I think he meant he didn't dig the vocals, not that he'd prefer instrumentals.
Fu Manchu is another I'd like a helluva lot better with a different vocalist
Enjoy the benefits of a premium membership!
Upgrade Account
-
TalkBass has been independent since 1998. Add your voice.
Create a free account to reply to discussions, view embedded media, and browse with fewer display ads.
Join free Log in
Want zero display ads or expanded classifieds tools? Compare plans.
Stoner/Doom Bassists Thread, Part 90: Maxed Out
- Thread starter Korladis
- Start date
Fu Manchu is another I'd like a helluva lot better with a different vocalist
I broke down and ordered the DOD Rubberneck. They are on sale for $119 at Pro Star Audio. I’m excited about working the weird oscillation feature into some songs.
You are correct on the first part. Oddly enough, I'm listening to Fu Manchu right now and I love their vocals. They feel like they fit the vibe of fuzz/stoner/California really well.
With Kyuss, I feel like the vocals clash with the style of music. John Garcia's vocals often remind me of popping into a local bar and hearing a bad cover band ape Metallica tunes. (In this case, the band is great and the vocalist is off in another realm...)
Last edited:
Received mine a few days ago, but with a toddler in the house, haven’t even been able to open the box. Let me know how’s it sounds! At this rate, you’ll get to it before I do.
In other sonic pursuits, what are your thoughts on envelope filters? I always love how they sound, but can’t quite find “the one”. I’ve had a decent number, and so far I think the best is the MXR BEF. I loved the Proton for a while, but just thought it sounded too syrupy lately and went back to the BEF. I love that it responds to all of my bass effects well (and clean playing too) which almost no other filter does. My criteria for a good filter is basically that it doesn’t cut volume or lows, isn’t harsh in the sweep (either low end or high end), and will be able to cut in a mix. Bonus if it can make me sound like Geezer...
Here’s what I’be tried and my thoughts:
MXR BEF - best all around. Can do quacky, syrupy, high pitch low pitch, all of it well. I think the blend is great for this pedal. Can work with all of my dirt on the same settings.
Proton - been too dark lately, even making the tone and peak higher didn’t work. Also has a weird background hiss that bothers me, but isn’t terrible. Great sounds in it, but tough to tweak and requires tweaking to get it to soon d good with different effects/dirt.
DOD 440 - Great tone on the filter itself, but sucks out the bottom and seems to lose volume. Great for my guitar rig, passable for my cheap, bass practice rig. Love DOD, but don’t get the love for this on bass. Probably amazing with a clean blend or getting a suped up one (do those exist?).
DOD FX25 - Could be great, but fiddly like the Proton. When it worked it was fantastic, but was more of a pain than not.
DOD FX25B - My preferred guitar filter, though I’ve had them modified to be able to adjust intensity of the effect. The tone is amazing on bass, and is currently #2 behind the MXR, but it has an extreme sweep and at high-ish volumes those extreme highs and lows sound terrible - either squealing or flubbing out (I don’t know how to describe it, but not good).
SA BEF - Great Filter, but almost too many options. Used it to get an idea for the types of filters I liked, then sought out those kinds. Don’t remember which ones I liked now!
So, school me on the MXR BEF and other similar filters. What meets the criteria I’ve got? I’d prefer something used and relatively affordable, as this is not a staple of my board, but a fun effect. Thanks all!
Iron Ether Xerograph Deluxe is an excellent sounding envelope filter. Easy to set up, too.
Cool! It's a great delay at a great price! The sidechain is really neat too, though I've abandoned using it because it was a tad too gimmicky. Never had much luck getting my EHX Cathedral to work, it always felt like it turned out either too cold or too dull. The only setting I felt I got any good tones out of was the Delay, so I looked into getting a proper delay. The Rubberneck works amazingly!
I think Kyuss is a kind of band that will never really be again. It took a very specific set of people at just the right time. At its heart it was Bjork's amazingly groovy drumming and chill style of composing combined with Homme's very peculiar style of guitar, amazing timbre, and more straightforward rock approach to composition. Garcia complemented this perfectly as he could deliver grittier vocals without turning them flat out harsh, while also handling the softer songs without turning them into ballads. This kind of collision of musicians with different styles and influences is really what makes brilliant music in my opinion and it's not often that you see it happen. Like, you can have a bunch of guys inspired by Sabbath and they can put out some great tunes but in the end they'll just be an imitation of Sabbath. Sabbath themselves, on the other hand, was the culmination of a multitude of different influences and styles.
I have used the MF-101 and it works great. Buttery smooth, easy to use, and has great options ranging from pretty much zero to max when it comes to responsiveness, frequency, and resonance. A bit large and non-standard power (center positive), though. It didn't really fit my style so it's shelved for now, but it did do what it does perfectly and I don't see any reason I'd go for anything else if I did want to score some 70's erotic films. Anyhow, the pedal probably is or is becoming expensive since it was discontinued a while back. It was already on the higher end of the cost spectrum when it was being produced.
