Source Audio Sorcerers Society (S.A.S.S) Part 3

[Gibs210]

What difference is there, if any, between how you would approach a polyphonic pitchshifter that simply intends to transpose (like the Drop, or some settings of the Eventide Polyphony Algorithm) while preserving as much of the original tone and attack as possible vs. something polyphonic for the purpose of synthesized sounds like in the C4? I understood some of the previous discussion to be oriented around the latter, but maybe that is irrelevant.

That’s more of a question for Bob and Jesse, I wouldn’t really know how they would approach that, other than wanting the waveform to be a as clean as possible so that your getting the purest sound possible.

 

[GMC]

Source Audio (with Bob Chidlaw) have in a few instances broken ground with their one-series pedals. The EQ2, Atlas, and Ventris pedals sort of blew the doors wide open for what can be gotten with EQ, compression, and reverb in smaller format pedals.

I have a C4, which is successful as a synth pedal that "celebrates" (?) a VERY digital sound (to my ear). It does have a pretty nice feature set for pitch shifting, but sonically, it wasn't very successful or ground-breaking, to my ear.

I don't agree with your blanket statement that the C4 sounds "Very Digital". It really depends on what part of the C4 you are referring to. The Analog down octaver sounds just like a Boss OC-2 to my ears...which is only matched by the Boss OC-5 in terms of a digital re-creation of this complex analogue sound. All other digital octavers sound like the EHX Hog / Pog / Eventide H9-90 or even C4 in poly octave mode.
The filters (the Intelligent Spectrum parts) sound just as analogue as the devices they are emulating / simulating. In fact I can pretty much nail a Xerograph or even a Moog MF 101 which are both definitions of an analogue filter sound.
The subtractive synth part, this sounds to my ears a lot like an old 80's analogue synth. I can re-create almost any Roland Juno sound from it. It's THAT good. However, those sound have a certain metallic edge to them because they are electronic Subtractive synths. The FM part...sounds a lot like a simple 80's (analogue) FM synth.
The harmoniser section sounds just like my H9 and EHX Hog 2. That's because of how the maths work. The C4 Harmoniser's achillies heel (in my opinion) is it's lack of control of the pitch, intervals, key and modes of the harmoniser outside of the App. To get to them you need a phone or plug into a laptop via USB. I've made extrensive trials in trying to map these controls to expernal midi devices / knobs and it's not ended well.
The features are there, but the midi mapping and control isn't very good. That said...we are exploring the very furthest reaches of both the C4's capability and the hardware's capability of providing knob assignments.
I'm a big fan of the C4, thre literally isn't anything like it on the market. But I also have a EHX Hog2 and a pair of H9's (Soon to be a H90 instead), all of which perform different functions or roles.
The Hog 2 does stuff that the other pedals just can't do so well (or allow real time control over) and the H9/H90's have their own things going on which the other 2 pedals can sort of mimic but not as well or as well controlable.
One of the remarkable things about the C4 is that it truely is tiny for what it does. It is half the size of a H9 and about 1/6th of the size of a Hog 2. It's about 1/3rd of the size of a H90. The fact that it's so small and easy to power is one of it's likeable features. However, the small foot print 4 knob format is always going to be one of it's live use limitations. Where as the Hog2 which has a slider for every function is a massive panel. Can you imagine what a C4 would look like if it had a physical control for every function? It would look like a modular synth...the size of a wall.

