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Please share your tips on how to record professional / studio quality bass

Lots of advice here to make one's head spin. I agree, you've got good gear for turning a good analog signal into ones and zeros. Much like one's bedroom bass tone likely makes a horrible on-stage bass tone, the same for recording applies. An amazing bass tone solo'd or recorded may not make for a good bass tone in a mix. So what an engineer attempts to do is record a signal that allows for further options moving forward. Yes, music genre can determine what one might print on the way in. A great analog compressor if in the metal song you're gonna be squashing the bass even more. At the same time, engineering and playing are two different hats. That playing hat is where your greatest quality can be achieved. Have fun.
 
Absolutely true... And all the studios are closing. When I see pros recording on Youtube, It looks like they are in some empty room in the house with some baffling added. I guess everybody is a do-it yourselfer these days.

My last real studio call was at Muscle Shoals in 2016? and it sucked. Lets just say if Billy Eilish had a no-talent brother.

I think the last time I did any 'real' work in a 'real' studio was back in the analogue days, probably around 1994. The desk was the size of a canoe, you could've poached eggs on the tops of the racks or towed a tank with the 2" tape. Things are indeed very different these days - I have more capacity and 'virtual outboard' capability than would have physically fitted into probably 100 times the space available in that studio, at probably a millionth of the $/minute rate. But there is no substitute for the adrenaline rush when the tape spins up and the red light comes on... You don't get that at home!!
 
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I run direct into the DAW or board, use flatwound strings and a pick, and never had a bad sound. Adjusting the tone knob gets me some variation, but the most important thing to me is to have the bass sound like a PUNCHY, WELL DEFINED bass, where you can hear every note and not just feel it in there.. And also not get too much of a twangy overtone mess.
When mixing, I copy the bass track and pan the two tracks hard right and hard left. This seems to work perfect for me- but everyone has their method. :)
 
aside from others have said, when using rounds, new strings for sure!
A fine engineer once told me, "You can take out the zing during mixing, but you can't add it!"

So, my advice, new strings, record with the zing and EQ it out later if you want.

But yeah, DI flat into the box, no EQ, then listen through a decent pair of headphones or monitor system. If you are mixing into a track, mix with all tracks active, because when you solo the track it may sound fine, but when added with other stuff, it might not be a good sound.

And yes, if you are mic'ing the cabinet, phase alignment can be an issue. flip the phase switch if you have one, or just the slightest delay on the DI. To check phase, put both faders up for DI/mic and listen in mono. if the bottom drops out, or volume drops, you have phase issue.
 
Yes, fair point - but can you describe the goal / what you are looking to achieve from the compression?

After controlling wild transients, I'd say the main place to start is here:

The low frequencies contain a lot of the energy of a tune. You want to keep this stable. Big changes in dynamics are one thing, but generally you want that energy to change only deliberately and with purpose. Compression helps even out the bass line and provide "stability" to the low end. Threshold*, Ratio, and Release Time will factor most in this arena, IMO.

*1176-style compressors will have an Input control instead of Threshold. Whether you use hardware or plugins, it's a good idea to familiarize yourself with the original device and learn why those circuits became mainstays.
 
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* direct out from your favorite preamp
* All DI boxes above a certain quality level sound identical: the line in on your focusrite is fine if there's no ground hum
* EQ to taste
* In parallel with a speaker model if you absolutely must
* The best tube compressor in the building, or a good model.
 
So there are lots of ways to record an electric bass and how you approach this really depends on what type of sound you are looking for. A Motown-inspired bass sound is way different than a Smooth Jazz Hi-Fi bass sound or grinding metal sound. Once you have an idea of what you are going for, then you can determine the best way to get there.
The obvious;
You need to be able to play. The better sound you create with your hands, the easier everything following will be.
You need a good audio interface and know how to use that piece of gear. The better quality D2A your interface can translate, the better the recording. Know your DAW. Gain structure is super important and the rules for digital audio pose challenges that are different than analog recording. The more you know about the creative part of recording, the better able you will be to achieve what you hear in your head. Pallell processing, side-chaining are a couple techniques that exemplify more advanced ways of processing your sound. Another thing related to these techniques is understanding things like compression. Not only what it is but what types of compression are available, what are the characteristics of those varying processors and their settings impact the recording sonically.... just to say "use plugins' is not nearly adequate because they choice of which and how the are applied are so powerful. Mixing direct recording wiht a mic'ed amp? Better know something about phase relationships. If you don't have experience with and intimately have some hands on time and knowledge, you will have a tough time getting anything resembling what you hear in your head.
Direct recording, Mic'ed amp, Modeled Amp, or combination makes the this true; "there is no easy answer to this very complex question." For sure, you are crossing over from bassist to engineer/producer when you begin to go down this rabbit hole. The subject is rediculously deep and complex but personally, I love this aspect of music creation, but it's not for everyone.
 
