• TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
    Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
    Join free Log in
    Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.

Starting to play with other people

redramen

redramen

Apr 1, 2016
78
79
Earth
#1
So I tried to search for this topic, but I am not finding anything. So I'm sorry if I missed a thread with this question.

So I started playing bass last summer, but with two kids, I didn't get a lot of practice time in. I still consider myself a beginner. Actually, I sold my bass last winter since I needed the money, so I actually only had the bass for a few months. I was able to afford a bass about a couple weeks ago, so I started playing again. I have mostly been practicing at home by myself along with my drum machine / metronome.

I have a friend who plays guitar and wants me to hang out and play with him. And I am actually really nervous about this prospect. I am a beginner and never played with someone. And after I play with him, I don't want him to go, "Sheesh. that sucked. I never want to play with that guy again."

So my question is: how do I prepare, so that I can play with someone else without annoying them?

What do I practice? Should I talk to him about which songs we should place, and practice established songs? Do I just learn chords? Are there some simple grooves I should know? Should I just practice root notes? And what if he just wants to jam; how do I prepare for that?

Thanks in advance
 
#2
Just be honest about the stage that you're at. Anyone who isn't a complete jerk will be happy to have some fun jamming with a beginner and helping you learn the ropes. They probably won't invite you on a world tour or anything, but they're not going to bite your head off. Pick some simple songs that you are comfortable playing along to at home - three-chord blues jams, U2's With Or Without You, stuff like that. Stick to the roots and play simple and don't worry about doing anything fancy till you can feel it and know where you're going with it. You'll be fine.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Imaginary Pony, Jhengsman and nico485
#3
You'll be fine man. I routinely play with people much better than me, and though I can hold my own it does leave me feeling as though I'm boring them or something. It always feels to me that way, but I've asked one or two people about it and they had no problem with my playing whatsoever. And I know that if I played with someone with a lower skill level than me, I wouldn't mind. Jamming is all about having fun and good vibes, at least most of the time.
I would say that you guys planning a few songs to play ahead of time would be best, so that you can feel prepared when you guys meet up
 
  • Like
Reactions: nico485
#6
Id tell him I've only been playing for a few months, so don't expect anything too complicated. Anybody who would knock on you while you're honestly trying to learn, i would consider a jerk.

First dude I made music with was an acoustic guitarist ... I let him choose the songs, since he was also singing, while I simply banged out some roots :bassist: It was always great fun, and eventually we were near ready to take our versions of 3 songs to an open mic! Never did, but we occasionally still play together and have fun. You will learn a lot, and unless he's a jerk ... you'll have fun doing it :thumbsup:
 
  • Like
Reactions: Shortie and redramen
#8
redramen said:
..........So my question is: how do I prepare, so that I can play with someone else without annoying them? What do I practice? Should I talk to him about which songs we should place, and practice established songs? Do I just learn chords? Are there some simple grooves I should know? Should I just practice root notes? And what if he just wants to jam; how do I prepare for that? Thanks in advance
Click to expand...
Most people I know play from some kind of sheet music - unless they are jamming. More on jamming later.

So look up some sheet music and make copies of it. How? Let Google find sheet music for you. I should say this and get it on out in the open; chord charts or fake chord sheet music is what I, and I dare say, most others play from. This playing with others will take several steps, best to take baby steps right at first.

Google these key words --- Notes, Silent Night --- got this song in fake chord. Invalid Link Removed Print this off and hang on. Why did I pick Silent Night? Well it's a three chord song that repeats the same chord progression in every verse. Should be an easy song to start with and I bet you've heard the tune before.

What key is it in. Answer A. How did I know that? The fake chord had this information, but, here is a "rule of thumb" that has helped me. If the verses start and stop with the same chord that chord is the root - tonal center - of the song, thus the key. Yep you need to know the notes and or chords in all the scale/keys you will run up on. Here is something to help with that. Chords In The Key Of C

It is now you decide how you will play the song. I use the major scale box and Nashville numbers with everything I play. Yes for this to work you will have to get the major scale box under your fingers as everything else in this post is based on using the box.

So I'll explain how to play using the major scale box. That is not the only way, just what I settled into after several years of doing other things. If you can make the jump now, be my guest.

Major Scale Box.

