Spector Club - Part 7

[JPSBassist]

FYI...today I received my 1st NS-2A 80s bass! I took it to band practice tonite...WOW!!! I'm now a believer in the neck-thru and I love the PJ pickups!!!

I can't believe how long a tone will carry! And how full and warm the tones are. Playing It is like an extension of my arm...the neck is sooo smooth! Like butter!

Now I'm thinking how to get $$$ to buy my next Spector...a fretless! I'll have time to figure out which model.

Actually, that's what I did... I turned my NS-2A into a fretless. And it's a sweet, sweet bass. So far, of all the bass necks I've measured (meaning current USA and Euro Spectors) my NS-2A has the thinnest neck profile (meaning front to back, not the width of the fingerboard).

It's now a lined fretless. It's the gloss black one in front. It's awesome as a fretless and I added active EMG P/J's.

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[Chrisk-K]

Isn't it confusing to play a fretless converted from a fretted bass because of side dots? I mean, on a fretless bass like yours side dots are located between imaginary frets.

 

[peledog]

Nothing a sharpie can't fix. lol

 

[peledog]

Back in about 1985 I joined a band where the bassist I was replacing was already singing this song. This was my first real intro to Joe Jackson (I also promptly went out and got "Look Sharp" and "I'm The Man") and I loved this song. Needless to say I took it over (singing it also). To this day it is still my fave Joe Jackson song. Maby is super creative.

Excellent! I used to play the title track's drum break, with the piano, over and over again. (I think I just figured out how to do the A/B repeat on the this new thing called a CD player!) I thought it was one of the coolest drum fills ever...

I never sang in that particular college band - well, I did - but only the 'low' voice songs like INXS' Need You Tonight and David Bowie's version of China Girl. I did do the backing 'I'm the man' vocals though - that was really fun.

Learning to play the bass AND sing lead is something I've not mastered at all.

Nowadays, I try to work in some backing vocals - but the band I'm in now already has four vocalists - so I can just look at my Rebop if I get bored, LOL.

 

[JPSBassist]

Isn't it confusing to play a fretless converted from a fretted bass because of side dots? I mean, on a fretless bass like yours side dots are located between imaginary frets.

That's why you have the master luthier who is doing the defret for you move the side dots to the correct "new" position like mine did.

And actually, I didn't have to ask. He knew to do this. And he asked me if I wanted "larger" "brighter" side dots. The answer was "heck yeah!"

So yes, if an inexperienced luthier or want-to-be does the conversion for you, this is a potential issue. But not if you hire someone who knows their stuff.

My luthier is available for this sort of work. As a matter of fact, he's now the guy that Spector refers West Coast, non-warranty repairs to. He's really good and actually very affordable.

Guitar Tech Corner
Tracy Longo
(805) 647-7221
www.guitartechcorner.com
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I had the pearl dots removed and filled in. He did such an awesome job that you can't see where they once were... he matched the grain pattern up in the fill-in inserts. Same thing with where the old side dots were. It looks so good I've had people think it was a factory done fretless.

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Above is Rock and Roll Hall of Fame member Chris Hillman (the Byrds and Desert Rose Band). He dropped in and was loving the work being done on my bass and agreed to get a snapshot with it. Which was way, way cool. IMHO.

This is also the same luthier that custom built a new brass nut for my NS-2A. I think someone was asking about a brass nut for a Legend a few pages back.
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[Ian Perge]

You can order USA NS-5XL models with EMG P/Js. As a matter of fact you can order a USA NS-5XL with just a "P" pup if you want. Or with two "J"s Stuart has done these before so it can be done, just requires a special order. Which honestly all USA-Made Spectors are "Special Order" or "Custom Shop" if you want to look at it that way.

Honestly, for us "mere mortals" who don't have the access to Stuart, PJ & company as well as the the money for some of the truly sweet exotic tops that MK has (Buckeye Burl, anyone? ) I'd still recommend using the "standard" EMG Link Removed/Link Removed/Link Removed-sized Soapbar pickups, as that allows you to experiment with a ton of different EMG pickups that are built within the Soapbar Shell and let you try any number of different pickup combinations as shown by the links above.

