without you. If that's how this person feels about you, then you are playing at a disadvantage. Problem personalities don't change in response to external pressure. They are already forged in fire and have already demonstrated a total disregard for the problems they propagate around them. You won't ever convince this person that you are essential if they have already dismissed you.
It may be true that bass players are a dime a dozen, but bass players that will put as much effort into the business as you have, even going so far as to accommodate a problem personality on their terms, are extremely rare. Most people with four bands at once would have already found a fifth and told this problem band to find another bass player.
The other option you have is to wait this person out. If this person applies this behavior consistently, it won't be long until they commit some act so irredeemable that their influence in the band wanes, either because of something they did in the band, or something they did in their personal life that detracts from the energy they can put into controlling the band. If the three of you are already tight, the other two may have already come to this conclusion without saying it in so many words. They might just be waiting for the opportune time to find a replacement but afraid of letting on because they still depend on this person to draw a crowd and don't want loose lips to sink the ship before they've found a new crew mate.
That's how I'm calling it. Obviously, I can't see everything through a monitor and we do in fact have only one side of the story. From where I'm sitting, it looks a lot like what I've experienced in my life. Good luck navigating. The one additional piece of advice I'd give you besides not arguing with this person is that if you have the time and the money/insurance, consulting with a psychologist or two so you can develop coping strategies is probably a worthwhile investment. Problem personalities abound. I'm estimating that a quarter of humanity is emotionally dysfunctional. You can't avoid them so you might as well learn how to live with them. YMMV and not every physician is created equal, in fact you could hire a problem personality with a degree and a license who gaslights you instead of educating you, so be careful and shop around if you go that route.
All the best, in honesty and commiseration, be well. My sincerest condolences and I hope it gets better soon. If I've overstepped/overshared/misinterpreted/misinformed, well that's my problem, not yours. Like I said, we are all a little crazy in our own way, and that's mine.
Let's start with Wikipedia because it's important to get the full context:
"Passive-aggressive behavior is characterized by a pattern of passive hostility and an avoidance of direct communication.[1][2] Inaction where some action is socially customary is a typical passive-aggressive strategy (showing up late for functions, staying silent when a response is expected).[2] Such behavior is sometimes protested by associates, evoking exasperation or confusion. People who are recipients of passive-aggressive behavior may experience anxiety due to the discordance between what they perceive and what the perpetrator is saying.[3]
...
Psychology
Further information: Passive–aggressive personality disorder
In psychology, "passive-aggression" is one of the most misused of psychological terms[citation needed]. After some debate, the American Psychiatric Association dropped it from the list of personality disorders in the DSM IV as too narrow to be a full-blown diagnosis and not well enough supported by scientific evidence to meet increasingly rigorous standards of definition[citation needed]. Culturally, the ambiguous "passive-aggressive" label is misused by lay persons and professionals alike[citation needed]. The removal of the passive-aggressive personality definition from the official diagnostic manual was in large measure because of the frequent misapplication and because of the often contradictory and unclear descriptions clinicians in the field provided[citation needed]. Most of the definitions which follow (which had previously been classified as passive-aggressive) are often more correctly described as overt aggression, or covert aggression (which is the correct definition to describe subtle, deliberate, calculating and underhanded tactics that manipulators and other disturbed characters use to intimidate, control, deceive and abuse others).
The outdated definition rejected by the American Psychiatric Association is as follows: Passive-aggressive behavior is characterized by a habitual pattern of non-active resistance to expected work requirements, opposition, sullenness, stubbornness, and negative attitudes in response to requirements for normal performance levels expected by others. Most frequently it occurs in the workplace, where resistance is exhibited by indirect behaviors such as procrastination, forgetfulness, and purposeful inefficiency, especially in reaction to demands by authority figures, but it can also occur in interpersonal contexts.[4]
Another source characterizes passive-aggressive behavior as: A personality trait marked by a pervasive pattern of negative attitudes and characterized by passive, sometimes obstructionist resistance to complying with expectations in interpersonal or occupational situations. Behaviors such as learned helplessness, procrastination, stubbornness, resentment, sullenness, or deliberate/repeated failure to accomplish requested tasks for which one is often explicitly responsible.[5] Other examples of passive-aggressive behavior may include avoiding direct or clear communication, evading problems, fear of intimacy or competition, making excuses, blaming others, obstructionism, playing the victim, feigning compliance with requests, sarcasm, backhanded compliments, and hiding anger.[6][7]
Conflict theory
In conflict theory, passive-aggressive behavior can resemble a behavior better described as catty, as it consists of deliberate, active, but carefully veiled hostile acts which are distinctively different in character from the non-assertive style of passive resistance.[8]"
Note that since passive aggressiveness is no longer categorized as a psychological disorder, it follows that passive aggressiveness is a symptom of other psychological disorders, since it is a dysfunctional behavior. Also note that the focus shifted from the passiveness to the aggression.