G~~|---2---|-------|---3---|---4---| 1st string
D~~|---6---|-------|---7---|---8---|
A~~|---3---|---4---|-------|---5---|
E~~|-------|---R---|-------|---2---|4th string​

This song is in the key of A. The chords in the key of A are:
A, Bm, C#m, D, E, F#m, G#m7b5, A so the first thing I do is to transpose all the A, B, C's to 1, 2, 3's.

Chords in the key of A are; A, Bm, C#m, D, E, F#m, G#m7b5, A.
Nashville numbers will be;..1. 2.....3...... 4. 5. 6...... 7........... 8

I now take my fake chord sheet music with the A, B, C's and using a black marks-a-lot; all the A chords become 1 or R. All the Bm chords become 2, C#m chords become 3, etc. Why go to all that trouble? Well I use the major scale box as the Rosetta stone for everything I do and having my sheet music in 1, 2, 3's just helps. One other advantage of Nashville numbers; say the fat lady comes on stage and asks that the song she will sing be done in the key of Bb. Your sheet music is in the key of D. What to do? If you are in Nashville numbers your sheet music is in the key of 1 (yep one). Find the Bb note on the 4th string, put the box's R on that note and the scale/key of Bb await you. Piece of cake.

I've got the major scale box into muscle memory and can do it in my sleep, i.e. If I want the F major scale - put the box's R on the F at the 4th string 1st fret and the notes of the F major scale await you within the box. Piece of cake. If the song is in the key of A I put the box's R on the A note, 4th string 5th fret, and the notes and or chords in the key/scale of A await me.

Now you have your sheet music transposed to Nashville numbers. Call up a video of Silent Night and armed with your fake chord sheet music play-a-long with the video.
Yes the video may not be the same key the sheet music you have is in. Work around this, i.e. play what your sheet music has on it. If it's way off -- go to your keyboard and while listening to the song walk the C chromatic scale up the keyboard. When what you are doing sounds good with the video you've found the tonal center. Look down and see what note this happened on - that is your key. Move your box pattern over that note and away you go. If you do not have a keyboard, use your G string and walk that G string up the neck.

  • Listen first with the sheet music on your music stand and just get a feel for the song.
  • Notice it's in 3/4 time. The fake chord told you that, I mention it as you may have missed this. The fake chord also told you the song is in the key of A.
  • Next clap the 3/4 beat of the song. Yep gotta be able to identify the rhythm of the song. Will come with time, this version of the song has the uke's strum to help you with the beat. As the song brings a specific chord active, sound that chord's root note. Try and be dead on, not before, after, etc. dead on. As you listen to the video, notice how the lyric syllable seems to fall into time with the 3/4 beat. Two syllable words get two beats, three syllable words get three beats, and yes one syllable words get one beat. That is not carved in stone, just something that may help.
  • Change chords as they become active. Look ahead in the sheet music to see what chord is coming next - so when it's time for that chord you already know where you need to go. Try and keep up with the changes so the music does not go off and leave you -- will take some time.
  • Half way into the song there is an instrumental break. What do you do? Most times this break follows the chorus or verse chord progression. You can follow along like you did when the lyrics were being sung, or you can pedal a Root 1 or the 5. Keeping the beat and staying out of the way of the instrumental being played. I recommend you pedal the root 1 right at first. Especially if the solo is being improvised you have no idea where he is going. Keep the beat and stay out of his way by pedaling the root. Also helps if you lower your volume during a solo. Augment do not compete.

When you can do just roots to the beat we will get into the rest of what is needed to play with others. This should let you play with your friend.

I said I would get into jamming later. Best you see if you can play with sheet music first, we'll get into jamming several months from now. Jamming is doing all of the above with out sheet music...... you assume a lot when jamming....

Good luck and have fun.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Amplified, Imaginary Pony, tjh and 1 other person
#9
I'm an old guy who started playing late in life and I was 50 when I played bass with my first "band". I've come to realize that for the foreseeable future it's just a jam session, but we still take it seriously and aim to play the songs well.

The guys I'm playing with have all been playing for decades, many of those years together, and I was compeltely upfront when the drummer first contacted me. He didn't care as long as I thought I could learn the songs and I'd show up. I did both and after the first session they had no problem with me playing. It was also kind of cool that when we were tearing down the drummer finally told them I never played with a band before. They said they never would have guessed.

