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Sadowsky's amp!!!!!! ?????

#101
Larry Kaye said:
Tom B and to Roger Sadowsky....I'm in a respectful total disagreement, which I'm entitled to be, that I think the Sadowsky Preamp both on board his basses and as an outboard box are really off base frequency wise.

LKaye
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Man, it's a really good thing that so many people disagree with you. Seems like Roger's basses and preamps are the go to for most professional studio and live bass players today, next to a Fender.

It looks like this amp isn't for you. That's cool. Nuff said.
 
#102
Larry Kaye said:
Tom B and to Roger Sadowsky....I'm in a respectful total disagreement, which I'm entitled to be
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Oh, definitely! I hope I didn't come across as confrontational, Larry. You and I have corresponded a good bit in the past and I have nothing but respect for you and your opinion on things. Sure, we have some differences of opinion, but we share some common ones, too. I've got nuthin' but love for you, brother! :D

As for EQ's in a difficult room, though, I do think that individual control over 40 Hz and 80 Hz is useful to dial out a boomy room, but at the same time preserve your low end. If I have a truly horrid room that I can't deal with via on-board controls or my amp's controls, I could always use my Raven Labs True Blue EQ, but knowing the rooms that I play in, I think that 40 AND 80 Hz controls will be very helpful (if I do need to control/tweak the low end), and I actually find 800 Hz to be a near ideal midrange shaping frequency. I also commonly use @ 3K and @ 6K to control my attack and high end sheen (when I do EQ, that is). So, at least in my experience, and for my sonic preferences, I think that this EQ section looks promising. Of course, I won't know until I get out on a gig.

I totally respect that this amp does not appear to be one that will suit you well. I am also hopeful that it will work well for me. At any rate, I am excited to give it a listen!

Our opinions vary, but I trust the respect is mutual!

Later, Tom.
 
#103
Great for studio, fine, it's a proven fact that there are a group of successful professional studio bassists who use Sadowsky when recording. GOOD THING MOST BASSPLAYERS disagree with me? Most bass players have never heard of Sadowsky, Mike Lull, Lakland, Roscoe, and many of the other household name customized builders, at least not here in Greater Cleveland. They know vintage Fender, maybe heard of musicman and Ibanez and that's about it. Your statement that most professionals play or record with Roger's preamp or basses is totally untrue and innacurate.

I'm not putting down Roger's stuff. I would be much more tempted to buy his basses if there was more on board adjustibility, especially in the frequencies between his current 2 band eq's.. His construction, quality, customer service, assembling, finishing, are second to none IN MY LESS THAN Important opinion.

However these obvious assets don't help me on my gigs. I need flexibility over more of the hz spectrum and additional on board the bass adjustability for live performance. I am also a professional who's played out over 2000 gigs and who's opinion is the bible FOR ME. Look, I don't flame or criticize the small minority of those who have heard/bought Schroeder cabinets and don't like them in spite of my total commitment to them and what seems to be a strong acceptance and critical acclaim by the reviewing public. It's their opinion they're entitled to, just as I am here.

Don't infer that I'm some kinda amateur or schmuck because others don't agree. By the way, I know several players who fully concur with my opinion on Sadowsky products.....both in tone and build. Wonderful basses, not right for me at this time.

LK
 
#104
emjazz said:
Man, it's a really good thing that so many people disagree with you. Seems like Roger's basses and preamps are the go to for most professional studio and live bass players today, next to a Fender.

It looks like this amp isn't for you. That's cool. Nuff said.
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Larry, I'm gonna quote myself here so that you can reread what I had written. Not once did I say that most people would disagree with you. I did say that most professional studio AND live bass players are using Sadowsky as their go to bass. I guess a better wording would be that many of them use Sadowsky. Again, it just looks like the amp isn't going to benefit you, no problem. It doesn't look to me that I attacked you personally Larry. You seem to be pretty worked up for some reason. Oh, and I'm one of those people that agree about a Sadowsky being not my personal choice. Not my thing. That's perfectly alright. It doesn't change the fact that it is one of the most respected and used basses in the professional arena, recording and live. I'm referring to Los Angeles, Nashville and New York.
 