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Let's see...
Recording professional/studio quality bass. (Easy.)
  1. Make sure instrument is set up, functioning properly, and in tune!
  2. Plug in, Play well, and try to keep the buzzing and slop to a minimum (unless required for track, of course.)
  3. Get a clean signal however your can.
  4. Active/Passive DI box is fine.
  5. Plugging in direct to the interface is fine.
  6. Even a pre-amp is fine... sometimes better even, if the color is good and the noise is minimal. (Unless required, of course.)
  7. Only mic an amp if you have another clean, direct feed on a separate channel/track already. (You can always "reamp" the clean track in post.)
Mixing professional/studio quality bass. (Hard.)
  1. Beyond the scope of the internet.
  2. Shortcut! Give your stuff to someone else to mix.
Happy slapping!
slap.gif
 
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Dip 400hz on the main drum bus, boost 400hz on the bass track. You'll hate it soloed, but it works very well to carve out sonic space bass vs. drums.
I typically do the same but with around 200 Hz. I think 400-600 is a pretty carboardy sounding range so I cut it on bass

YMMV, this is just my opinion, etc

Clean isn't necessarily non-overdriven. Harmonic exaggeration from an overdriving preamp can sometime make the mix just that much better sounding, it'll soften the upper register of the bass somewhat as well, which will help with mixing.

I like lots of top end in my bass sound, but you need to be careful with EQ when chasing that sound. EQ the guitars to be more trebly than you normally would, make them sit forward and high up in the mix, sometimes as high as the cymbals.

 
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Hi TalkBass Community.

I'm new to this forum and desperately trying to stay away from all the gear threads (but failing) preferring to focus on discussions that are going to help improve my playing and help me learn how to record professional / studio quality bass.

Although not a complete novice to home recording I don't feel I've really mastered it as a skill and I'm looking for any advice / guidance / tips that the TalkBass community can offer me.

I use Cubase as my DAW and have a pretty good understanding of how it works. I also have some of the required equipment at my disposal:

- DI options: Radial Pro 48 DI box or DI out of my GR Bass head.
- Audio Interface: SSL 2 channel AI
- DAW plugins (IR cab sims, Cubase's standard suit of tools (reverb, compression, eq etc.)

I'm willing to invest in other plugin's if needed and potentially a decent microphone for the cab.

Please do share your wisdom with me; any links to articles or YouTube tutorials also very welcome.

Thanks
My two cents:
Be able to absolutely play in time perfectly with the click or drum track.

Play with full control of your dynamics when tracking. Use compression sparingly, or not at all. Save it for later.

Get a nice tube DI. This can be a bit of an investment. (Like the Sonic Farm 2DI4...it sounds incredible.)

Mixing and mastering are arts within themselves that I really don't know much about...so, no help there.
 
I have a set of Yamaha studio monitors, and a pair of DT 770 PRO headphones. Room's not treated but I don't think it's a gear issue, it's a knowing what you are doing issue.

Perhaps it’s a skill thing, but so is knowing what your hardware limitations are. The DT770 are not something I’d consider critical mixing/mastering headphones. They’ve got some wonky frequency response curves that may impact them listening on other devices. And not just specific to bass, but your entire mix.

I’ve got average monitors, a less than ideal room and minimum treatment. Every time I listen to a reference track, I hate how it sounds. Then I put on my headphones and it sounds like I think it should. I’m using Sennheiser HD600s, upgraded from A-T ATH-M50x for mixing and mastering purposes.