For example, I just finished my 3+ Year "Electronic Refinishing Project" of my ReBop DLX FM & EX 4 and 5-string basses, and after deciding to go with Custom-wound & EMG-sized Nordstrand Big Singles and Aguilar OBP-3SK/PP preamps in my ReBop DLX EX Zebrawood "topped" 4 & 5-string fretted & custom order ReBop 5 DLX FM Lined Fretless (I know... I'm writing The Story up as we type, and I should have pictures and sound samples to go with them. Needless to say, this combo of Zebrawood-and-Alder ReBop, Pickups & Preamp is an THUNDEROUS sound and would be 95% of my "Signature Bass" ), I still had my Black Cherryburst ReBop 5 DLX FM that didn't have a specific "purpose", but I wasn't selling due to its emotional value - in was my first Spector purchase even though it wasn't my "Main Player" anymore, and that due to the Gear Economy I'd get a pittance for it. But I figured that since Fender was no longer making the [Invalid or Expired Link Removed] with it's fantastic P/Dual Coil pickup arrangement, that I would attempt to replicate it with EMG's Link Removed & Link Removed pickups (their 5-string Precision and ceramic loaded Dual Coil pups in their standard 5-string soapbar housing) since that I'm very much a Single Coil type-o'-guy but that was by far the only Precision-type bass I've found myself liking due to that huge humbucker at the bridge and knowing a "P" is a necessary tone to have in your "toolbox". As I already owned the 40DC from a previous purchase I only had to buy the 40P5 which made it an extremely economical Test Bed to see if I could get "That Sound" from my Spector and the pickups. The great news is that it works fantastically as both as my 5-string "Spector American Deluxe PreBop V" and that sometime fairly soon I'll be replacing the EMGs with a Nordstrand NP5/DC5 set in EMG shells as well (I've already spoken to them and they can do so)... part of this "test" was that I found out I liked the P/DC arraignment in my Spector but still am not a fan of "The EMG Sound" and would rather use passive Nordys based on the success of my Big Singles S/Cs in my 3 other ReBops.

...but I think this illustrates my point regarding the EMG "Standard Sizing" and going in that direction as opposed to custom P/J routes. You can just as easily go "The Standard" EMG P/J sound or something less usual such as a Double "P" setup (aka "Link Removed"), the prototypical Double J Jazz Bass set, or the "DC Neck/CS bridge" for those who find the DC/DC too aggressive in the high-end (and this isn't even bringing in the Dual-Single Coil TW series into the picture, which could easily add a third option to all the above)... and all are available for 4, 5, or 6-strings this way.

Of course if you've enough for a custom USA-built Spector I'd imagine you'd know what "Your Sound" is (then again, I had a "Mid-Bass Crisis" ( ) around my 13th Year as a Bassist and changed just about everything I knew: from Neck-Thru to Bolt-Ons, "Hippy Sandwiches" to a basic 2-piece Alder or Ash body with at most a nice top, from Soapbar-Housed Pickups to Single Coils on all but two of my electrics... Effects, Amplification and Speaker Cabinets as well as studying how I was physically playing and then improving my technique and playing styles as well. It took a few years to stick, but I'm a far better bassist because of that "Introspective Period" from 2002 - 2006 ) ...but this gives a player the option of swapping out pickups based on changes in a specific gigging or recording situation quickly with EMG's "Quik-Connect" connectors. Even with my non-equipped Nordstrands, it's a fairly minor Soldering job to do so - even though it's not "My Sound", I may keep an EMG-equipped Bass with a selection of various EMG pickups in my collection just for these reasons and "Time Is Money" studio dates.

 

[PhatBasstard]

That's why you have the master luthier who is doing the defret for you move the side dots to the correct "new" position like mine did.

And actually, I didn't have to ask. He knew to do this. And he asked me if I wanted "larger" "brighter" side dots. The answer was "heck yeah!"