#106
Nino Valenti said:
HAHAHAHA. Lots of funny stuff on the last page or 2.
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Word. :D

But honestly, I commend Roger in what looks to be an awesome amp. While not perfect for everyone, if thats what youre looking for, it looks to be near perfect. But then again, is there a product out there, in ANYTHING that is perfect for every individual? We are different people with different tastes, and thats awesome, otherwise itd be pretty boring.

Nice looking amp Roger, great job, wish dropping $2000+ was no big thang for me. Maybe you can cut me a deal, how about $200? 3/4 of the numbers are the same. :D
 
#107
people who feel they have to assert THEIR opinion by saying that anothers OPINION is not right for them. Isn't it a given that if someone writes about something they are giving THEIR opinion? Why is stating that THEY think this or that is the best such an afront to so many people?

I see people remark that bass A is the best (to them) and they get people who feel they have to dog or disagree publicly. I am not talking about genuine discussions about gear but just bashing in one form or another. I have seen threads about ERB players and people who chime in about how ERB basses are unnecessary and pointless.

If you don't like a piece of gear or don't think it'll suit your needs then don't buy it. If a piece of gear seems too expensive then don't buy it. If a bass looks like a toilet seat to you ;) don't buy it. It is really that simple.

I am on my fourth Sadowsky bass in 4 months. Up until a few months ago I was steadily playing 100+ gigs a year. I too like have a parametric eq on board for room dialing. Hence my use of the Eden Navigator. However, I still rarely tweak too much.

I prefer Eden preamps BUT I will DEFINITELY check out Roger's new amp at NAMM in January because YOU JUST NEVER KNOW. I could love it or I could hate it.

I just don't understand going after someone because they like something that you don't or that may not work for you.

I have immense respect for Roger and others who strive to create what THEY hear and feel. It is an amazing thing to create something and see your vision come to fruition. Isn't that what we as artist and musicians do with the music we write, produce and perform? Not everyone is going to like your song. Not everyone is going to like the look of a Bongo. AND, not everyone is going to like Roger's amp.

I respect him for doing things the way HE thinks it ought to be and letting the buying public decide. He seems to have nailed it on the head in the past. For me, HE created the bass of a lifetime. But that is just me and the cost means nothing because it is what I NEED and have looked for. Others find it elsewhere.

Tom believes the EQ points are perfect. So what? I may disagree and others may too. I think we should all try and be as civil as possible. Our society has gotten increasingly more rude and presumptuous. I too have been giuilty of this. No more.

Let's try and ask questions and not impune peoples motives and integrity. Just a thought.

All the best to all. :D
 
#108
BigMikeW said:
...YOU JUST NEVER KNOW. I could love it or I could hate it.

...

I respect him for doing things the way HE thinks it ought to be and letting the buying public decide. He seems to have nailed it on the head in the past. For me, HE created the bass of a lifetime. But that is just me and the cost means nothing because it is what I NEED and have looked for. Others find it elsewhere.

...

I think we should all try and be as civil as possible. Our society has gotten increasingly more rude and presumptuous. I too have been giuilty of this. No more.

Let's try and ask questions and not impune peoples motives and integrity. Just a thought.

All the best to all. :D
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+1
 
#109
HI

Once again, lots of crap here. I spent about an hour with this amp yesterday in NY. It kills. Very musical, great preamp, light, great looking. Has a dynamic to it you only get from tubes. I really like it. Its not for everyone. Roger himself understands this. Lots of us will find it to be too much $ and thats ok. You dont have to buy it. Its out there for those of us who want a high end, boutique tube amp. Nothing is being forced down anyones throat here. LOL.