I listen to my older mixes and compare to my newer mixes - night and day. Even through the studio monitors in my room (both of which are less than ideal).

Before investing in all kinds of plug-ins, boutique DIs, hardware pres, etc, upgrade your headphones.
 
I haven't read any other posts in this thread at this point. IMO having decent equipment is never a bad thing, but it's not the "size" of your DI that matters, it's how you use it ;). Which is to say that there are more/other important, and perhaps intangible, aspects to getting a good professional sounding track, IMO and IME, regardless of what equipment you’re using. I’ve recorded songs in big professional studios that never saw the light of day, and I’ve recorded stuff from my basement office that’s been played on the radio.

Here's a few quick thoughts I have for you:
  1. Make sure the drum take is good before you start. Do any major drum editing/fixing before you start on the bass.
  2. If it's a primarily guitar driven song (or any other instrument for that matter), you may even want guitar tracks done first, depending on how the bass is working with the guitar.
  3. For a vocal-led song, best to lock in tight with the drums and keep your playing more on the simple side, especially if the vocals aren't done yet. If you don't know what the final vocal phrasing is going to be, best to stay out of the way as much as possible. If the vocal parts are written (or better yet if you have a scratch track), and you know where you have a bit of room to play, then you can add in some flourishes at appropriate parts in the song without trampling all over the vocals.
  4. I like to record maybe 2-3 passes (or 6-10 :p) through the song from start to finish, and then "comp" them, or selecting the best individual parts of each take, for the final track. After you've got your comp track, then you can focus on any last little punch-ins that need fixing.
    1. When editing comps and punch-ins, always try to place your crossfades at points of silence wherever possible. Don't be afraid to zoom in all the way when you're dragging your crossfade around. Re-record longer sections if you need to, if only to find a good moment of silence (even a split second) between beats to join your takes.
  5. Top priority for recording should be a strong clean signal into the board/interface. Your signal level should be hitting approx -12 to -6 dB on the meter.
  6. While getting a decent tone in the ballpark of what you want for the track on the way in is great, I would recommend any drastic EQing, distorting, amp sims, and/or compressing should be applied after the fact.
    1. Endlessly playing with plugins and twiddling knobs to get the tone "perfect" on the way in is a GREAT way to lose an entire evening of productivity. Get a solid basic, appropriate sound to start with, and then focus on getting the take done and edited to completion. "Finished" is almost always better than "perfect" at the tracking stage. "perfect" is achieved during mixing ;)
  7. Mixing should be done during mixing phase and in conjunction with all the other instruments on the track. Try not to make too many mix decisions on the way in, especially if the other instruments aren't there yet.
    1. It's easy to add distortion after the fact if it's appropriate. But if you come in hot from the start with a tonne of effects on the recording, it's almost impossible to clean that up after the fact if it's not jiving with the rest of the mix.
    2. Same with EQing. Boost a bit on the way in if you feel it's appropriate, but I try not to cut too much from anywhere on the way in. You can always boost and cut during mixing later, but if you cut too much on the way in it's impossible to boost back frequencies that aren't there.
  8. Your main priority during tracking should be that the signal is strong but not clipping, and free of extraneous noise. But most importantly that the playing is tight with the rest of the instrumentation. I don't care how great your tone is, if the playing is sloppy and/or out of time it's not going to sound good.
  9. TUNE OFTEN. Especially at the beginning of a session. Tune between every take if you have to. If you can't remember when the last time was that you tuned, then tune again.
  10. My recommendation is to learn how to work with DI for recording. Micing up a bass amp can be challenging (IME) and opens up a bunch of additional cans of worms with regards to capturing the signal. DI is a great way to get things started, and amp sims and plugins are pretty amazing these days.
that's just for tracking. Mixing is a whole 'nother story.

All of this is wonderful and helpful. The OP wanted specifics on settings to make better recordings, such as the exact compressor settings for bass.

The problem is that you have to use your ears more than your fingers while twiddling knobs or keyboard strokes. No standard set of settings will match every situation. So twiddle with your ears on high alert until you can hear differences. BUT to hear all that is there, you have to train your ears. And that takes time in focused effort. Much time!