So yes, if an inexperienced luthier or want-to-be does the conversion for you, this is a potential issue. But not if you hire someone who knows their stuff.

My luthier is available for this sort of work. As a matter of fact, he's now the guy that Spector refers West Coast, non-warranty repairs to. He's really good and actually very affordable.

Guitar Tech Corner
Tracy Longo
(805) 647-7221
www.guitartechcorner.com
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I had the pearl dots removed and filled in. He did such an awesome job that you can't see where they once were... he matched the grain pattern up in the fill-in inserts. Same thing with where the old side dots were. It looks so good I've had people think it was a factory done fretless.

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Above is Rock and Roll Hall of Fame member Chris Hillman (the Byrds and Desert Rose Band). He dropped in and was loving the work being done on my bass and agreed to get a snapshot with it. Which was way, way cool. IMHO.

This is also the same luthier that custom built a new brass nut for my NS-2A. I think someone was asking about a brass nut for a Legend a few pages back.
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No offense guys, but none of this makes any sense.
It's a lined fretless. The whole purpose of a lined fretless is the visual reference of the lines as to frets. Because of this the dots stay where they would nomally be.
Why would you move the dots to the actual fret/line position. That's done for an unlined fretless because there are no reference lines.

I've seen plenty of production and custom lined fretlesses and have never seen one where the dots are moved to the same position as would be on an unlined fretless. Maybe they're out there, but this seems totally redundant on a lined fretless.
I've never (until now) seen this done on a conversion either (cue Jaco). It's unneeded.

If my "master" luthier did this (or anything without clearing it with me first) on a lined fretless (I prefer unlined, FWIW) he would be moving them back...
...on his dime.

 

[iceboxbass]

Actually, that's what I did... I turned my NS-2A into a fretless. And it's a sweet, sweet bass. So far, of all the bass necks I've measured (meaning current USA and Euro Spectors) my NS-2A has the thinnest neck profile (meaning front to back, not the width of the fingerboard).

It's now a lined fretless. It's the gloss black one in front. It's awesome as a fretless and I added active EMG P/J's.

Very nice pics JP! best of the best there! Especially like the Walnut NS!
That looked like quite the process to make it fretless. Beautiful indeed! However for me I'd prefer the line free fretless. Love the smooth look. How much of a process would it be to replace the complete fret board? Thank you for sharing those pics JP! appreciate beautiful Bass'.

 

[CH Design]

So far, of all the bass necks I've measured (meaning current USA and Euro Spectors) my NS-2A has the thinnest neck profile (meaning front to back, not the width of the fingerboard).

Hey Phat,
You should measure the neck on your 4-string and compare it to JPS's measurements. I'm willing to bet it's thinner. Of all the Spectors I have owned, that one definitely had the best neck profile (IMO of course).

 

[PhatBasstard]

Hey Phat,
You should measure the neck on your 4-string and compare it to JPS's measurements. I'm willing to bet it's thinner. Of all the Spectors I have owned, that one definitely had the best neck profile (IMO of course).

Stop it! You're not getting her back.
She's my main workhorse now. I actually prefer her over my US NS2.

That thought had entered my head when JPS posted those measurements. She does feel different than any other Czech I've owned or played. She's my first oil finish (I may never go back) so I kind of chocked it up to that.
Plus, since they do so much hand work/finishing I figure every neck is going to be slightly different regardless of the target measurements.
The biggest clue to this is looking at the upper horn of various US and Czech NS & Euro basses. See how the upper horn is slightly thinner on some, yet more....."voluptuous"p) on others.

There is a light purple colored Czech 4 string that has been in the classifieds that the upper horn looks downright pregnant!

 

[PhatBasstard]

How much of a process would it be to replace the complete fret board?

Had this done to an old NS2A about 10 years ago (Sorry for the crappy pic. The spot at the 12th fret position is a light reflection). He replaced the whole board with a nice piece of ebony. I liked how he made the end of the fingerboard kind of mirror the upper edge of the headstock.

