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Sound guy making making support bands sound worse
- Thread starter lacesoutdom
- Start date
Lemme guess- Jake Gold? The term shithead was created just for him.
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ALWAYS tip before. Tipping after a bad gig is kinda pointless.Ah, it's called "tipping" the "Sound Guy" before the sound check/gig!
Not talking big shows here-
I have to say that most people in the sound and lighting industry are really good people, doing their best, often in an imperfect situation. BUT. There are also a ton of 'house' guys who have done their job for too long to care. Lazy, jaded, drunk, and deaf. It's sad, but until venue owners pay better, this is what you're going to get.
True story- (but from 26 years ago) That really famous place in L.A. The 'couldn't give a crap' soundman has spilled so many beers on the right side of the board that the faders don't move anymore, and the drum mix hasn't changed for the last 150 bands.
I have to say that most people in the sound and lighting industry are really good people, doing their best, often in an imperfect situation. BUT. There are also a ton of 'house' guys who have done their job for too long to care. Lazy, jaded, drunk, and deaf. It's sad, but until venue owners pay better, this is what you're going to get.
True story- (but from 26 years ago) That really famous place in L.A. The 'couldn't give a crap' soundman has spilled so many beers on the right side of the board that the faders don't move anymore, and the drum mix hasn't changed for the last 150 bands.
I'd estimate that about 1/3 of sound techs I've worked with have fallen into the "don't give a crap" category. They spend time with the headliner and then when the support acts setup, they are chatting with the headliner, the club owner or random guys/girls. Most times they aren't even present at the console while the opening bands are playing. They are eating or hanging out with people.
Another 1/3 take the job seriously and try their best but are limited because of the available channels or the rules of not touching eq, reverb, etc. They are trying their hardest to make you sound as good as they can within the tools they are given.
The last 1/3 take the job seriously and have the tools to get the job done right. Those are the nights that all the bands sound great.
So, if a band sounds worse than they could have 2/3rds of the time, they can often feel like they are being victimized, thus perpetuating the stereotype. Then add in the rare times that the sound tech does intentionally tank the band and you see how this idea gains even more traction.
Another 1/3 take the job seriously and try their best but are limited because of the available channels or the rules of not touching eq, reverb, etc. They are trying their hardest to make you sound as good as they can within the tools they are given.
The last 1/3 take the job seriously and have the tools to get the job done right. Those are the nights that all the bands sound great.
So, if a band sounds worse than they could have 2/3rds of the time, they can often feel like they are being victimized, thus perpetuating the stereotype. Then add in the rare times that the sound tech does intentionally tank the band and you see how this idea gains even more traction.
I'll add this to the pile... Sometimes they will sound pretty decent in the fronts, but the floors munky sidestage dropped his crackers.... Soooo, to them, all they heard was crap onstage... and the singer's tambourine at 200 dBs... 
-there you go again...
You really should consider updating your lingo. It's stale as a dropped cracker from the last gig.You're going to get, umm... not much respect from the "sound primates" who are your direct link to the audience's experience.
True though about dead zones and hot spots near the stage. Not so much on the stage if the crew is competent.
Personally I never have, and I pledge never to sabotage a musician's sound or performance, even if it's for some jackass musician who refers to me and my colleagues as munkys.
-there you go again...
You're going to get, umm... not much respect from the "sound primates" who are your direct link to the audience's experience.
True though about dead zones and hot spots near the stage. Not so much on the stage if the crew is competent.
Personally I never have, and I pledge never to sabotage a musician's sound or performance, even if it's for some jackass musician who refers to me and my colleagues as munkys.
Geeze. Your nick is Bassbeater and you call me a jackass.
You beat your bass? Are bass players simply bass beaters?
Are you insinuating bassists really just beat on things?
Bassbeater derogatory? I don't take it as such. Not even close.
I think it humorous...as I do slider munky...
I never said 'primates'. YOU said "sound primates". Your "lingo".
I don't believe I was intentionally derogatory anywhere.
I take no issue with slider munky [myself]. <--read that last again
Yes, I've worn that hat many times...over decades...Starting with a soundco at about 15, waaaaay back.
Been called far far worse as we all have...usually with folks on same crew and in fun.
Still have a beer after load out and laugh at each other. Theatre can be even crazier...
I'm just not overly sensitive over stuff not meant as derogatory in any shape form or fashion...
So I would guess an [ Audio Engineer ] wearing one of many humorous tshirts is a jackass too and should be shunned by all audio engineers everywhere... Not The Light Guy tshirt should have gotten that guy punched I guess...
Have a nice day...
It will be interesting to get another installment from @Paulabass now she is back in the trenches.
The difference between offended and unimpressed is a nuance worth learning.
Yeah, I read in one of her posts about a smaller setup she was testing in her driveway(iirc). Made me think her neighbors are cooler than mine.
The setups get smaller every day, I'd love to hear how that worked out in a venue.