I hade the good pleasure to have a pro recording engineer, Marty from Baltimore, help me doing voice overs. He worked me until I could hear what he was talking about. BTW - He trained the guys who did the original GIECO gecko commercials.

One thing I learned was the sonic difference between various cables - mic, guitar, headphone, console, etc. After a while I could hear the differences. I chose Neuman cables as my basic set. They were not cheap and I had to make them myself.

Maybe there is a quicker way. If you want to become a recording engineer take some courses at a local college near you.

If you want simple and fast, learn from Leland Sklar on YouTube. In one of his early posts he describes his equipment to make his postings. It is very simple - bass, amp, backing track to play with. His recordings are of his amp and his voice microphone into his video camera. I think he uses a SSL Interface into his computer DAW/video recorder or maybe it is just into his video recorder. He usually plays along to his own previous bass lines. You can do similar.

Get some backing tracks of the songs you want to showcase your abilities. Or get some minus the bass. Play along with them and record like he does. For full effect, do it like Leland - do it in both audio and video.

I think what Leland is doing is brilliant. He is showcasing that he still has it. He can duplicate any of his previous work with perfect playing and perfect tone. He is advertising himself to music directors and studios that he can still do it at top level. I am assuming that is what you want to do.

His process is to set up his equipment and record direct to his video system. Then he does whatever editing he needs in his video editor. If he needs to edit his sound, he may go to a DAW, but that sort of defeats the purpose of him showing he still has it on a first take basis. And yes, I have spotted some of his flubs (as my jaw was hanging open in awe), but he does not edit them out, else I never would have caught them.

There are numerous videos of people at home playing basslines to all kinds of songs. They are doing song-less-bass, or overlaying their bass on the original recordings to make their videos. Find some you like and copy them. Make your video recording very simple like Leland does. And I assume these youtubers are also looking for work as bassists, and these are their marketing videos.

If you want more control, get something like Band-In-A-Box and record with it, but it is only audio, not video.

For showcasing your ability on bass, I think Leland has it right. If you want to showcase your studio engineering, do that also, but that is not bass-player showcasing.

There are some threads here on Leland Sklar, so do a search and use them.

In summary, my tip is to do what the most recorded bass player in history is doing, keep it simple and play with exquisite technique, and do it in published videos. And if it helps, grow a beard :)
 
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Things I've learned so far trying to make sense of digital bass playing.

I'm not really trying to make records. I just want to play bass thru my iPad.

Leaving out the obvious regarding personal performance skills and properly set up instruments

#1 filter out the inaudible/cruft frequencies, low & high

#2 can be baffling, because it is counterintuitive to those raised on analog.
Gain staging. Levels, levels, levels.
I've had better luck keeping things around -20 inside the DAW.
All green lights. Check input & output levels of each track and each bus with meter.
Digital gank seems to creep in for me at around -15 to -10db and seems to be cumulative.

#3 Pick a few good tools and learn how to use them.
A quality interface is a must-have
Basic compressor, EQ, & limiter can do a lot, obviously.

I've been trying to stack multiple tracks with "normal" amp and IR based acoustic apps but it's still not completely there.

I think I'll be needing to solve the mystery of real-time phase alignment for it to be closer to what I'm imagining.
 
Perhaps it’s a skill thing, but so is knowing what your hardware limitations are. The DT770 are not something I’d consider critical mixing/mastering headphones. They’ve got some wonky frequency response curves that may impact them listening on other devices. And not just specific to bass, but your entire mix.

I’ve got average monitors, a less than ideal room and minimum treatment. Every time I listen to a reference track, I hate how it sounds. Then I put on my headphones and it sounds like I think it should. I’m using Sennheiser HD600s, upgraded from A-T ATH-M50x for mixing and mastering purposes.

I listen to my older mixes and compare to my newer mixes - night and day. Even through the studio monitors in my room (both of which are less than ideal).

Before investing in all kinds of plug-ins, boutique DIs, hardware pres, etc, upgrade your headphones.
I never do any mixing on headphones beyond just preliminary faders up to rough positions. I also have a pair of Yamaha studio monitors. I do my initial mixing on those, monitoring from several positions in the room. Then I check my mixes on an audiophile-level system in my living room, through earbuds on my laptop, and last but not least, in the car. Sometimes I have found things in the car that surprised me and weren't heard anywhere else. All of that monitoring is important and if I change things I repeat all that. When it sounds good everywhere, I am done.
 