He also fashioned the "yin" pickguard as this, like all NS2A's, had passive Select/Spector PJ's that I replaced with active EMG JJ's and I had to cover the excess route from the old P pickup.

 

[JPSBassist]

No offense guys, but none of this makes any sense.
It's a lined fretless. The whole purpose of a lined fretless is the visual reference of the lines as to frets. Because of this the dots stay where they would nomally be.
Why would you move the dots to the actual fret/line position. That's done for an unlined fretless because there are no reference lines.

I've seen plenty of production and custom lined fretlesses and have never seen one where the dots are moved to the same position as would be on an unlined fretless. Maybe they're out there, but this seems totally redundant on a lined fretless.
I've never (until now) seen this done on a conversion either (cue Jaco). It's unneeded.

If my "master" luthier did this (or anything without clearing it with me first) on a lined fretless (I prefer unlined, FWIW) he would be moving them back...
...on his dime.

OK... You're a really smart guy so I'm not sure why you don't get what was done here.

On a standard fretted bass the dots are in the 1/2 way position between frets. The exact place you should put your fingers to press the string down so you can get the best note from the fret.

If you are used to using these dots for your finger placement reference, and I am... I don't look at the frets or even the crown markers because when you've got your bass slung over your shoulder and hanging down by your waist you can't "see" the front of the neck typicallly. So I use the side markers for reference... although I'm working on my finger memory so I don't need any reference...

If I hadn't had those dots moved, I'd have to calculate moving my fingers 1/2 the way up the fret "on the fly". And this takes a whole bunch of training since I'm used to aiming for the dot.

Why? Because we all know that on a fretless, you do not want to hit between where the "imaginary" frets are... the note (just as it is on a bass with frets) is at the fret.

So... I had the side markers moved to exactly where the frets should be, so the third isn't between the second and the third. It's at the third. And as a result, I can play my fretless with very little thought... and I hit the proper note every time.

It's a matter of preference I would think. I've never owned a lined fretless before this one... I've only had unlined fretless basses... and guess what? As you stated, they have side dot markers right on the location where the fret should be, not between where it should be.

Perhaps if I had trained on a lined fretless with markers the same as a fretted I'd be used to aiming for 1/2 a fret further up the board than there the dots are... but this seems sort of silly to me for finger memory placement... to move to a fretted from this you'd have the reverse issue and have to compensate 1/2 fret down.

And any time you'd like to take up lutherie issues with my guy, feel free. His experience and reputation stand for itself... and after several Spector repairs he's been chosen by Stuart and PJ as their "preferred referral" for work on damaged Spectors that are not under warranty... that's more than good enough for me.

I think your comments regarding his moving my dots... implicating that this was a "mistake" that'd you'd not tolerate was out of bounds. His work is masterful and his asking me about this change was the prudent thing for him to do.

He went over the issue with me, I saw his logic instantly and was grateful he brought this up to me. Because as a result I haven't had to switch how I play. It was a very wise adjustment regarding my playing style. May not be for everyone, but I think the poster that posed this question to begin with would be just like me and appreciate his luthier doing this should he convert his bass the same way.

 

[JPSBassist]

Hey Phat,
You should measure the neck on your 4-string and compare it to JPS's measurements. I'm willing to bet it's thinner. Of all the Spectors I have owned, that one definitely had the best neck profile (IMO of course).

Hey Phat, I'd be curious about this too... it's always good to have more data like this. Eventually, it'd be cool to be able to add this sort of stuff to the historical models as well.

 

[JPSBassist]

Very nice pics JP! best of the best there! Especially like the Walnut NS!
That looked like quite the process to make it fretless. Beautiful indeed! However for me I'd prefer the line free fretless. Love the smooth look. How much of a process would it be to replace the complete fret board? Thank you for sharing those pics JP! appreciate beautiful Bass'.

I think replacing the fingerboard is a personal preference. For me, my original fingerboard was in very, very good condition, so I wanted to keep the bass as original as possible. It's one thing to pull the frets, insert maple and sand and refinish, it's another level of difficulty where something could go wrong to pull the entire fingerboard, glue a new one down and then sand for the proper thickness and radius.