Over time I've learned a lot of songs I probably never would have bothered trying to learn, I've gotten better at learning songs on my own, I've gotten better at improvising to songs I don't know how to play, and, biggest surprise of all, I've gone from doing no vocals to doing some occasional backing vocals to doing an increasing share of lead vocals. I still suck and there are a lot of songs I've dumbed down for my level, but I've focused on playing the parts that are the most important and then just worry about holding it down the rest of the time and they've been happy. I've had a great learning experience and I'm guessing the OP will, too. Be upfront about your abilities and if the guy you're playing with understands that without becoming an ass about it, my guess is that you'll have a great experience. You'll learn a lot more a lot faster playing with others than you'll learn on your own. It's a lot more fun, too! :D

If you haven't learned some basic theory and tried putting it to use, start with that. Learn the notes of the scales, learn the pattern of the notes in major and minor scales, learn how to figure out what notes go into chords, and then start playing along to songs you know, to songs you hear on the radio, to commercials in TV shows, etc. Honestly, there's not much to the basics and, once you figure that out on your own, then playing with someone else will really help cement the concepts in your head so that you "feel' them rather than having to think consciously about them all the time. I'm still not at that point, but I am getting closer, and it's pretty amazing when you're playing and realize you're playing by "feel". I say just go for it. Even if it doesn't work out it will be a great experience and it will help you figure out what your strengths and weaknesses are so you can better focus on things to help you improve faster.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: LowFish and Oddly
#11
MalcolmAmos said:
Most people I know play from some kind of sheet music - unless they are jamming. More on jamming later.

So look up some sheet music and make copies of it. How? Let Google find sheet music for you. I should say this and get it on out in the open; chord charts or fake chord sheet music is what I, and I dare say, most others play from. This playing with others will take several steps, best to take baby steps right at first.

Google these key words --- Notes, Silent Night --- got this song in fake chord. Invalid Link Removed Print this off and hang on.

What key is it in. Answer A. How did I know that? If the verses start and stop with the same chord that chord is the root - tonal center - of the song, thus the key. Yep you need to know the notes and or chords in all the scale/keys you will run up on. Here is something to help with that. Chords In The Key Of C

It is now you decide how you will play the song. I use the major scale box and Nashville numbers with everything I play. So I'll explain how to do that way. That is not the only way, just what I settled into after several years of doing other things. If you can make the jump now, be my guest.

Major Scale Box.
Code: 
G~~|---2---|-------|---3---|---4---| 1st string
D~~|---6---|-------|---7---|---8---|
A~~|---3---|---4---|-------|---5---|
E~~|-------|---R---|-------|---2---|4th string

This song is in the key of A. The chords in the key of A are:
A, Bm, C#m, D, E, F#m, G#m7b5, A so the first thing I do is to transpose all the A, B, C's to 1, 2, 3's.

Chords in the key of A are; A, Bm, C#m, D, E, F#m, G#m7b5, A.
Nashville numbers will be;..1. 2.....3...... 4. 5. 6...... 7........... 8

I now take my fake chord sheet music with the A, B, C's and using a black marks-a-lot; all the A chords become 1 or R. All the Bm chords become 2, C#m chords become 3, etc. Why go to all that trouble? Well I use the major scale box as the Rosetta stone for everything I do and having my sheet music in 1, 2, 3's just helps. One other advantage of Nashville numbers; say the fat lady comes on stage and asks that the song she will sing be done in the key of Bb. Your sheet music is in the key of D. What to do? If you are in Nashville numbers your sheet music is in the key of 1 (yep one). Find the Bb note on the 4th string, put the box's R on that note and the scale/key of Bb await you. Piece of cake.

I've got the major scale box into muscle memory and can do it in my sleep, i.e. If I want the F major scale - put the box's R on the F at the 4th string 1st fret and the notes of the F major scale await you within the box. Piece of cake. If the song is in the key of A I put the box's R on the A note, 4th string 5th fret, and the notes and or chords in the key/scale of A await me.

Now you have your sheet music transposed to Nashville numbers. Call up a video of Silent Night and armed with your fake chord sheet music play-a-long with the video.
Yes the video may not be the same key the sheet music you have is in. Work around this, i.e. play what your sheet music has on it.