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I never do any mixing on headphones beyond just preliminary faders up to rough positions. I also have a pair of Yamaha studio monitors. I do my initial mixing on those, monitoring from several positions in the room. Then I check my mixes on an audiophile-level system in my living room, through earbuds on my laptop, and last but not least, in the car. Sometimes I have found things in the car that surprised me and weren't heard anywhere else. All of that monitoring is important and if I change things I repeat all that. When it sounds good everywhere, I am done.

For sure- sometimes it takes a refining of the workflow like this to get optimal results from whatever hardware/room set up you’re working with.

I went through a period where I was less than pleased with the results I was getting. I got things sounding good in my room, but in the car, with earbuds and the phone, my results were a mess. I used my reference track to try to diagnose. Turns out I was mixing out the low end to compensate what I was hearing through my monitors. Same issue (but different results) using cheap headphones with weird baked in eq curves.

I went through the exercise of whet I needed to to fix the apparent problem. Compared to renovating my room, applying treatment and investing in higher quality studio monitors, I decided to try better headphones with flatter response. That seems to have done the trick. $600 vs $6000 to correct my issues. I still have room issues but I’m mixing/mastering almost everything with headphones. Not everyone does that but it is an accepted practice.

yes, there are things I could be better at skill wise, but at least I’m not wrestling with my hardware and my room each and every time.
 
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Foe sure- sometimes it takes a refining of the workflow like this to get optimal results from whatever hardware/room set up you’re working with.

I went through a period where I was less than pleased with the results I was getting. I got things sounding good in my room, but in the car, with earbuds and the phone, my results were a mess. I used my reference track to try to diagnose. Turns out I was mixing out the low end to compensate what I was hearing through my monitors. Same issue (but different results) using cheap headphones with weird baked in eq curves.

I went through the exercise of whet I needed to to fix the apparent problem. Compared to renovating my room, applying treatment and investing in higher quality studio monitors, I decided to try better headphones with flatter response. That seems to have done the trick. $600 vs $6000 to correct my issues. I still have room issues but I’m mixing/mastering almost everything with headphones. Not everyone does they, but it is an accepted practice.

yes, there are things I could be better at skill wise, but at least I’m not wrestling with my hardware and my room each and every time.
I might have to invest in high-quality headphones. Mine are OK for the way I use them, but having a bit more confidence in what's coming from them might be useful in just the way you describe.

I'm pretty picky as a general rule and I live with mixes for a long time, tweaking them here or there, before I finally sign off on them. Reference mixes can help. I find a lot of planning needs to go into getting things right from the very beginning, starting with making sure my levels aren't so hot that I run into problems getting the proper loudness at the mastering stage. This is a major shift from the old analog days where tape saturation was the desired norm.

I hear a lot of home mixes and one of the things that often jumps out at me is an over-emphasis on the high end to an almost ear-splitting level. I'm 62, with probably a bit less hearing loss than the average person my age, but if I'm hearing piercing highs from the guitar tracks at this stage in my game, something isn't right.

For the OP, I'd take a lot of the amateur advice here with a pinch of salt and track down some professional advice, but the most important thing you can do, as far as I'm concerned, is mix against a strong reference track for comparison sake.

Creating sonic spaces for the instrumentation and vocals is key, but a little goes a long way, and it's always a good idea to consider pulling frequencies down rather than boosting something else up when you have the choice. You don't have to turn the guitar tracks into a high end festival. Just get the mud out of the bottom and make sure the top sounds good and natural.

For bass specifically, I use a HPF to get rid of low transients and clean up rumble, do some audio/visual analyzing of the frequency curve to see if and where anything is overly present that shouldn't be, like string noise, notch that stuff down, and then add a little punch around 120 or so. Just DI or straight in and a bit of compression on the post end of things. See how that all sounds for a while. Tweak as necessary depending on the overall mix requirements. Bass doesn't have to get too fancy but it's hard to make it sound good.
 