I did have the option of placing matching rosewood into the slots and then hiding the lines in the same manner the holes where the pearl dots had been are now gone to the casual observer... I mean you really have to look to find them now. And on several of these fill-ins I can't see the former holes at all. He did a brilliant job matching grain for me.

I wanted the maple for the rare occasion that I am sitting down and playing. Then you can see the fret lines. But I prefer to play standing, and I like to have my bass slung right around my waistline. I'm 6'2" and have pretty balanced proportions (meaning I'm not all legs with a short waist or all waist with short legs...) And I'm thin (175-180lbs any given day) so when I play in my most comfortable position I don't see the frets on the neck anyway. But I wanted those lines just in case. Probably more of a security blanket in thought than in reality.

You can certainly replace the entire fingerboard and I love what Phat did with his bass... replacing the rosewood with ebony.

And although Ebony is a much more delicate wood than Rosewood... it gets brittle as it ages and is prone to cracking... I'm seriously considering ordering a new USA NS-2 with an ebony fingerboard. Stuart will do it... he's not crazy about doing it... but he'll do it if you ask.

 

[NKUSigEp]

Oh yeah! That's what I have too. Did you have a tutorial to follow? If so where? I've been thinking lately about doing the same to my Rebop 5. Maybe the legend 4? Everybody says active/active is the sound!
Please let me know if you have any tutorials. Thanks!

Of the 9 Spectors I've owned, they've all been upgraded or came with the active EMG's - I don't want to sound like a snob but for the tone I use (heavily overdriven, fuzz), they perform way beyond the EMG-Hz pickups.

They usually come with installation directions and are a pretty easy install if you have any electronics experience. If not, there are plenty of youtube videos and also threads here on talkbass.

 

[PhatBasstard]

OK... You're a really smart guy so I'm not sure why you don't get what was done here.

On a standard fretted bass the dots are in the 1/2 way position between frets. The exact place you should put your fingers to press the string down so you can get the best note from the fret.

If you are used to using these dots for your finger placement reference, and I am... I don't look at the frets or even the crown markers because when you've got your bass slung over your shoulder and hanging down by your waist you can't "see" the front of the neck typicallly. So I use the side markers for reference... although I'm working on my finger memory so I don't need any reference...

If I hadn't had those dots moved, I'd have to calculate moving my fingers 1/2 the way up the fret "on the fly". And this takes a whole bunch of training since I'm used to aiming for the dot.

Why? Because we all know that on a fretless, you do not want to hit between where the "imaginary" frets are... the note (just as it is on a bass with frets) is at the fret.

So... I had the side markers moved to exactly where the frets should be, so the third isn't between the second and the third. It's at the third. And as a result, I can play my fretless with very little thought... and I hit the proper note every time.

It's a matter of preference I would think. I've never owned a lined fretless before this one... I've only had unlined fretless basses... and guess what? As you stated, they have side dot markers right on the location where the fret should be, not between where it should be.

Perhaps if I had trained on a lined fretless with markers the same as a fretted I'd be used to aiming for 1/2 a fret further up the board than there the dots are... but this seems sort of silly to me for finger memory placement... to move to a fretted from this you'd have the reverse issue and have to compensate 1/2 fret down.

And any time you'd like to take up lutherie issues with my guy, feel free. His experience and reputation stand for itself... and after several Spector repairs he's been chosen by Stuart and PJ as their "preferred referral" for work on damaged Spectors that are not under warranty... that's more than good enough for me.

I think your comments regarding his moving my dots... implicating that this was a "mistake" that'd you'd not tolerate was out of bounds. His work is masterful and his asking me about this change was the prudent thing for him to do.

He went over the issue with me, I saw his logic instantly and was grateful he brought this up to me. Because as a result I haven't had to switch how I play. It was a very wise adjustment regarding my playing style. May not be for everyone, but I think the poster that posed this question to begin with would be just like me and appreciate his luthier doing this should he convert his bass the same way.

