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Stoner/Doom Bassists Thread, Part 90: Maxed Out

I have a new bass on the way.

Guild Starefire ii (Flamed Maple)
Starfire Bass II Flamed Maple | Guild Guitars

And of course a new bass needs a new amp, so I've got a Garnet/Universal D100BT on the way as well.

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oh and i've got some tapes and flats on the way for the Starfire. :D
What power tubes does that take, and what tonal differences are there between those and Traynor? I have a couple of Bassmasters and a YSR-2 that I use for guitar.
 
What power tubes does that take, and what tonal differences are there between those and Traynor? I have a couple of Bassmasters and a YSR-2 that I use for guitar.

2 x 6L6. its been a while since i've played a vintage traynor. the most obvious thing was that the Garnet stays very clean. But the volume is hard to manage, it goes from quiet to full blast in the first quarter turn of the volume knob. Going to experiment with some different pots for.
 
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Hell yeah, how was it? Agreed that the new record is effing great

Great show. Packed house and the woman who runs sound at the Hi-Dive in Denver is top notch.

The thing I love about the band is that they have raw, loud, rip-your-head-off energy, but everything is tight and grooves. They sounded fantastic IMO. I wear foams to any/all shows, so I understand high end is more muted than lows for me. That said, the bass was by far the loudest in the mix of the three instruments. It seems like they intentionally tuck the guitar into the mix a bit more to let bass carry a lot of the lows/mids and to give the vocals plenty of room on top. Super powerful, super energetic, and I would definitely recommend catching a show this tour if you can...

Also, they're playing a good mix of stuff. Multiple tracks from Ruiner, Clean, and 1-2 from Gold, in addition to new stuff from War.
 
It's here! I don't understand how Guild ahips these things with roundwound strings. Still waiting for the strings to arrive, it could be a a few more weeks before I really get to hear what it sounds like.

string spacing will take some getting used to and the neck is chunkier than i expected but overall it feels quite good. may sand down the back of the neck as tbe finish is a bit too thick.

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Nice, the only muff types you haven't tried yet are triangle and Elk, right? Though I think those are much the same. Always good to read your comparison breakdowns.

Well, then, have I got something for you... (And it's nice to know someone enjoy my Muff ramblings!) And yes, you are correct that I haven't tried the Triangle or Elk (of any maker), and if we're talking specifically CMC I also haven't tried the Ram's Head (though I LOVE the Pharaoh Supreme, which is supposedly a Ram's Head derivative, hence why I NEED to try the CMC Ram's Head). However, I did recently order the Elk and Ram's Head from CMC, and in that conversation he mentioned that the Elk and Triangle had minor differences. I'm sure I'll be posting my thoughts on those when they arrive in a month or so hopefully...

Before I get too far - this is a GUITAR comparison. Feel free to skip the rest of this post if you're not interested.

Today was the shootout, as mentioned yesterday. My Muff contenders were a Swollen Pickle, Pharaoh Supreme (clone), Supercollider '71, CMC Civil War, and a Widogast (Dunwich Wizard clone).

I'll preface by saying that I have played an actual Pharaoh Supreme (and currently still own two of them!), but found during a previous shootout that I actually prefer the clone on guitar and the original on bass. Not really sure why, but I'm thinking the clone has something slightly off, as the Pre-Gain knob functions backwards from the original - i.e. clockwise gives you less gain instead of more gain. I also found it slightly brighter and gainier overall, which could 100% happen with any identical pedal due to parts tolerances. Additionally, I did the shootout with ALL of the pedals at volume on my "big guitar rig" (Peavey Transtube Supreme with matching 412 cab) before keeping #1 on that rig and shooting out the rest on my "small guitar rig" (Peavey Transtube Bandit and matching 112 extension cab). So I didn't have quite as many options on my second rig.

Another note - I seem to like low-ish gain Muffs on bass, and higher gain Muffs on guitar, as well as really needing chord and single note clarity on guitar. Not sure why, but that seems to be pretty consistent overall. Anyway, on to the results. I've got them ranked here in order.

#1 - CMC Civil War - This had an excellent mix of high gain cut and enough lows to balance it all out. It just works, and it is incredibly easy to dial in, like every CMC Muff I've had so far. It has the least of amount of lows of the CMC Muffs (though doesn't appear to cut lows as much as not distort them on bass), so as much as I liked it on bass, I think it is better suited for guitar use. I was able to play my (butchered) chords and some basic arpeggio-like stuff over a sustained note and each note rang out clearly, but also had plenty of body in the tone overall. It wasn't thin or nasally to get the clarity and note separation that I have seen and heard elsewhere. There was enough grit on the lows (though not a TON) to know you were playing a fuzz, and the highs were smooth and clear. (Perhaps I've finally gotten "violin-like" sustain from a fuzz? I've never really understood that term, but the highs were definitely distorted, but not gritty like the lows. They seemed to be a single, cutting note and not two tones on top of each other like we hear in bass discussions.) Anyway, the CMC absolutely killed it in every way for what I wanted. I'm glad that it turned out the way it did, because I've been waiting MONTHS for my amps to come back to test this hypothesis, as that's the feeling I got when I tried this pedal on bass a few months ago. (And I can thank this pedal for my recent love of CMC Effects pedals, too!) My preferred settings were LED diodes (though I prefer silicon for bass), Sustain about 1:30, Tone at noon, and Shape (aka Mids) at max.