 

[Adamixoye]

I don't agree with your blanket statement that the C4 sounds "Very Digital". It really depends on what part of the C4 you are referring to. The Analog down octaver sounds just like a Boss OC-2 to my ears...which is only matched by the Boss OC-5 in terms of a digital re-creation of this complex analogue sound. All other digital octavers sound like the EHX Hog / Pog / Eventide H9-90 or even C4 in poly octave mode.
The filters (the Intelligent Spectrum parts) sound just as analogue as the devices they are emulating / simulating. In fact I can pretty much nail a Xerograph or even a Moog MF 101 which are both definitions of an analogue filter sound.
The subtractive synth part, this sounds to my ears a lot like an old 80's analogue synth. I can re-create almost any Roland Juno sound from it. It's THAT good. However, those sound have a certain metallic edge to them because they are electronic Subtractive synths. The FM part...sounds a lot like a simple 80's (analogue) FM synth.
The harmoniser section sounds just like my H9 and EHX Hog 2. That's because of how the maths work. The C4 Harmoniser's achillies heel (in my opinion) is it's lack of control of the pitch, intervals, key and modes of the harmoniser outside of the App. To get to them you need a phone or plug into a laptop via USB. I've made extrensive trials in trying to map these controls to expernal midi devices / knobs and it's not ended well.
The features are there, but the midi mapping and control isn't very good. That said...we are exploring the very furthest reaches of both the C4's capability and the hardware's capability of providing knob assignments.
I'm a big fan of the C4, thre literally isn't anything like it on the market. But I also have a EHX Hog2 and a pair of H9's (Soon to be a H90 instead), all of which perform different functions or roles.
The Hog 2 does stuff that the other pedals just can't do so well (or allow real time control over) and the H9/H90's have their own things going on which the other 2 pedals can sort of mimic but not as well or as well controlable.
One of the remarkable things about the C4 is that it truely is tiny for what it does. It is half the size of a H9 and about 1/6th of the size of a Hog 2. It's about 1/3rd of the size of a H90. The fact that it's so small and easy to power is one of it's likeable features. However, the small foot print 4 knob format is always going to be one of it's live use limitations. Where as the Hog2 which has a slider for every function is a massive panel. Can you imagine what a C4 would look like if it had a physical control for every function? It would look like a modular synth...the size of a wall.

I will say that the Drop and H90 (not H9), to my ear, are in a different class in terms of how they sound.

 

[Jigmay]

Can the EQ2 emulate an Ashly SC-40?

 

[rsmith601]

What difference is there, if any, between how you would approach a polyphonic pitchshifter that simply intends to transpose (like the Drop, or some settings of the Eventide Polyphony Algorithm) while preserving as much of the original tone and attack as possible vs. something polyphonic for the purpose of synthesized sounds like in the C4? I understood some of the previous discussion to be oriented around the latter, but maybe that is irrelevant.

If we can process thousands of biquad filters and then have some fast logic to analyze the results, this will have a potential transformative impact on polyphonic pitch shifting and pitch detection. We are not there yet in pedal format, but I think some off-line processing can do this? AI also offers some options to learn players and track accordingly. All of this is to say that future real-time processing power offers us some interesting options.

 

[stubbsonic]

I don't agree with your blanket statement that the C4 sounds "Very Digital".
...
One of the remarkable things about the C4 is that it truely is tiny for what it does.

That's totally fair. The C4 is a breathtaking piece of kit.

I really wanted to like it, because the feature set is just mind-blowing. I wasn't very successful at finding usable sounds for my specific tastes and needs. I have a boss SY-1000, and have found that a bit easier to make the specific things I was after.

When I watch & listen to C4 demos, I hear examples of extreme sounds, some FM-inspired synth tones, etc. But the basic tones just aren't to my liking.

My Ventris arrives this afternoon. And my little pedal board with EQ2, LA Lady, Atlas, and Gemini on it has barely enough room for the Ventris in that last spot. I love that it will be my go-to opto-trem as well as reverb.

 

[Standalone]

Just snagged an Aftershock on Reverb. This will join my C4 and Hot Hand.


(not my video)

I am tempted to shift my dozen pedal pedalboard setup to an all SA rig. I no longer use the compression or bass soul food that was on the board at the time I recorded this demo.



But for now it will be nice to add some more distortion colors.

 

[stubbsonic]

The pre & post EQ, and blend option makes those SA drives super versatile.