You seemed to infer that he did this prior to clearing it with you. Eventually, right or wrong, this would not be the way to go about making a major change on someone's bass. I'm sure his actual work is excellent.

I did own a lined fretless conversion at one time (a Carruthers 5). I had John Carruthers (a considered master luthier in his own right) fill the fret slots with a material that matched the fretboard as close as possible because I wasn't nuts about lines.
Close up I could still see the lines, including the side of the fingerboard filled fret slots which, with no binding, I assume should be the same on your Spector, especially with that contrasting material. This still makes the fret positions very visible without moving the dots. This was never condidered or even suggested.

Plus, unless you're someone with a rather large mid section (and I'm sure you're not ), and the way NS basses ride closer in due to the body curve, I have a real hard time believing you don't see your fingerboard and/or lines quite easily.

I just had a problem with the way you posted it like it was the "right" way and commonplace. It is not, in my experience with numorous fretlesses, both lined and converted lined.
If this is what you wanted/needed, no problem.

I didn't mean to infer that your luthier does shoddy work. Just that a major change like that is not commonplace and should not be done prior to consulting with the client, which you made it sound like he did not do with you. If I missunderstood this, I apologize.

FWIW, I understood totally your premise of what was done.
For reasons stated in my posts, it just didn't make sense on a widely accepted scale. As a custom job, so be it.

 

[JPSBassist]

Honestly, for us "mere mortals" who don't have the access to Stuart, PJ & company as well as the the money for some of the truly sweet exotic tops that MK has (Buckeye Burl, anyone? ) I'd still recommend using the "standard" EMG sized Soapbar pickups, as that allows you to experiment with a ton of different EMG pickups that are built within the Soapbar Shell and let you try any number of different pickup combinations...

There is a real logic to this... You can get "P" pups in a soapbar shell. I've never tried them personally, but I know they are available.

Now... mere mortals? I'm not sure what that means...

I will say that ALL of you have the same access to PJ that Mike Kroeger does. PJ manages sales and customer support for Spector. When you send an email to customer service, you're sending it to PJ.

And NO ONE has access to Stuart really. He's too busy building guitars and running the workshop and factories. He's the nicest, most gracious guy you're gonna meet... but he's super-busy. PJ runs interference for him.

Spector (the company) as we all know it and love it is a result of both Stuart and PJ's hard work together.

I have to admit that the USA basses are very expensive. And if not for my employee status and resulting discount; I'd not be able to justify affording one. So this is a good point. And I have to say that the Euro models are so good, so well done, that the differences (in my opinion) are few enough that the price on the Euro models represent the deal of the century as far as I'm concerned.

Which I guess comes down to the fact that the USA models are truly "perfection"...

My NS-2JA-R had a bunch of rough frets on the bottom side of the neck, or the side or the neck that faces the ground when playing... and I had to sand them to get them smooth.

There are finish imperfections in my high gloss Euro4LX-Classic and there are none in my USA NS-4... And the brass/gold bridge of my Euro model is wearing through at the corner where I sometimes rest my palm (when playing with a pick... hey! Give me a break... I was a guitarist for two decades before I saw the light and switched to bass)... The bridge on my USA shows no sign of wear what so ever...

There are differences. And they are subtle, small, but they are there. And then comes the knowledge that my USA bass and USA guitar were actually made by Stuart, and the sections that were not directly done by him were done with his close supervision... and they are signed like works of art by him.

All of these things make the USA models special. It is up to you as a player, as an individual as to decide do these things justify paying twice what you could pay for an instrument that I honestly say is 80% what the original USA models are.

For me... the answer is yes. But for many it's no. And that's why I'm glad we make the Euro line. They really are incredible instruments for the money.

 

[PhatBasstard]

Hey Phat, I'd be curious about this too... it's always good to have more data like this. Eventually, it'd be cool to be able to add this sort of stuff to the historical models as well.

I'll have to go back to your post and see how exactly you did the measurements. I'm not totally sure I have the right tools to do it.
EDIT: Digital calipers. I'm screwed.