Rob
 
#111
HI

That being said, Larry I totally disagree with u. I play all sorts of different gigs and many types of different types of music. The Sadowsky basses always sound great and take very little time to sound great. I can dial in a great tone in seconds. This comes from 4 or 5 years of using his basses exclusively and prob 170 shows per year. Ive never had a problem with the 2 band eq. In fact, I used to have a Fodera with a 3 band and run it passive through a 2 band Sadowsky pre. Nuff said

Rob
 
#112
Tom...you'd try out and buy anything new that comes out that your wife would let you. :rollno: You're probably the only bassist between Cleveland and Detroit that owns something besides a Fender, Ibanez, or MusicMan bass and a Peavey TNT 150 or Hartke stack!!!!

I'm as much a GASAHOLIC as anyone else but I'm really "soured" on heads. Because of my deoendence on a 31 band eq, I've resigned myself to only caring about volume, weight, and reliability. When I see how wide the frequecy boosts and cuts are on some of the stuff out there, I avoid 'em like the plague. I know they won't work for me with the eq, so why change?

I'm the happiest with my sound I've ever been in 40 years of playing. The AI Focus doesn't have much to add or subtract from my tone, so it's almost entirely reliant on my outboard eq to shape it. It weighs 4 pounds and has been very reliable so far and has more than enough power for all my gigs, I'm extremely happy.

EMJAZZ...I appreciate that Sadowsky basses aren't your thing necessarily either and I wasn't attacking them. In fact, I would like them to be my go to bass, but I can't do that unless I can get a more "practical" live player's preamp, one that doesn't just emphasize the low and high end of the bass cabinet's ability to reproduce frequencies.

I feel that both my current Lull M5V and several F basses I owned in the past (couldn't afford to keep....shute!!!), both BN5 and Studio models had tone versatility all over both my 24 fret modern NYC I owned, yeah the red one that's being shown around here...a real beauty...I wish it had worked out...it was something!!!, and a friend's 4 string vintage looking Sadowsky. He also agrees with me...he's a live only player except for his band's demo's and the F bass, especially in single coil mode is just a better live sounding bass...again our opinions....

There are three Lakland's on ebay right now that I'd love to get.....probably haveable for $3000-3200 for two of 'em. Probably would sound great through my new system. Can't afford 'em.....boo hoo :crying:

In the large scheme of things there are what....a few thousand? Sadowsky basses out there and what....a 1/2 million+ Fenders? I would use the adjective to describe how many bassists are in the Sadowsky camp or any other non-Fender group for that matter as their "Go to basses" as, at best "a dedicated few" or "selective small group".

But to feel or think for a moment that anything more than a very very small group of players, be them pro's or amateurs, studio, or live, play Sadowsky, Lull (my bass of choice), Lakland, Elrick, or other boutique basses is just nonsense......they don't.

Not many, not most, not a majority, not alotta (Hawaiian term for many many), not quite a few, but a small amount of dedicated pro's and amateurs use any basses but Fenders.

LKaye
 
#113
Originally Posted by Larry Kaye
Great for studio, fine, it's a proven fact that there are a group of successful professional studio bassists who use Sadowsky when recording. ...
your comment on my comment:

You figure none of those $10000 ouboard EQs or $15000 strips, compressors, etc. get tweaked to adjust the tone in studio? Maybe on mixdown? Maybe just a liiiiitle? Those million-dollar albums are all being made with a battery-powered $200 two-band preamp IYO? Could be, but my points is that just because a pro has a Sadowsky and might use it on a session doesn't mean all that was used was the onboard EQ. Most engineers wouldn't have the inclination or the time budgeted IMO.

Not trying to be confrontational, I agree with much of what you've written here and elsewhere. Don't take things personally.

My answer:

Actually I was trying to be nice...I cut my post down from a total argumentative thesis to that statement....Maybe in the studio, the pure sound of a Sadowsky AUGMENTED by the tens of thousands of dollars of studio equipment makes for a really nice recorded sound? I don't really know frankly and don't care. I agree totally with your statement. I chose not to say what you said because things were getting a bit inflamed, know what I mean!! No...again I was just trying to be nice...there are studio bassists who use Sadowsky's. Several of 'em or even a few more. Not everyone!!! Not even close.