 

[Mr. voodoobass]

Wanted to be able to easily change settings and drive types, without hooking up a laptop. So decided to give my uw and eq2 different duties.
My setup is as follows…
Ch1 of eq2 into ch1 of uw(compressor only).
Then into hx stomp for subs and synth tones.
Then out of fx loop into h9(pitch, delay, reverb) and into ch2 of uw(again compressor only) and into ch2 of eq2 for final hpf, lpf and eq tweaks.
And back into hx stomp for modulations.

 

[jam.majors]

Just snagged an Aftershock on Reverb. This will join my C4 and Hot Hand.


(not my video)

I am tempted to shift my dozen pedal pedalboard setup to an all SA rig. I no longer use the compression or bass soul food that was on the board at the time I recorded this demo.



But for now it will be nice to add some more distortion colors.

I've gone almost-all SA at the point. What I love is that for a lot of pedals I hear online I realize one of mine can do that. So then I make or try to find a patch and play with an extremely similar (if not identical) sound and don't spend more money.
You Aftershock demo sounded great, btw!

 

[jam.majors]

Wanted to be able to easily change settings and drive types, without hooking up a laptop. So decided to give my uw and eq2 different duties.
My setup is as follows…
Ch1 of eq2 into ch1 of uw(compressor only).
Then into hx stomp for subs and synth tones.
Then out of fx loop into h9(pitch, delay, reverb) and into ch2 of uw(again compressor only) and into ch2 of eq2 for final hpf, lpf and eq tweaks.
And back into hx stomp for modulations.View attachment 5275559

That's a highly dedicated setup! I love it. The comps on UW are so choice I almost didn't get the Atlas. But the Atlas has some extra fun built in that cracked open my crusty wallet.

 

[LowWay]

it is, until you’re in a really small setting, that it’s not practical to bring more than one bass to, you’d really rather use the 4 string, because you like the way it sounds better on most of the songs, and there are two count them two songs that need a low E flat.

I wonder if this pedal could be dialed in to drop 1/2 step on demand?

 

[Standalone]

I've gone almost-all SA at the point. What I love is that for a lot of pedals I hear online I realize one of mine can do that. So then I make or try to find a patch and play with an extremely similar (if not identical) sound and don't spend more money.
You Aftershock demo sounded great, btw!

Wasn’t my demo! I wanted to include a pic but put the most recent YouTube demo I could find

 

[jam.majors]

Wasn’t my demo! I wanted to include a pic but put the most recent YouTube demo I could find

God forbid I read the very clear "not my video" that you put directly underneath the video!

 

[Standalone]

God forbid I read the very clear "not my video" that you put directly underneath the video!

I’m flattered! Haha.
My YouTube demos are much less professional…
https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PL8RUovQQXDeTjYTJSvv3C3hPWhxMX0ySP&si=HDfL6b5z1C4w7AMZ

 

[Ricky Caboverde]

Has anyone here compared HXS dirt to the Aftershock?

 

[Luke the Fluke]

so I've not use Neuro app for a while... but has the log in requirements changed? Either that or the last MacOS update has messed things up?

(Like it has for programming my midi usb host preset switcher thingy )

 

[Quatschmacher]

so I've not use Neuro app for a while... but has the log in requirements changed? Either that or the last MacOS update has messed things up?

(Like it has for programming my midi usb host preset switcher thingy )

It’s email address to log in as it has been for ever I think.

 

[boing]

The pre & post EQ, and blend option makes those SA drives super versatile.

When you say pre/post EQ are you referring to the 2 different drive types that each patch has, or actually routing the drive engine pre/post the EQ section? I didn't think the latter was possible.

 

[stubbsonic]

When you say pre/post EQ are you referring to the 2 different drive types that each patch has, or actually routing the drive engine pre/post the EQ section? I didn't think the latter was possible.

OMG, I'm so sorry. I was totally confusing the LA Lady with another SA pedal. You're right, it is not possible.

Ugh. I should tap the brakes sometimes.