 

[PhatBasstard]

You can get "P" pups in a soapbar shell. I've never tried them personally, but I know they are available.

In case this is important to anyone, as noted previously in this thread:
The EMG 35, 40 & 45 P pickups have the coils in "reverse P" configuration (like most Spector P's) inside those soapbars.

 

[JPSBassist]

You seemed to infer that he did this prior to clearing it with you. Eventually, right or wrong, this would not be the way to go about making a major change on someone's bass. I'm sure his actual work is excellent.

I see what you are saying and this is my mistake. He did ask me before doing it. And not ever having a lined fretless before it made perfect sense, so I was pleased that he had thought about this issue before we got underway. But of course he's done countless fretless conversions in his 30 year career. He's run into this issue before I'm sure.

I did own a lined fretless conversion at one time (a Carruthers 5). I had John Carruthers (a considered master luthier in his own right) fill the fret slots with a material that matched the fretboard as close as possible because I wasn't nuts about lines.

I've heard of John's work. Cool. And I agree, I'm not nuts about the lines either, but I felt I'd do it anyway and see how it worked out.

Close up I could still see the lines, including the side of the fingerboard filled fret slots which, with no binding, I assume should be the same on your Spector, especially with that contrasting material. This still makes the fret positions very visible without moving the dots. This was never condidered or even suggested.

Yeah... I guess this is a "per job" thing. I've seen converted fretless basses with lines like what you are saying... you have to really look close to see them. It's actually pretty cool.

Plus, unless you're someone with a rather large mid section (and I'm sure you're not ), and the way NS basses ride closer in due to the body curve, I have a real hard time believing you don't see your fingerboard and/or lines quite easily.

No... LOL. I'm pretty skinny. But I don't know. I've got really good posture so I have a tendency to stand shoulders back (from years of horseback riding I guess) and so I actually don't see that much if any of the front of the neck usually. So those side dots are my main visual reference.

I just had a problem with the way you posted it like it was the "right" way and commonplace. It is not, in my experience with numorous fretlesses, both lined and converted lined.
If this is what you wanted/needed, no problem.

I apologize. I see what you are saying. And I have nothing but respect for you. You've been one of the most helpful people on this board and I learn from your posts, just like everyone else has at one point or another.

And the "right way" when doing any sort of modification to a musical instrument, is the way the player decides after careful consideration. I'm of the general opinion (in all aspects of life) that the only stupid questions are the ones you don't ask. Never assume anything.

So my mantra is always going to be, "ask". So no... you shouldn't EVER let anyone handle your instrument and make changes without discussing it first. And I see what you mean about my post.

Again, I've warned everyone before... late at night I have a tendency to truncate my thoughts. And I'd avoid posting at night completely but sometimes it's the only time I can.

My comment about inexperienced or want-to-be's was more about having them be aware of an issue like this to bring it to your attention so you CAN make a decision BEFORE the work is started. And my guy discusses everything. And many things like this side dot issue that I'd never even considered.

So my comment was that a good, experienced luthier will see the big picture, share that with you and let you make the best decision for you. My luthier is a very respectful, nice guy and he'd never make a change without asking first.

Thanks for bringing that to my attention.

I didn't mean to infer that your luthier does shoddy work. Just that a major change like that is not commonplace and should not be done prior to consulting with the client, which you made it sound like he did not do with you. If I missunderstood this, I apologize.

No worries. I got a little defensive. I'm tired. I know you are only being helpful. So I apologize. I wasn't clear in what I was trying to say.

FWIW, I understood totally your premise of what was done. For reasons stated in my posts, it just didn't make sense on a widely accepted scale. As a custom job, so be it.

This is a good point. And I've seen some factory basses this way. Pedulla usually does it the way you have stated with their lined fretless... but I've seen a factory done lined Pedulla that was done like my bass. So perhaps that was a special order.

I agree, it should be a personal preference. And for me it was without question the right choice. I don't have to think about where to place my fingers. I just do what I normally do and it sounds correct.