The chorus and vibrato circuit in the Roland JC-120 Jazz Chorus amp is the exact same as that of the Boss CE-1.
I personally love it.
My absolute favorite chorus effect for both guitar and bass.
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Seven Chorus and Three Phaser Comparison
- Thread starter 600 Ohms
- Start date
The chorus and vibrato circuit in the Roland JC-120 Jazz Chorus amp is the exact same as that of the Boss CE-1.
I personally love it.
My absolute favorite chorus effect for both guitar and bass.
So, after going down a horrible Small Stone rabbit hole, I really, really want something that does the Small Stone Color switch type of sweep, that really luscious, harmonic sweeping. I don't know that it matters on bass, but I want it for the Rhodes and synth strings, etc. The Nanos aren't doing it for me (@NoiseNinja and I agree on one thing: they're not quite nailed).
I wish the Chase Bliss Wombtone were available for less that highway robbery on Reverb (&*%$ gougers) because it did this amazingly. There is always the Behringer option, or buy an old one, but I wish this sound could be reproduced by something made today that had dignity (sorry, Behringer) and that wasn't massive. Despite claims that the Psilocybe or Phase 100 can do this, I have yet to see any proof from a demo.
This is the elusive sound (cued up):
"Just absolute craziness." Yeah, that's what I'm after.
I wish the Chase Bliss Wombtone were available for less that highway robbery on Reverb (&*%$ gougers) because it did this amazingly. There is always the Behringer option, or buy an old one, but I wish this sound could be reproduced by something made today that had dignity (sorry, Behringer) and that wasn't massive. Despite claims that the Psilocybe or Phase 100 can do this, I have yet to see any proof from a demo.
This is the elusive sound (cued up):
"Just absolute craziness." Yeah, that's what I'm after.
Ahh I was just reminiscing, my earlier post probably didn't come across as intended. I failed to thank you for all the work you're doing presenting these sounds, didn't mean to seem ungrateful
. "Thanks" should've been first and foremost in my first post in the thread.So thanks for the thread! And Thanks for the Orbiter info.
Absolutely horses for courses, and while I still love that metallic chime, it has limited practical use for me — Waterfall is luscious and would be far more useful for me, but ... Orbiter... self-indulgence
.I'd get a Waterfall if I didn't have my Cosmichorus (not that they sound similar, IDK, never had a Waterfall to compare).
The old original big box EHX Small Stone is indeed something very special, and no, as said, the new re-issues are not quite the same, and in my opinion far inferior.
The Behringer clone though, the VP1 Vintage Phaser, dignity or not, does nail it spot on though, unfortunately including the slight volume drop of the original when engaged, though for me personally that is not a problem, since I got it in one of the effect loops of one of my Boss LS-2 pedals, mixed in parallel with my Monarch flanger (same as the Arion Stereo Flanger), sitting in the other effects loop of the LS-2, so I can just dial it in to unity level, or whichever volume I would like it to be, on the LS-2 when engaged.
No other 4 stage phaser, to my knowledge at least, has that incredible lush quacking swirly sublime swoosh of the original Small Stone (or the Behringer clone) with the color switch engaged, and to me phasers that utilizes more than 4 stages, while they might be able to get as pronounced an effect, just doesn't sound as warm, thick and lush, and beside that seems to inevitable come with an inherent way too synthy and toy laser gun like sounding character, leading ones mind into a malice loop of horrifying flashbacks to crappy special effects used in some terribly bad sci-fi B movie from the early 60's, rather than making it blissfully drift off in a mystical oriental esoteric psychedelic trip to the far ancient east from a parallel universe, as the original Small Stone does.
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I bought the Behringer clone for the Rhodes. Grape coming hopefully Friday, but after that, it's decision time.
I've considered these, having watched more demos than I care to admit:
Psilocybe
Wombtone mkII (I seriously want this, but they're 6 hundy on Reverb—jerks)
Whetstone (people say it does the SS thing, but this is completely unsubstantiated by the demos)
Sibling
Subdecay Quasar (looks amazing tbh)
Empress
Diamond
Boss PH-3
Keeley Phaser-of-the-month (Guys, pick one and make it available year round)
Walrus Lillian
Most of them sounded great, but I didn't hear anything that felt particularly "necessary", except where noted. I think these variations are all more interesting on guitars, anyway. Also, a phaser isn't a device where I want tons of control. It just needs to do a cool, funky thing.
I really wish the quality of most pedal demos was better, as well as the quality of the demonstrations themselves. When I watch an effect demo, I want to clearly see the range of each knob without the music changing, and without other controls changing before I've understood what the first control does. And in the case of phasers, I want to hear the range of depth and feedback knobs with the rate/speed knob SLOW, then you can learn something about what the pedal sounds like. You learn next to nothing when the rate is up full. &%#@ drives me crazy.