After working in the sound business for around two decades, non of the sound engineers I worked with (all friends) ever made an opening act sound bad on purpose. If there are multiple acts on the bill, sometimes you just dont have a lot to work with channel-wise, gear-wise, time-wise, etc. Many times in my working past, there would be a dozen acts on stage from noon til the end of the national act at 11pm or so at night. Promoters never allow for turnover time. Even with a festival setup where every band uses the same channel, you dont have as much to work with because the headliner is already set up and checked and you dont dare touch their channels. The longer the day goes the behind-er you get. Nobody gets a real soundcheck. You might get "play your guitar" and "how much of that do you want in your monitor" and "is that good? ok, bass player, play a bit" and so on.
We did 29 acts one weekend. NOBODY got a real sound check but the headliner. Another time, there were four bands on stage for a show. National act, a regional act and two locals. We had used so many channels for the headliner and regional bands that there was nothing left for the first band that went on. The drums got a kick and an overhead of their very own. Everything else was robbed from the other two acts with no changes made to the FOH or monitor mixes. I know those guys couldnt hear what they wanted to and like they were used to, and their performance probably suffered from that, and you could probably tell out front too. That's just way it is sometimes. In a perfect world everyone would get one.
Some sound guys may do it. Im sure some do. Nobody I ever worked with did that I could tell. I dont think it would benefit a sound engineer from a local production company to do that. He has to work with the locals again. I'm sure if an engineer with a national act would end up mixing for the opener, he would do it. What does he have to lose? But the likelyhood of a touring engineer having to mix the opener is nil.
BnB
We did 29 acts one weekend. NOBODY got a real sound check but the headliner. Another time, there were four bands on stage for a show. National act, a regional act and two locals. We had used so many channels for the headliner and regional bands that there was nothing left for the first band that went on. The drums got a kick and an overhead of their very own. Everything else was robbed from the other two acts with no changes made to the FOH or monitor mixes. I know those guys couldnt hear what they wanted to and like they were used to, and their performance probably suffered from that, and you could probably tell out front too. That's just way it is sometimes. In a perfect world everyone would get one.
Some sound guys may do it. Im sure some do. Nobody I ever worked with did that I could tell. I dont think it would benefit a sound engineer from a local production company to do that. He has to work with the locals again. I'm sure if an engineer with a national act would end up mixing for the opener, he would do it. What does he have to lose? But the likelyhood of a touring engineer having to mix the opener is nil.
BnB
Yes. The last show I went to. Headliner was Slightly Stoopid, and the two opening bands were popular with the crowd. One of them was named Pepper. I forget who the other band was.
This wasn't the worst live sound I've ever heard. That award goes to whoever mixed for Keller Williams a few years ago.
But the problem was the same: insanely stupid amounts of bass. I suspect some of these "sound guys" graduated from the School of Car Audio? With a minor in Ghetto Blasting. I wish I were exaggerating here, but I am not in the slightest degree: sound so bassy, there is ZERO definition.
I remember watching the bassist change positions around the neck. Must have been playing some interesting lines. All that I could hear was something like a 100hz wall of sound.
EVERYTHING was buried in that mud. Vocals, guitars, keys. Everything lost. I was standing right next to the sound booth too.
When Slightly Stoopid took the stage, by the 3rd number there was a moderate improvement. But the sound was still so bad that the entire horn section was buried. The stage centerpiece of the band, an elaborate conga set - totally inaudible. But at least the vocals could be somewhat heard.
Now mind you, physics was stacked against this venue, set between several buildings. I don't know if I could have gotten a GOOD sound in that scenario, but I have no doubt I could have done better.
This wasn't the worst live sound I've ever heard. That award goes to whoever mixed for Keller Williams a few years ago.
But the problem was the same: insanely stupid amounts of bass. I suspect some of these "sound guys" graduated from the School of Car Audio? With a minor in Ghetto Blasting. I wish I were exaggerating here, but I am not in the slightest degree: sound so bassy, there is ZERO definition.
I remember watching the bassist change positions around the neck. Must have been playing some interesting lines. All that I could hear was something like a 100hz wall of sound.
EVERYTHING was buried in that mud. Vocals, guitars, keys. Everything lost. I was standing right next to the sound booth too.
When Slightly Stoopid took the stage, by the 3rd number there was a moderate improvement. But the sound was still so bad that the entire horn section was buried. The stage centerpiece of the band, an elaborate conga set - totally inaudible. But at least the vocals could be somewhat heard.
Now mind you, physics was stacked against this venue, set between several buildings. I don't know if I could have gotten a GOOD sound in that scenario, but I have no doubt I could have done better.
Tangent on Slightly Stoopid
A few years ago, somebody posted in Craigslist that Slightly Stoopid was looking for a replacement bassist so I called the number because it would be a good gig. It was a prank, the number was the the bassists private #. hehe. We talked for a few minutes and he had a good sense of humor about it. As I was one of the first repsonders, I advised him to prepare himself for a long day.
A few years ago, somebody posted in Craigslist that Slightly Stoopid was looking for a replacement bassist so I called the number because it would be a good gig. It was a prank, the number was the the bassists private #. hehe. We talked for a few minutes and he had a good sense of humor about it. As I was one of the first repsonders, I advised him to prepare himself for a long day.
