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Stoner/Doom Bassists Thread, Part 90: Maxed Out

Wrote a song for a solo acoustic project Im starting called TheGreatWhiteNorth...getting paid to write it because Im working at good ol BP. Lots of different reactions from customers when they see the attendant (me) playing guitar in the booth.
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Gave it a quick record to remember it...

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When I get outa here Im going celebrating st pattys with a bar crawl...but Im highly against green beer so none of that will be ingested. The green I will be ingesting today is of the herbal kind.
 
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I read that bogeybass thread. Man what a sad ending even with a spoiler alert.

He mentioned a limiting factor of low end response was the depth of the cab. That's why I had to chose the dually over the f215. I couldnt fit the f215 in my car. Now I have zero issues with either the dually or bassic, but I still want to try a really deep cab.

Could I make a 1x10 or 1x12 that's super deep and not too tall or wide to fit in my car and get great low end response (maybe not at crazy volumes)? Basically like a bass cannon
 
I read that bogeybass thread. Man what a sad ending even with a spoiler alert.

He mentioned a limiting factor of low end response was the depth of the cab. That's why I had to chose the dually over the f215. I couldnt fit the f215 in my car. Now I have zero issues with either the dually or bassic, but I still want to try a really deep cab.

Could I make a 1x10 or 1x12 that's super deep and not too tall or wide to fit in my car and get great low end response (maybe not at crazy volumes)?
Yeah that Bogeybass thread kills me
 
Then there the old TL606 plans. They get brought up on TB allot and I wish they'd go away. They are designed for 3/4" plywood and braced wrong for a speaker cabinet. Lots of commercial cabinets have used them and been successful. They don't sound bad just designed outdated construction techniques. They are suitable for a wide variety of drivers with various tuning options. If someone(me) would just do the math to convert to 1/2" and fix the bracing I'll stop hating them.

I have actually done the conversion to 1/2", added bracing, and drawn it all up in Sketchup. Oh and I calculated the shelf lengths to tune for 3015, 15PR400, 1505's, and 1502... Did the same for the TL806, doubling both up for 212/215.
 
Like @CL400Peavey says Greenboy only gives out plans for the '66 as far as 2x15s go.

(I wonder if in retrospect he would have rather given away a different line of plans instead of the Fearful. None of his other designs match its performance. Its like Ford/Shelby giving away plans for their Mustang Cobra but only selling their stupid V6 mustang at the dealership.)

There are several members here who've documented builds they've done. No one has built them so who's to say which one is better?

JohnK did this one.
It gets lots of love and even greenboy commented it might sound similar. It's performance especially at the limits will be much different, due to the smaller port area. There is some extensive routing in this design but it's bracing seems OK.

Bogeybass f'd this one up, but the design wasn't bad. He just cratered at a very crucial point. I really would have liked to have seen this done right. He brings up some neat ideas about cone rocking and actual cabinet volume vs damped volume.

Then there is the new BFM (herpes) Simplexx 115, which any idiot could make into a 215. Bill doesn't generally like low tunings so there might not be much low frequency extension. If you bought the plans (I got them) it shouldn't be too difficult to modify them for tuning(i might). His bracing scheme is unmatched, there are lots of cuts other than 90°. So it isn't a simple as some others.

He also has his Jack series, which again doesn't have a 215 version. Yet again I think wouldn't be too hard to cook one up. Especially if you got the Jack 212 plans with it, you could borrow ideas from each other. This design is more sensitive than all the others, owing to horn loading. But again the tuning might be too high for some. Also its sensitivity is in the midrange so it gets called "honky" sounding. Lots and lots and lots of weird cuts not at 90°. If your an OK woodworker before trying this you'll be much more skilled after. The plans do have neat jigs and stuff to help with the odd cuts.

Then there the old TL606 plans. They get brought up on TB allot and I wish they'd go away. They are designed for 3/4" plywood and braced wrong for a speaker cabinet. Lots of commercial cabinets have used them and been successful. They don't sound bad just designed outdated construction techniques. They are suitable for a wide variety of drivers with various tuning options. If someone(me) would just do the math to convert to 1/2" and fix the bracing I'll stop hating them.

There are some other members who've done 2x15s but it's early and I'm trying to give platelets.

Goddammit I need to be building something.

Dude, this is awesome! Thanks a ton! Exactly what I was looking for. Sounds like you've got some legit research into this area. In your opinion, what's the best way to go? I actually bought the Simplexx plans from BFM a while back, my guitarist is going to do the 412, but we're going to re-jigger to make the cab not slanted.

I have actually done the conversion to 1/2", added bracing, and drawn it all up in Sketchup. Oh and I calculated the shelf lengths to tune for 3015, 15PR400, 1505's, and 1502... Did the same for the TL806, doubling both up for 212/215.

Ooooh, yes, would also love plans! Is the move to 1/2" just for weight or? Seems 3/4" would be stiffer. Edjumakate me!
 
Dude, this is awesome! Thanks a ton! Exactly what I was looking for. Sounds like you've got some legit research into this area. In your opinion, what's the best way to go? I actually bought the Simplexx plans from BFM a while back, my guitarist is going to do the 412, but we're going to re-jigger to make the cab not slanted.

