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Stoner/Doom Bassists Thread, Part 90: Maxed Out
- Thread starter Korladis
- Start date
I've never heard a show so loud that I checked more than once to make sure I still had earplugs in.
As a newcomer to playing bass I'm still learning the most basic stuff, so thinking a lot about trying to achieve any specific tone feels like it will come later on down the road. That said, I'm curious about what the characteristics are of a standard bass sound in doom (I'm sure there's a lot of variation though). I'm assuming it's usually tuned lower than the standard EADG, and some amount of fuzz seems pretty common. For those of you with more experience, what would you say characterizes doom bass? And what are some of the outliers that defy the norm?
I'm not saying I want to go for just some standard sound ultimately. I don't even know what sound I'd want to go for in the long run...for now I'm more concerned about learning to play at a level slightly above "embarrassment."
I'm not saying I want to go for just some standard sound ultimately. I don't even know what sound I'd want to go for in the long run...for now I'm more concerned about learning to play at a level slightly above "embarrassment."
I think the attack, right-hand technique, and pedals vary things within the genre quite a bit. i.e. pick vs finger, bass/pickup config, where you play between the bridge and neck (see Al Cicneros), etc. Having said that, don't skimp on lows/low-mids, and incorporate some amount of tube drive or tube-emulation at least. When I think "clean" bass in doom, I still am thinking mild/moderate tube breakup/warmth as a starting point.
I think what direction you go will depend on your band's instrumentation, and what suits your style of playing/writing basslines. I would also listen to some stuff that has influenced you or that you emulate, and hone in on what that bass player has going on tonally. As an example, I think a lot of guys in metal (more broadly, not just doom) use and like the sound of a pick. I dig the attack of a pick, but a couple of my favorite players are almost 100% finger-style, and that sounds fuller and more supportive to my ears. (Aaron from YOB and Troy from Mastodon for example.) If you lean toward a specific style you prefer with the plucking hand, I think that will inform the direction you go with dirt pedals, dialing in your amp's EQ, and what type of effects you may want to use.
I'd say overdrive or fuzz you like. Theres not really a standard doom bass tone in my mind at least. My band plays in C standard - C-F-A#-D# (ala Sleep). A lot of bands play in B [aka BEAD tuning on a 4 string] or lower. Hell, Conan plays in F (as in almost a whole octave lower than standard. I have found that more mids/treble than youd think youd use help fuzz or overdrive bass tones tremendously.
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There's quite a bit of variation but it does seem like most bands are tuned to B or D. Also like the other guy said lots of lows/low mids and heavy distortion in parts. I'd say doom/sludge tends to very rarely run purely clean unless you're going for a vintage sound. It does seem like everyone in this thread owns a civil war or russian muff variant of some sort.
Also a lot of the lines seem to be constructed around playing with the tension of root b7 octave. Like if you actually break down a lot of what Al Cisernos is doing in say Om a large amount of the lines are constructed around that. Also doom tends to focus on groove and a blues triplet feel more then most other heavy music styles.
Like if you're really new and trying to come up with your own stuff in a band context none of what I'm about to say is really hardcore theory but you mind find it useful if you're really new in coming up with lines. I'd probably stick to blues scale and just remember that if you stick to the 1 5th of the chord you aren't changing the tonality at all. So when you start playing the other scale tones you're basically adding "color" to the section which can have a major or minor feel depending on what you want. When you play with the intervals of roots/5ths/octaves on the beats you want to emphasize as feeling like driving the rhythm. The color tones when used on a beat you want to emphasize will basically overemphasize that beat as well as the harmony. Like if you don't know what to play under something a drummer is playing try something like this, play the low root on the kick drum and throw 5ths and octaves on the snare and pulse that for a bit until you have a good grasp of the rhythm then just keep shaging around adding the color notes until something sounds cool. Remember bass literally bridges harmony and rhythm and to some extent controls how both of those aspects of music are perceived by the audience.
And since whenever you post any advice people sometimes check your signature to check your credibility this old now dead band I was in has by far my best playing that's recorded lol Oceans of Titan, by Oceans of Titan stoner/psych rock/metal with an excellent keyboard player. The recordings were finally posted last week so even though that project has been dead for 4 years I'm actually weirdly excited about people hearing it.
Happy 420 everybody!
+1 to the clean having some grit or at least some warmth. Flat out clean can work as an effect itself too, almost like how varying dirt or color can.
I messed around with the concept of 'underdrive' and like it a lot for some things. Especially ambient sections.
What @br1qbat said about highs, etc. is crucial. Even though heavy is the goal, in the mix it's tough for your attack to cut through if you don't take advantage of the mids and high mids. The low end will be there, but since the guitars are tuned lower and many of them push their low end too, the low freqs are pretty busy between drums, guitar, and you.
I messed around with the concept of 'underdrive' and like it a lot for some things. Especially ambient sections.
What @br1qbat said about highs, etc. is crucial. Even though heavy is the goal, in the mix it's tough for your attack to cut through if you don't take advantage of the mids and high mids. The low end will be there, but since the guitars are tuned lower and many of them push their low end too, the low freqs are pretty busy between drums, guitar, and you.
I recorded the Sunn show on my phone. Amazingly, it turned out great. Especially since I was about 10 people deep from the stage. I emailed Sunn and they wanted me to send it to them as they have a bootleg/fan recording bandcamp page. Hopefully it gets posted soon. Cool fan/nerd moment for me. Lol
I can't afford it, when's the alibaba version gonna get released?
Now with twice the annoying pickup covers! Glad they updated the bridge though.
He doesn't play in the "proper" place so I guess it doesn't matter to him. I'm not in love with the design, but I'd be curious to know how much it costs.
I have always wondered what's the point of those covers.
Knowing Ric, they will make 150 of them and charge 2×-3× what a 4003 costs.
I dig it as a signature model. Has something not available on the stock offerings & still obvious what it is. Don't want one, either.
Amen. I dig their bridge asthetic, but not sure on the adjustment. I admit I'm kinda set and forget type so may not be a problem for me. Been told by many that they're stable, just not built for the tinkerer.
One day I'll set aside the cash for a 4003s