For stoner/doom stuff I honestly think I like the manual sweep of a wah more. I have a solid filter collection, because it’s my favorite effect. Right now Wonderlove v1, Xerograph Deluxe, Microtron iii, Moog MF-101, Source Audio C4, and a Dunlop Bass Wah Mini. Of those I think the Microtron is easiest to dial in, and the C4 is most versatile, XD and Moog for manual sweeps, and Wonderlove for flexible, fat filter sounds. The Microtron cuts well, is easy to adjust, and can be boosted/adjusted for overall volume. If you like the BEF, you’ll probably dig it - but they aren’t cheap. Also, XD does solid auto-filter sounds, but excels at manual sweeps. That said, it's more suited to synthy sounds because the filter range can be enormous if you want it. That said, don't expect to get a bass wah sound out of it. I find it's not a substitute for the dunlop sound if that's what I want...
Last edited:
I agree with the manual sweep, but after trying one a few years ago, I found I’m not coordinated enough to use one! Not worth me falling and demolishing my basses for the effect...
That's gotta be a practice thing
I dunno. I'm pretty terrible with wah's too/vol pedals too. Any more than one or two footswitches makes stuff too
complicated, lol
you guys should check out the new Dr. Scientist Dusk filter. LFO for the win, along with your typical envelope. I have one on the way.
C'mon, man - I didn't need to know about this right now...
It's hit or miss for me with Garcia's vocals. Some days I dig em sometimes just meh.
Fu Manchu on the other hand I really dig the vocals for some reason, they are a big different. Almost like a stoner version of Cake.
That must've been sick! I passed the last two times he came through for some reason, kicking myself now as I doubt he'll come through again. I read his biography, real inspiration for me.
Great deal! I have a feeling you'll dig it. Amazing delay and tons of fun. Easy to get something simple and quick to your liking, but can also pull out some wild sounds.
The rubberneck and osc. Can be done simultaneously or engaged and disengaged while the other is held. Creates some crazy effects.
@themarshall rust or gold rush are possibly my favs. When his amp sounds like it's going to rip itself apart is just so damn good!
Fu Manchu on the other hand I really dig the vocals for some reason, they are a big different. Almost like a stoner version of Cake.
That must've been sick! I passed the last two times he came through for some reason, kicking myself now as I doubt he'll come through again. I read his biography, real inspiration for me.
& @kleinenenten
Great deal! I have a feeling you'll dig it. Amazing delay and tons of fun. Easy to get something simple and quick to your liking, but can also pull out some wild sounds.
The rubberneck and osc. Can be done simultaneously or engaged and disengaged while the other is held. Creates some crazy effects.
@themarshall rust or gold rush are possibly my favs. When his amp sounds like it's going to rip itself apart is just so damn good!
Last edited:
I want to try a lot of Dr. Scientist pedals. Something about the approach is magnetic to me. The bitquest looks rad.
I can't remember which filters I use on the ms60b but there's 2 that are badass and I use a lot for jams. I think ones a qtron clone.
I can't remember which filters I use on the ms60b but there's 2 that are badass and I use a lot for jams. I think ones a qtron clone.
I get that it was a particular thing in time that was unlike most/all other stuff in that realm. That said, I don't always take unique to mean 'good'. I could throw cookie-monster vocals over JB's bass/drum grooves, and pepper in some church organs. That's unique, but it's not going to sound cohesive or stylistically gelled, if that makes sense?
And I'm certainly not knocking Kyuss as a whole - I listen to their stuff, and thoroughly enjoy lots of it. I also respect what they sparked to come after. That said, having a different vocal styling could've kept them just as unique/cutting edge without clashing. I really feel like a fair number of Garcia's vocal approaches jar me out of the listening experience, that was otherwise cohesive and unique from an instrumental standpoint. YMMV, IMO, Blah Blah Blah...
Yep. This is something that I think is often understated in how hard it is to get good vocals, like I can scream and growl but it doesn't fit with a lot of our music and I can't sing for s!ht... and our vocalist tends to get this danzig sort of vibe and that doesn't fit super well either, but getting him to back off from the edge with that and me doing more ambiance vocals/high harmonies tends to work a lot better.
It takes a ton to check the ego and make stuff that sounds good together...
That last line is a good way to put it in perspective. I think that's where I struggle with some of the Kyuss stuff - in that some of it sounds like the band is all working together, while Garcia's vocals are working against them.
I put a down payment on this today, I just couldn’t help myself
There are a couple more build slots open if anybody else’s ear gets piqued
I like Garcia's vocals for the most part. I can't really think of Kyuss without them, I guess... like I cant separate the two. When they "reformed" without Josh a decade ago as Kyuss Lives, John delivered a great live performance. FWIW.