Does your bandmate have a substance abuse problem, a personality disorder, or a mood disorder? If so, you might want to consider distancing yourself from this person and possibly also distancing yourself from the band.
It sounds from the couple of pages that I read that you have a lot of history and sunk cost with these people. Consider the possibility that one or both of the other two members may be enabling the third. That's a sick situation all around and could be damaging to you emotionally, personally, or professionally.
By allowing this person to successfully maneuver you out of the responsibilities that you used to own, you have also enabled this person and weakened your position within the band. The claim that you are 'pushy' when all you did was ask for confirmation of availability for a gig indicates that this person may be undermining you behind your back. I'd expect a significant degree of lying, focused on character assassination, especially if you are already taking note of the gaslighting. Is this person a prima donna? Is there narcisssism involved?
This thread mushroomed quickly and I can't possibly devote the time to reading all of it, but I'll take a stab at it from the little that I did read. I won't be able to respond interactively because I have issues of my own, so I'm giving a data dump based on what I've learned about human behavior as a layman enduring it in spades.
There's a difference between a mood disorder and a personality disorder. A mood disorder is an endocrine thing. A personality disorder is a neurological thing. They can resemble each other but have differing flavors.
I have found that personality disorders and mood disorders rarely come in singles. If a person is malfunctioning in one area, they are usually malfunctioning in multiple areas. I'm not detecting any personality disorders in you, based on your reporting (I'm not a psychologist so take my feedback for what it's worth). You seem to be actively working things out and that's not what problem people do. I'd ignore the claims that your reporting is one-sided and not second-guess yourself. It is one-sided but it is also apparently objective IMO and again if there has already been some gaslighting going on that's not a subtlety, that's a huge red flag that you are dealing with a narcissist.
We are all a little crazy in our own unique way. Mental health practitioners don't diagnose based so much on disorders as much as they diagnose based on how much the person's behavior is interfering with their function. That's an explicit criterion on every diagnosis: the dysfunction. Since passive aggression isn't an indication of a dysfunction in its own right, we can only presume that the dysfunction is something more serious. Your band mate appears to be disrupting your band and I'd call that a problem. If you are perceiving it as passive-aggressive (it certainly sounds like it) I'd venture a guess that it's also a symptom of a diagnosable disorder that is causing significant dysfunction in this person's life overall and not limited to the band context. Let's run with that assumption because otherwise I don't have much to add over what's already been discussed, and keep in mind I could be completely off base in this assessment, so feel free to incorporate or ignore any part of it as you deem appropriate.
Wisdom on the street is that there are two archetypes of emotionally dysfunctional people bookending the spectrum. One is for the most part born, and the other is for the most part made by undue life stress. Both tend to be liars, because people with problem personalities compensate for their deficiencies by lying to assert control over the situation. Don't be at all surprised if this person is running around bad-mouthing you to your bandmates with made-up stories while telling you to your face that they have nothing but good things to say about you, or at a minimum strongly biasing their reporting on you by omitting essential facts and incidents while talking about you outside of your presence.
I am perceiving that this person has singled you out as vulnerable, possibly because of your gender, possibly because as a woman-doer you take on more than your fair share of work, and decided to take advantage of you emotionally for personal kicks. That's sick, so don't buy into any gaslighting by this person or any other band member that it's your fault.
The born type of problem personality is someone with a personality disorder who is lacking in normal emotion and quite comfortable being a jackass. It's like the person is missing something inside that the rest of us take for granted. You expect one sort of response (e.g. getting back to you with gig availability to avoid guilty feelings after sabotaging you) but they ignore you instead because they feel no guilt, with the goal being to undermine you while acting out resentment. This sort will keep cool and methodically destroy you if given the opportunity. Unblinking inappropriate eye contact is a hallmark of this sort, so trying to detect lies by watching for accelerated eye blinks doesn't work with this one. This sort also studiously feigns normal behavior once clued in that they lack normal emotions (usually in late adolescence when puberty means they have to get along with others to get laid). Part of feigning is deliberately blinking more and breaking eye contact to avoid creeping people out with the sociopathic stare, and then there's the insincere apology after a cold temper tantrum. Being around people like this is awkward because it's like they aren't living life as much as they are play-acting it. If this sort becomes enraged, murder is definitely on the table because this sort feels no remorse about anything and has no bounds, especially when feeling an unusual amount of emotional arousal that is otherwise alien to them.