Hard to say, what are your tone goals?
Knowing you've got the model j's and like them I assume you like robust mids and ample bottom?
At doom volume I assume?
Build a '66, get a robust EQ, done.
Otherwise if you want something more traditional...
Assuming you use the same speaker in all of them (kappalite 3015) they will sound nearly the same through the mids. With the exception of the Jack which the horn overhypes.
The major difference will be the low end output and feel. Another difference will be power handling. I haven't run the simulations so I don't know the specifics there. Sorry.
I would honestly choose the one you feel you could easiest modify the tuning to your liking. Especially if your trying to approximate a Dually.
Bogeybass215 with precision ports tuned by hand then stuffed is what I'd consider easiest.
The Simplexx is braced the best, but unsuited for flexible tuning.
The Jack really can't be simulated with a bass reflex program (need something to calculate the horn)so changing its tuning is a crapshoot.
I would avoid JohnK's if you think you might run near its limits.

Ooooh, yes, would also love plans! Is the move to 1/2" just for weight or? Seems 3/4" would be stiffer. Edjumakate me!
3/4 is much stiffer than 1/2. But it's also much heavier, pointlessly so. It also costs anywhere from 10%-30% more. With modern glues and even a little bracing properly placed 1/2 is undeniably superior. That extra 1/4 doesn't make the surface much stronger either.
 
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Post mutherfvker post. Link? I would love something to point folks to.

I will have to see if I can find them. I actually was considering writing an article about it for bass gear mag.

Tuned for want frequency, 40?

For those drivers, no that is way too low. More like 50-60hz. If you want something down in the 40's you are better served by the fEARful cabs.


Ooooh, yes, would also love plans! Is the move to 1/2" just for weight or? Seems 3/4" would be stiffer. Edjumakate me!

There is no reason to build in 3/4". 1/2" with bracing is lighter, stronger, and cheaper.
 
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Hard to say, what are your tone goals?
Knowing you've got the model j's and like them I assume you like robust mids and ample bottom?
At doom volume I assume?
Build a '66, get a robust EQ, done.
Otherwise if you want something more traditional...
Assuming you use the same speaker in all of them (kappalite 3015) they will sound nearly the same through the mids. With the exception of the Jack which the horn overhypes.
The major difference will be the low end output and feel. Another difference will be power handling. I haven't run the simulations so I don't know the specifics there. Sorry.
I would honestly choose the one you feel you could easiest modify the tuning to your liking. Especially if your trying to approximate a Dually.
Bogeybass215 with precision ports tuned by hand then stuffed is what I'd consider easiest.

You pretty much hit in on the head. Love strong mids, with a robust low end. We play in A or B standard, so extended low end would be smart. We definitely play at "doom levels" as well.

I'm currently building a ~450+W tube bass amp that will be used with the cab. My current cab is a Fender/Sunn era Bassman 215 with Eminence Legend CB158's. I also have a GenzBenz 410T-XB with Emi Legend BP102's, but I'm selling it likely.

So you'd recommend the BogeyBass 215 over the '66? As far as tuning goes, what is my target relative to my tuning? Do I shoot for the freq of my lowest note or higher/lower? When selecting drivers for my Bassman215, I found via WinISD that the current CB158's would be pretty decent to like 40ish Hz if I lengthened the slot port a couple inches. I haven't gotten to that yet, but I think an all round more engineered cab is needed for this wicked amp I've got in the works. I'm sure 3015's in an engineered cab would slaughter my current mutt cab.

Thanks for the help!

Edit: If the '66 indeed is the 2x15+2x6", I don't think I want to go that route. I really would like to stick with the traditional 2x15 layout. Maybe that means the BogeyBass design is for me?
 
I'm asking about the TL606 plans you converted to 1/2". What would you target as optional?

Edit: Never mind. Just looked at this TL606... Nope.

What is turning you off on the TL606?

You pretty much hit in on the head. Love strong mids, with a robust low end. We play in A or B standard, so extended low end would be smart. We definitely play at "doom levels" as well.

Take the frequency of your lowest note, and double it. For A or B tuning 50-65hz is great.


I'm currently building a ~450+W tube bass amp that will be used with the cab.

Build it with a 2 Ohm tap so you can run four 3015's.

So you'd recommend the BogeyBass 215 over the '66? As far as tuning goes, what is my target relative to my tuning? Do I shoot for the freq of my lowest note or higher/lower?

A or B isnt really deep, A fEARful will get you more low end, but a 215 using 3015's is probably more what you are looking for.
 
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Take the frequency of your lowest note, and double it. For A or B tuning 50-65hz is great.
Build it with a 2 Ohm tap so you can run four 3015's.
A or B isnt really deep, A fEARful will get you more low end, but a 215 using 3015's is probably more what you are looking for.

Right on. I agree about the 3015's. Just plugged the 3015's into WinISD. Threw in the Dually's volume (12096 square inches), 4x4" (larger?) ports. Tuning of 55hz. It's giving me a vent length of .08". That can't be right, must have screwed something up...

2ohm tap would be sick, but I've already got the OT, a slick Mercury unit, weighs a veritable poopon. It's amazingly ginormous. It has 4/8/16 though. I could wire each cab to 16ohm, and run them parallel on the 8ohm tap though.
 
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Right on. I agree about the 3015's. Just plugged the 3015's into WinISD. Threw in the Dually's volume (12096 square inches), 4x4" (larger?) ports. Tuning of 55hz. It's giving me a vent length of .08". That can't be right, must have screwed something up...

2ohm tap would be sick, but I've already got the OT, a slick Mercury unit, weighs a veritable poopon. It's amazingly ginormous. It has 4/8/16 though. I could wire each cab to 16ohm, and run them parallel on the 8ohm tap though.

You have to put in the internal volume, and account for any volume lost from bracing, the ports, drivers, and handles.