  • Listen first with the sheet music on your music stand and just get a feel for the song.
  • Notice it's in 3/4 time. The fake chord told you that, I mention it as you may have missed this. The fake chord also told you the song is in the key of A.
  • Next clap the 3/4 beat of the song. Yep gotta be able to identify the rhythm of the song. Will come with time, this version of the song has the uke's strum to help you with the beat. As the song brings a specific chord active, sound that chord's root note. Try and be dead on, not before, after, etc. dead on. As you listen to the video, notice how the lyric syllable seems to fall into time with the 3/4 beat. Two syllable words get two beats, three syllable words get three beats, and yes one syllable words get one beat. That is not carved in stone, just something that may help.
  • Change chords as they become active. Try and keep up with the changes so the music does not go off and leave you -- will take some time.
  • Half way into the song there is a instrumental break. What do you do? Most times this break follows the chorus or verse chord progression. You can follow along like you did when the lyrics were being sung, or you can pedal a Root 1 or the 5. Keeping the beat and staying out of the way of the instrumental being played. I recommend you pedal the root 1 right at first. Especially if the solo is being improvised you have no idea where he is going. Keep the beat and stay out of his way by pedaling the root.

When you can do just roots to the beat we will get into the rest of what is needed to play with others. This should let you play with your friend.

I said I would get into jamming later. Best you see if you can play with sheet music first, we'll get into jamming several months from now. Jamming is doing all of the above with out sheet music......

Good luck and have fun.
Click to expand...


That is such a great lesson! It totally makes sense to me. As I was reading what you wrote, things just started to click for me from all the reading online and the lessons I was learning from books. So thank you for your lesson!
 
  • Like
Reactions: nico485
#15
If the guitarist wants to jam out, suggest you do straight up 12-bar blues. If you're not too familiar, Google 12-bar blues bass and you'll find a bunch of simple lines you can play, mostly based on the chord tones. Once you get the feel for how these work, you can make up your own and go at it all day long with the guitarist.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Fred312b, LowFish and Mushroo
#16
INTP said:
When you get a list of songs, work on as simple version of the bass line as you need to. Keeping the groove will mean more than playing all the signature licks, or even playing the exact bass line.
Click to expand...
Yep, very true. Focus first on playing a solid foundation that is synched with the drummer and you'll be fine. Then, over time, you can work on the details as you get continue to improve. Although, I do think it's a good idea to get any signature lines/hooks as close as you can right away, since that will be noticed more easily.

When I first starting playing with my band I sort of "apologized" several times for simplifying lines just to make sure I could give them a solid bottom end to play over and each time they looked at me like I was crazy. They hadn't noticed. Plus, they all said they do the same thing at times and guess what. I never noticed.

Solid playing that fits the song and keeps driving it along will sound much better than always getting close and then always having to recover.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: redramen
#17
It is really exciting to play music with other people for the first time. Only advice I have is this: agree 2-3 easy songs to play together in advance, then practice these songs until you are confident. On the day, just do exactly the same things that you would at home, use the same posture / position, breathe deeply, try to relax and try not rush your notes.

Have fun, and don't feel self-conscious about your abilities. There's a better than 99% chance that there will always be people better and worse than you! If you are honest, modest and respectful, then others should reciprocate.
 
  • Like
Reactions: redramen
#18
I'm in a similar boat: late 30's, two kids, demanding job, trying to take up the bass later in life and just starting to play with other people.

I would reiterate what others have said: agree on a few songs in advance and practice the hell out of them. Then, on jam day (unless you abstain), drink one beer, relax, and just let your hands go.

I've been trying to learn as many easy songs as possible while fighting with one or two challenging pieces over the longer term. Take a look through this guy's videos and find tunes you recognize. He makes it super easy. You could even have your buddy pick songs for your from that list.
 
  • Like
Reactions: LarryBama and redramen
#20
.. first and foremost, have fun, work hard, have more fun, don't get frustrated ... while you are having fun ;)

... learn the fretboard as well as you possibly can, especially on your E and A string ... associating root note position with the chords the guitar player is playing is extremely beneficial at any stage of your progression ... if they are playing bar chords it can be a lot easier ...

Major KUDOS to Mr Malcolm Amos, he is always so patient and takes a great deal of time assisting folk with questions such as this ... good job!!

BTW, OP ... remember to have fun!!
 
  • Like
Reactions: redramen

Latest posts

Top Bottom
Back