In contrast, the made type of problem personality has a severe mood disorder and is essentially suffering from PTSD from severe early life trauma or deprivation, and coping with it poorly by withdrawing in fear alternating with launching on massive bipolar swings. Just about the only predictability in this type of personality is that they quickly resort to rage and violence if frustrated. This type will exhibit a short fuse and blow up regularly because their emotional response is drastically heightened by the chronic anxiety that was induced by their prior trauma. This type will find any excuse, any at all, to provoke a confrontation, because they are neurologically conditioned for conflict from that prior exposure to trauma. The person craves endogenous stimulation (adrenaline) like an addict, and needs interpersonal conflict in order to initiate that 'fix' and dump their adrenals into the bloodstream. This type will exhibit dramatically improved behavior immediately after blowing up because they got their 'fix', unless the conflict resulted in more frustration when their anger wasn't victorious, and then this type will escalate to temper tantrums and even violence in a quest to substitute a prolonged adrenaline binge for satisfaction of the whim that originated the adrenaline binge in the first place. Their lies can be transparently obvious and grandiose, or subtle and couched, depending on whether they have recently gone on a manic binge of adrenaline or not. The aftermath of a prolonged violent adrenaline binge is likely to be withdrawal and depression once the high wears off, but seldom remorse.
Since both types are lacking in appropriate boundaries, they lie routinely as a violation of the personal bounds of others in order to assert control. The only way to detect their lies reliably is to observe behaviors in a context of verifiable facts that are independent of the liar, most especially when the liar isn't feeling any remorse inside and has learned to feign normal behavior, or when the liar is feeling calm and centered in the eye of the storm and can focus on the lies. People who claim to be born lie detectors perform poorly in clinical studies of their ability to detect lies. There's no such thing as a lie detector. Lying is a survival trait that all people learn to master eventually to some degree or other. Even machinery can be fooled by a good liar and it doesn't take any special training to learn how to fool a machine, all it takes is a willingness to lie without remorse and keep cool under pressure plus some simple tricks to tweak the autonomous response. Always verify lies with independent sources that are objectively verifiable.
Neither type of problem personality is amenable to psychiatric treatment. They aren't in control of themselves and are largely incapable of asserting that control over themselves, nor are they likely to desire control over themselves when controlling others is so much more rewarding. Taking control away from them is the best way to break their hold because that takes away what they are seeking. However, it can be dangerous for others because they will seek to assert that control elsewhere. They can't help it. So by disengaging you run the risk that they will replace you. Nationalist 'replacement theory' is a political embodiment of the projection of this fear of replacement upon others who are falsely attributed with a desire to replace the currently 'indigenous' majority.
Drug treatments are more a matter of numbing than stabilizing, and these personalities usually won't willingly comply with a treatment regimen. The 'born' sort of problem personality isn't exhibiting classical bipolar behavior and drugs that seek to stabilize emotion won't do much to stop the abusive behavior because it's not based in emotion. The 'made' sort of problem personality disorder may respond to bipolar treatment, but it's not going to heal anything inside. Basically, treatment seeks to drug them both into submission to the control of others so that they aren't as disruptive, and that's what psychiatrists will work toward as a first level of remission, possibly the only level since that's just about all they can observe in a limited clinical setting IMO.
Cannabis could help the healing of PTSD in huge frequent edible doses over a prolonged period (it helped me), but that is predicated on the person also withdrawing from cannabis eventually (like I did) and re-learning behavior without the anxiety response attached. It also is predicated on the person not exhibiting comorbid personality disorders along with the PSTD anxiety mood disorder. Since we are all a little crazy in our own unique way, it's always challenging to heal a psychiatric disorder. Our unique foibles combine into a toxic inner soup.
The thing is, even if someone has the desire and capacity to heal a mood disorder, if there are significant comorbid personality disorders that are innate, such as the narcissism and/or Machiavellianism, healing is a lot harder and a lot less likely to occur. Also, health issues such as aging-related chronic degeneration, acute illness, chronic pain, substance abuse etc. all disrupt the laborious coping mechanisms the person relies on to compensate for their emotional inadequacy, while further destabilizing the emotional keel with extra stress. It's tough healing a mood disorder when there are comorbid destabilizing factors plus personality disorders all wrapped up in a bundle.