#2 (tied) - Widogast (Dunwich Wizard Clone) - I've never played an actual Wizard, and can't justify the going rate, so I figured this was my best option when I saw it. It's incredibly gainy, as it's supposed to be, and I could hardly go past 10:30 on gain. In fact, a majority of the time, I was at 9:00 or lower on gain, with highs around 10:30, and lows from 1:30 to 3:00. The Input Cap selector has a huge impact on the amount of lows in the circuit, but there are always plenty of highs. I found that I could get incredibly similar tones to the CMC Civil War, but that the gain sacrificed a little clarity and note separation, with the extra harmonics sort of bleeding into each other. Now, I'm not saying the notes were indistinct - but they weren't quite as clear and the overall tone wasn't quite as round and full as the Civil War. If you want incredibly high gain Muff tones, this would be the clear winner for me. I found that even though I could get excellent tones, I was seemingly fighting the circuit trying to tame it for my needs. This wants to be incredibly high gain, and though I like higher gain Muffs on guitar over bass, I don't need THIS high of gain. So while it was a great pedal, and one that I'm holding on to for now, it's not quite as good for my uses as the Civil War. For better or worse, it reminded me of High On Fire guitar tones, and while I love those tones, it's not what I'm going for.

#2 (tied) - Swollen Pickle - Let's be honest, if you've followed ANY of my Muff ramblings, you knew this was going to be relatively high on the list. Again, this does not disappoint, but I did find this to be better on my "small rig" over my "big rig". It didn't do much for me on my "big rig" the first go around today, but that's not to say I couldn't get it to work (I probably could!) as it's so flexible. I'll say this, though - the internal trims on this make a HUGE difference on guitar - possibly even more so than on bass. I currently have 3 of these, because they almost always end up being just as good as my #1 choices, but in slightly different ways, and for the price, I'd say this is the absolute best all-around Muff money can buy. One is a dedicated "Bass Pickle", a second is my "Guitar Pickle", and the third is one that I just mess with to compare tones and knobs so I don't have to remember what tones I liked originally! Anyway, internal knobs. Clip was a big change for me. On bass, I actually prefer both internal knobs maxed. On guitar, I actually like quite a few settings, but for the tones mentioned earlier, I preferred Clip at 9:00. Voice remained maxed. Scoop is maxed, Crunch is at 10:30, Sustain is at 1:30, and Filter is just a hair past noon. Plenty of sustain, great note articulation, full body, and wooly enough to know it's a Muff. This ended up being the winner for my "small rig" mostly due to what I disliked about the Widogast. The Pickle had none of that, but does take a while to dial in. The Pickle, however, could also do plenty of other tones. At one point I have had this sounding nearly identical to my FatMetal, various other Muffs, the Fat Sandwich, and even something similar to an HM-2. If you adjust the Clip knob, it really opens up the versatility on this pedal for guitar, and I actually think that the stock settings are better on bass than guitar. But if you want heavy distortion, crank that clip knob - at least to noon!

#3 - Supercollider '71 - This one just didn't do much for me. It was gainy enough, and had articulation, but not quite the full body I could get from others. I didn't play with it much, because it just wasn't working for me today. I could get similar tones to the Civil War, but they sounded anemic in comparison and almost brittle in the highs. I was surprised, as this used to be a go-to for a long time. But then again, I think that I was wanting lower gain at that point, and this would work better for that I think.

#4 - Pharaoh Supreme (Clone) - Oh, how the mighty have fallen! This used to be my #1 go-to fuzz overall, but since I've found CMC offerings, this has been toppled relatively quickly. Don't get me wrong, it's still an excellent Muff, but it's whole niche has been not being too extreme. It's marketed as working with your rig to get tones, and it does that 100%. But because of that, it's not too gainy or bright. Considering I am currently wanting pedals that can do it all on their own without changing my amp settings, the Pharaoh Supreme just wasn't cutting it (or the mix) today. It was sort of the opposite of the Supercollider '71 - the Pharaoh had plenty of body, but wasn't gainy enough or cutting the mix. It filled up the tone well, was plenty versatile with the various clipping options, but none of them quite got the job done. It would likely have performed better with a boost in front to juice it a bit, but I don't typically like to stack gains like that (and if I do, it's got to be a pedal that can do double-duty on identical settings). On guitar, if I need a bit "more", I just switch on my DOD BiFET Boost for a bit more cut and volume.

Anyway, that's what I did for a good chunk of the day. Hope this helps someone, and I can't wait for my other CMC Muffs to arrive!
 
Well, then, have I got something for you... (And it's nice to know someone enjoy my Muff ramblings!) And yes, you are correct that I haven't tried the Triangle or Elk (of any maker), and if we're talking specifically CMC I also haven't tried the Ram's Head (though I LOVE the Pharaoh Supreme, which is supposedly a Ram's Head derivative, hence why I NEED to try the CMC Ram's Head). However, I did recently order the Elk and Ram's Head from CMC, and in that conversation he mentioned that the Elk and Triangle had minor differences. I'm sure I'll be posting my thoughts on those when they arrive in a month or so hopefully...