I've considered these, having watched more demos than I care to admit:
Psilocybe
Wombtone mkII (I seriously want this, but they're 6 hundy on Reverb—jerks)
Whetstone (people say it does the SS thing, but this is completely unsubstantiated by the demos)
Sibling
Subdecay Quasar (looks amazing tbh)
Empress
Diamond
Boss PH-3
Keeley Phaser-of-the-month (Guys, pick one and make it available year round)
Walrus Lillian
Most of them sounded great, but I didn't hear anything that felt particularly "necessary", except where noted. I think these variations are all more interesting on guitars, anyway. Also, a phaser isn't a device where I want tons of control. It just needs to do a cool, funky thing.
I really wish the quality of most pedal demos was better, as well as the quality of the demonstrations themselves. When I watch an effect demo, I want to clearly see the range of each knob without the music changing, and without other controls changing before I've understood what the first control does. And in the case of phasers, I want to hear the range of depth and feedback knobs with the rate/speed knob SLOW, then you can learn something about what the pedal sounds like. You learn next to nothing when the rate is up full. &%#@ drives me crazy.
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Yesterday for the sake of experimentation I hooked my Julia up in series with my other modulation pedals. It was previously in my SD Vapor Trail's sidechain. This made the Julia 100% dependent on the wet/dry mix of the Vapor Trail (thereby reducing its effect).
Long story made short, it's better on it's own. I'd put the Julia in the top 5 chorus pedals of all time, IMO.
Long story made short, it's better on it's own. I'd put the Julia in the top 5 chorus pedals of all time, IMO.
Oh yeah, I can see why it would be better on it's own, especially since it has its own mix. I agree about the Julia, I was very impressed with it. More importantly, Julia, Waterfall and a few of these others are good enough to go back to individual pedals, which was the point of this exercise.
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I very nearly went that route. Have you compared the Ripple to any other 2-stager? I love the artwork on the RF.
Waterfall continues to feel like the right choice. It's like nothing else. Without the feedback tone, it's like listening on freshly-Qtipped ears. Nothing wrong with the high-FB sound; it's the basis for a lot of people's tone, I just find it more versatile with less of it. Chorus can be warm or cold, both are valid.
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While I have no personal experience with it, the Crazy Tube Circuits Cyclone has Phase 45, Phase 90, Small Stone and Lovetone Doppleganger voicings/emulations, so may be worth checking out.
Yes, I left this out on my list above by accident, and it sure looks like the complete package. But much like Josh Scott's video where he compares a Small Stone Nano to an old one, puts the rate in the middle (which he admonishes reviewers for at the start), and never touches the Color switch, then declares he's got a conclusive result that they are more or less identical, I have no idea what aspect of the SS Crazy Tube Circuits feels they've nailed.
That said, it did sound pretty good otherwise in the demos I heard.
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D
no, I don't have any experience with phasers except for the ones on the MD-200 and now the Ripple. But now that I can stack them I realise how nice a light phaser sounds with a subtle chorus.
Currently in possession of a Grape, a Behringer clone of the big box Small Stone in addition to the Phase 95 and Terraform. Will add audio tomorrow. I saw a demo of the Spaceman Explorer, which looks right up my alley. Unfortunately, they've seen fit to discontinue it.
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It's too bad I returned both the Grand Orbiter and the Lunar before receiving these other phasers, but the search is kind of a work in progress, and neither quite rang the bell. Here's what there is right now.
Phase 95: This pedal has consistently been the pedal I've wanted to turn on, and the Phase 45 side of it is really more than a bonus, it's a great sound on bass. It's small, I love the sound. Keeping it regardless.
Behringer VP-1 (Small Stone clone): For under 50 bucks, this thing sounds amazing. You still get an annoying level drop, but I guess the mission was to clone the vintage ones, so mission accomplished. I don't have a real vintage one to compare it to, though I did order a current version Nano to compare it to, despite warnings that it's no good. There's zero reason to send this thing back, so it'll be around for whatever. I admit that if this sounds just like a real vintage SS, the Small Stone is a brilliant phaser (possibly the best ever) that makes a great sound, in spite of my general apathy for EHX products.
Aguilar Grape: While I wasn't exactly wowed by the Grape, it is solid and there are a couple things that I think it does really well. It was designed to be effective with a bass signal, and it certainly is. If the Phase 95 has a slight lower-midrange emphasis, the Grape has more of a bass emphasis, but it's subtle. Grape is to the Waterfall Bass as Phase 90 is to the Julia, in terms of the low end. What isn't subtle, is the shape of the sweep. I think it's either weird (as in, badly chosen) or genius depending on how you look at it. If the Phase 90 shape is a kind of bent triangle wave, and the Small Stone is a dead-straight, very steep triangle, the Grape sounds like a square wave with slewed sides, so what you get is a quick sweep up, then nothing much, then a quick sweep down, then nothing much. In terms of wanting a psychedelic-sounding phaser with a smooth sweep, this pedal seriously disappoints, BUT as you dial the color knob up, the lumpiness of the sweep creates its own rhythm that actually makes the bass track really stand out, so what didn't sound great solo, might be perfect in a mix. The Color full up sounds like how it feels to laugh and have root beer come out your nose, so be careful. I think I clipped my mic pre in the process. You might clip your brain.