Both types of problem personality are probably going to exhibit some of the Dark Triad or Dark Tetrad, with narcissism and Machiavellianism being primary components. They will lack the ability to empathize, they will anger quickly when they don't get their way (although they will express that anger differently), and they will seek control. In the case of the 'born' sort of problem personality disorder, their anger is an outwardly cold expression of intimidation and control more than it is an expression of true emotion, whereas the 'made' sort of problem personality will turn purple with naked rage that overwhelms both the controller and the target.
In the case of the 'made' type or problem personality disorder, they will also express grandiosity, in absolute terms, with words like 'always' and 'never' prominently featured, whereas the 'born' type expresses a relatively flat affectation and may resort to confabulation instead. However, in both types, the key to the narcissism is their single-minded pursuit of their own agenda, and their willingness to do anything, anything at all, to pursue it. These people lack healthy boundaries and see everyone around them as extensions of themselves to be manipulated and controlled like limbs. They can't control themselves because they are emotionally dysregulated, so they focus on controlling others instead of controlling themselves.
Either type can destroy you if you get too involved. Plus, these types exist on a continuous spectrum, as do all things. They aren't mutually exclusive and they aren't absolute. It is all a matter of degree.
Passive aggression is the first line of attack of a problem personality. By withholding information and actively undermining an authority, the problem personality displaces the target and becomes a bigger fish in a smaller pond.
It sounds to me that you have a lot of sunk investment in this person because the band centers around the talent this person brings to your shows. It sounds like this is a 'you or them' situation. Taking a step back and letting others manage the situation is a healthy step, but the end result of letting a problem person control the band is that it becomes a problem band.
Usually I advise giving the problem person control of things that don't matter and cutting them out of things that can trainwreck you. I also advise not encouraging them by playing their games on their terms. By letting others in the band take on the responsibilities that you once handled, you are giving in and playing on their terms. Conversely, by insisting on all interaction between the two of you be routed through third parties, you can turn the tables on them, with the exception being that you aren't withholding information as much as you are directing it around the problem person and letting them be the last in line to be informed.
Taking control away from this person regarding things that can trainwreck your band is basically impossible in a small group situation, so that means giving in on areas that won't cut your soul to ribbons. If this person wants to cut you out of the decision-making process, I don't see a problem with generally ramping down your investment in the band to protect yourself, without disclosing your intention to the band, because acknowledging that you are taking a step back for your own mental health will be seen as/communicated as weakness by the passive-aggressive person rather than as the strong move it actually is. Just do, don't talk. This person won't respond to talk anyway. My most vociferous advice is not to argue with an insane person but instead just do what is necessary to mitigate their dysfunctional behavior.
This person probably thinks that replacing the bass player is easy and that they can get along without you. If that's how this person feels about you, then you are playing at a disadvantage. Problem personalities don't change in response to external pressure. They are already forged in fire and have already demonstrated a total disregard for the problems they propagate around them. You won't ever convince this person that you are essential if they have already dismissed you.
It may be true that bass players are a dime a dozen, but bass players that will put as much effort into the business as you have, even going so far as to accommodate a problem personality on their terms, are extremely rare. Most people with four bands at once would have already found a fifth and told this problem band to find another bass player.
The other option you have is to wait this person out. If this person applies this behavior consistently, it won't be long until they commit some act so irredeemable that their influence in the band wanes, either because of something they did in the band, or something they did in their personal life that detracts from the energy they can put into controlling the band. If the three of you are already tight, the other two may have already come to this conclusion without saying it in so many words. They might just be waiting for the opportune time to find a replacement but afraid of letting on because they still depend on this person to draw a crowd and don't want loose lips to sink the ship before they've found a new crew mate.
That's how I'm calling it. Obviously, I can't see everything through a monitor and we do in fact have only one side of the story. From where I'm sitting, it looks a lot like what I've experienced in my life. Good luck navigating. The one additional piece of advice I'd give you besides not arguing with this person is that if you have the time and the money/insurance, consulting with a psychologist or two so you can develop coping strategies is probably a worthwhile investment. Problem personalities abound. I'm estimating that a quarter of humanity is emotionally dysfunctional. You can't avoid them so you might as well learn how to live with them. YMMV and not every physician is created equal, in fact you could hire a problem personality with a degree and a license who gaslights you instead of educating you, so be careful and shop around if you go that route.
All the best, in honesty and commiseration, be well. My sincerest condolences and I hope it gets better soon. If I've overstepped/overshared/misinterpreted/misinformed, well that's my problem, not yours. Like I said, we are all a little crazy in our own way, and that's mine.
- Status