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All of this is wonderful and helpful. The OP wanted specifics on settings to make better recordings, such as the exact compressor settings for bass.

The problem is that you have to use your ears more than your fingers while twiddling knobs or keyboard strokes. No standard set of settings will match every situation. So twiddle with your ears on high alert until you can hear differences. BUT to hear all that is there, you have to train your ears. And that takes time in focused effort. Much time!

I hade the good pleasure to have a pro recording engineer, Marty from Baltimore, help me doing voice overs. He worked me until I could hear what he was talking about. BTW - He trained the guys who did the original GIECO gecko commercials.

One thing I learned was the sonic difference between various cables - mic, guitar, headphone, console, etc. After a while I could hear the differences. I chose Neuman cables as my basic set. They were not cheap and I had to make them myself.

Maybe there is a quicker way. If you want to become a recording engineer take some courses at a local college near you.

If you want simple and fast, learn from Leland Sklar on YouTube. In one of his early posts he describes his equipment to make his postings. It is very simple - bass, amp, backing track to play with. His recordings are of his amp and his voice microphone into his video camera. I think he uses a SSL Interface into his computer DAW/video recorder or maybe it is just into his video recorder. He usually plays along to his own previous bass lines. You can do similar.

Get some backing tracks of the songs you want to showcase your abilities. Or get some minus the bass. Play along with them and record like he does. For full effect, do it like Leland - do it in both audio and video.

I think what Leland is doing is brilliant. He is showcasing that he still has it. He can duplicate any of his previous work with perfect playing and perfect tone. He is advertising himself to music directors and studios that he can still do it at top level. I am assuming that is what you want to do.

His process is to set up his equipment and record direct to his video system. Then he does whatever editing he needs in his video editor. If he needs to edit his sound, he may go to a DAW, but that sort of defeats the purpose of him showing he still has it on a first take basis. And yes, I have spotted some of his flubs (as my jaw was hanging open in awe), but he does not edit them out, else I never would have caught them.

There are numerous videos of people at home playing basslines to all kinds of songs. They are doing song-less-bass, or overlaying their bass on the original recordings to make their videos. Find some you like and copy them. Make your video recording very simple like Leland does. And I assume these youtubers are also looking for work as bassists, and these are their marketing videos.

If you want more control, get something like Band-In-A-Box and record with it, but it is only audio, not video.

For showcasing your ability on bass, I think Leland has it right. If you want to showcase your studio engineering, do that also, but that is not bass-player showcasing.

There are some threads here on Leland Sklar, so do a search and use them.

In summary, my tip is to do what the most recorded bass player in history is doing, keep it simple and play with exquisite technique, and do it in published videos. And if it helps, grow a beard :)

I’m just glad someone took the time to read my post. lol

+1 there’s no magic formula that works for every player on every song. Even if you want to limit the discussion to just compression there’s SO many different ways to approach it, depending on the song, and the arrangement, and the bass you’re using, the way you hit the stings, or if you want to use a pick, etc etc. Do you want the bass to be crushed under everything else, or bright and zingy and up front? Or somewhere in between?

You need to be able to envision what you want for the track before it’s there, and then make it happen. And that can be a difficult skill to learn.
 
Firstly, I just want to say thank you for everybody who's engaged with this thread. I hadn't expected to get 5 pages worth of responses!

I started this thread off with the statement of Professional / Studio quality recordings. A number of responses here have made me realise that isn't what I need to go after at this stage - I'm not producing records my goal is a set of decent sounding recordings for virtual audition pieces.

I spent the afternoon in my humble home studio setting and tried a few of the suggestions given to me and very much following the keep it simple principle.

- Backing track with the original bass largely EQ'd out
- Bass recorded direct via the Radial Pro DI into the SSL Interface (I know the DI box isn't needed it just a bit more convenient)
-- EQ on the bass flat, pickup blend central
-- No pedals or additional pre-amps in the signal chain
- After recording the following applied plugins applied to the bass track
-- Cubase Studio EQ - Pop Bass pre-set (slightly tweaked)
-- Cubase Compressor - A bass pre-set applied (can't remember which)
On the stereo output channel
-- Cubase Compressor - light mastering pre-set

Sounding pretty good as a starter.