I shot these out against the Terraform for good measure (pastiche 70's cop drama style). Moollon P with flatwounds, reamped through a Union Tube & Transistor LAB compressor then into each pedal. I also did my best to level-match them so the Grape and VP-1 matched the Terraform and the MXR.
Phase 95: This pedal has consistently been the pedal I've wanted to turn on, and the Phase 45 side of it is really more than a bonus, it's a great sound on bass. It's small, I love the sound. Keeping it regardless.
Behringer VP-1 (Small Stone clone): For under 50 bucks, this thing sounds amazing. You still get an annoying level drop, but I guess the mission was to clone the vintage ones, so mission accomplished. I don't have a real vintage one to compare it to, though I did order a current version Nano to compare it to, despite warnings that it's no good. There's zero reason to send this thing back, so it'll be around for whatever. I admit that if this sounds just like a real vintage SS, the Small Stone is a brilliant phaser (possibly the best ever) that makes a great sound, in spite of my general apathy for EHX products.
Aguilar Grape: While I wasn't exactly wowed by the Grape, it is solid and there are a couple things that I think it does really well. It was designed to be effective with a bass signal, and it certainly is. If the Phase 95 has a slight lower-midrange emphasis, the Grape has more of a bass emphasis, but it's subtle. Grape is to the Waterfall Bass as Phase 90 is to the Julia, in terms of the low end. What isn't subtle, is the shape of the sweep. I think it's either weird (as in, badly chosen) or genius depending on how you look at it. If the Phase 90 shape is a kind of bent triangle wave, and the Small Stone is a dead-straight, very steep triangle, the Grape sounds like a square wave with slewed sides, so what you get is a quick sweep up, then nothing much, then a quick sweep down, then nothing much. In terms of wanting a psychedelic-sounding phaser with a smooth sweep, this pedal seriously disappoints, BUT as you dial the color knob up, the lumpiness of the sweep creates its own rhythm that actually makes the bass track really stand out, so what didn't sound great solo, might be perfect in a mix. The Color full up sounds like how it feels to laugh and have root beer come out your nose, so be careful. I think I clipped my mic pre in the process. You might clip your brain.
I shot these out against the Terraform for good measure (pastiche 70's cop drama style). Moollon P with flatwounds, reamped through a Union Tube & Transistor LAB compressor then into each pedal. I also did my best to level-match them so the Grape and VP-1 matched the Terraform and the MXR.
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I don't have a vintage BBSS to compare with, but let's assume that everyone agrees the VP-1 more or less approximates (or: nails) the tone. Here is why the Nano Small Stone and the vintage units don't sound the same:
Here's the sweep of the Behringer with the Color switch up:
Here's the sweep of the Nano with the Color switch up:
See how the two notches disappear in the very low frequencies on the Nano, for ages? This has the effect of phasing basically going away for part of the sweep, which would make it sound quite trebly for some of the time. The VP-1 stops around 80Hz then goes back up again.
Apart from that, they sound really similar. Which begs the question, why couldn't EHX make the range of sweep be the same?
Here's the sweep of the Behringer with the Color switch up:
Here's the sweep of the Nano with the Color switch up:
See how the two notches disappear in the very low frequencies on the Nano, for ages? This has the effect of phasing basically going away for part of the sweep, which would make it sound quite trebly for some of the time. The VP-1 stops around 80Hz then goes back up again.
Apart from that, they sound really similar. Which begs the question, why couldn't EHX make the range of sweep be the same?
Waterfall is my choice. I have a separate phaser MXR 90 I mean 95. Has both 4 and 8. Its nice having a 8 instead of 4 at times as the 8 gives it a beautiful lush sound and MXR if anything all their phasers are wonderful.
I'm still digging the Phase 95. The 45 is where I live most of the time. But I also just bought a 1981 Small Stone. I'm turning into a bit of a phase junkie.
I actually had the ripple, it was nice but all the time subtle. I like the 95 also. Small and many great reviews. But the waterfall is amazing for my purposes.
I remember seeing a few Night Witch mentions but I didn't look hard. I'll check it out. As for the 99, I'm not sure what I'd do with TWO Phase 90s in this case... Are the LFOs independent? I'm always trying to get a deeper cut, not more slices, if you know what I mean, which is why I like the old Small Stone. A family member used to have a Mu-Tron Bi-Phase that I always used to fiddle with in my youth, and that to me is the ultimate of what I'm talking about. Too bad they're so sought-after now.