Your rebuttal about "overhype" or "exaggerating" is exactly how I felt. I don't have a single thing against Sadowsky basses or the players that want them and use them. It just isn't my preference and opinion....one that I'm just as entitled to as anyone else is on this forum.

I will argue until the cows come home that my opinion on things, jaded as they may be in some areas holds just as much water and commands just as much respect as anyone else's, regardless of whether I can or can't play as well as the "best" or whether I can or can't build basses as well as the "best."

I am not trying to slam my opinion down anyone's throat...though I will and have slammed the right to state that opinion on this forum, just as the Sadowsky addicts have the right to state how much they love Roger's stuff or me and the Schroeder addicts have the same right. But everyone, everyone, everyone has the right not to love or be addicted too. But when it comes to stating facts....overhyping and overexaggeration, when discovered, should be contested. I contest the extent of the use of Sadowsky basses and preamps in the studio and live situations, even not including Fender basses.

There's no more for me to contribute here...so slam me if ya want to...even if 9 outta 10 people slam me or play Sadowskys, I will still content you can't say everyone does.

Lkaye
 
#115
Sadowsky said:
I don't mean to sound sarcastic, but if it were up to me, the amp would only have a volume knob.

If you want a parametric EQ, add one. If you want a compressor, add one. If you want more knobs, bells and whistles, add them. If you want a lightweight practical amp for gigging, you should not even consider the SA200.

This amp is an expression of who I am and what I hear. I make no claims or boasts whatsoever. For the few of you who choose to try it, I hope you will be pleased. If you are not pleased, return it for a refund.

Roger
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Just ignore these idiots who talk smack on something they have never even seen in person much less played. Most of us cant afford one anyways, Hell I'm saving up for almost 2 years and will be ordering a Metro in April, so you know I wont be getting one of these, although given your track record for quality and craftsmanship, I'm sure that this will be an AMAZING amp. Wish I made better $$, but hey I cant complain. Thanks for the instruments you make, cant wait to get mine...

Keep up the awesome work.
 
#117
Larry Kaye said:
...Try to remember something ladies and gentlemen of the jury.....the utmost vast majority of bass players do not play high end basses or use boutiquish heads or cabinets. What one high end, and a great one at that, feels is the right frequencies to offer boost/cut on his active basses or his outboard or addon on board preamp are his opinion, not the majority of bass players. It wasn't proxied by the rest of the bass players, many of which have never read talkbass, Bass Player, bassgear.com, or even heard of 1/2 the stuff that you and I have owned and played through Tom.
LKaye
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Larry, as you say most bassist don't play high end basses or use boutiquish heads or cabinets and I don't think this head is made with them in mind (IMO). as it's been told here (countless times), Roger makes a product the way he thinks it has to be made, if it works for you great, if it doesn't, great also, there are a lot of makers out there with different approaches to the design of instruments and amps that can suit your needs better, IMO arguing about something we have not tried yet has no point.
 
#118
have other opinions?

Frankly, I don't think Roger Sadowsky needs to be told who to listen to or not. He's a big boy now. He has his niche market and that's what it is. He's not a builder for the masses. Fine...I fully respect a visionary when it comes down to starting and running a successful business. Changing his entire design philosophy to get one additional sale makes no business sense whatsoever. I wouldn't if I were him and he likely won't either and I respect that.

None the less IMHO, and that's all it is, one person's opinion, I'm allowed to and should be encouraged to state that I would like to have more adjustability and frequency points on my head and don't believe it's a legitimate opinion being classified "an idiot" preferring a head set up different than Roger's tube head. And I'm the one being "told" that I'm trying to stuff my opinion down the throats of this forum? Yeah, right!

If a moderator is reading this and you would like to delete mine or anyone else's comments, please feel free to. I would also respectfully request that this topic remain open as there are obviously people interested in the Sadowsky tube head.

LKaye
 

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