Before I get too far - this is a GUITAR comparison. Feel free to skip the rest of this post if you're not interested.

Today was the shootout, as mentioned yesterday. My Muff contenders were a Swollen Pickle, Pharaoh Supreme (clone), Supercollider '71, CMC Civil War, and a Widogast (Dunwich Wizard clone).

I'll preface by saying that I have played an actual Pharaoh Supreme (and currently still own two of them!), but found during a previous shootout that I actually prefer the clone on guitar and the original on bass. Not really sure why, but I'm thinking the clone has something slightly off, as the Pre-Gain knob functions backwards from the original - i.e. clockwise gives you less gain instead of more gain. I also found it slightly brighter and gainier overall, which could 100% happen with any identical pedal due to parts tolerances. Additionally, I did the shootout with ALL of the pedals at volume on my "big guitar rig" (Peavey Transtube Supreme with matching 412 cab) before keeping #1 on that rig and shooting out the rest on my "small guitar rig" (Peavey Transtube Bandit and matching 112 extension cab). So I didn't have quite as many options on my second rig.

Another note - I seem to like low-ish gain Muffs on bass, and higher gain Muffs on guitar, as well as really needing chord and single note clarity on guitar. Not sure why, but that seems to be pretty consistent overall. Anyway, on to the results. I've got them ranked here in order.

#1 - CMC Civil War - This had an excellent mix of high gain cut and enough lows to balance it all out. It just works, and it is incredibly easy to dial in, like every CMC Muff I've had so far. It has the least of amount of lows of the CMC Muffs (though doesn't appear to cut lows as much as not distort them on bass), so as much as I liked it on bass, I think it is better suited for guitar use. I was able to play my (butchered) chords and some basic arpeggio-like stuff over a sustained note and each note rang out clearly, but also had plenty of body in the tone overall. It wasn't thin or nasally to get the clarity and note separation that I have seen and heard elsewhere. There was enough grit on the lows (though not a TON) to know you were playing a fuzz, and the highs were smooth and clear. (Perhaps I've finally gotten "violin-like" sustain from a fuzz? I've never really understood that term, but the highs were definitely distorted, but not gritty like the lows. They seemed to be a single, cutting note and not two tones on top of each other like we hear in bass discussions.) Anyway, the CMC absolutely killed it in every way for what I wanted. I'm glad that it turned out the way it did, because I've been waiting MONTHS for my amps to come back to test this hypothesis, as that's the feeling I got when I tried this pedal on bass a few months ago. (And I can thank this pedal for my recent love of CMC Effects pedals, too!) My preferred settings were LED diodes (though I prefer silicon for bass), Sustain about 1:30, Tone at noon, and Shape (aka Mids) at max.

#2 (tied) - Widogast (Dunwich Wizard Clone) - I've never played an actual Wizard, and can't justify the going rate, so I figured this was my best option when I saw it. It's incredibly gainy, as it's supposed to be, and I could hardly go past 10:30 on gain. In fact, a majority of the time, I was at 9:00 or lower on gain, with highs around 10:30, and lows from 1:30 to 3:00. The Input Cap selector has a huge impact on the amount of lows in the circuit, but there are always plenty of highs. I found that I could get incredibly similar tones to the CMC Civil War, but that the gain sacrificed a little clarity and note separation, with the extra harmonics sort of bleeding into each other. Now, I'm not saying the notes were indistinct - but they weren't quite as clear and the overall tone wasn't quite as round and full as the Civil War. If you want incredibly high gain Muff tones, this would be the clear winner for me. I found that even though I could get excellent tones, I was seemingly fighting the circuit trying to tame it for my needs. This wants to be incredibly high gain, and though I like higher gain Muffs on guitar over bass, I don't need THIS high of gain. So while it was a great pedal, and one that I'm holding on to for now, it's not quite as good for my uses as the Civil War. For better or worse, it reminded me of High On Fire guitar tones, and while I love those tones, it's not what I'm going for.

#2 (tied) - Swollen Pickle - Let's be honest, if you've followed ANY of my Muff ramblings, you knew this was going to be relatively high on the list. Again, this does not disappoint, but I did find this to be better on my "small rig" over my "big rig". It didn't do much for me on my "big rig" the first go around today, but that's not to say I couldn't get it to work (I probably could!) as it's so flexible. I'll say this, though - the internal trims on this make a HUGE difference on guitar - possibly even more so than on bass. I currently have 3 of these, because they almost always end up being just as good as my #1 choices, but in slightly different ways, and for the price, I'd say this is the absolute best all-around Muff money can buy. One is a dedicated "Bass Pickle", a second is my "Guitar Pickle", and the third is one that I just mess with to compare tones and knobs so I don't have to remember what tones I liked originally! Anyway, internal knobs. Clip was a big change for me. On bass, I actually prefer both internal knobs maxed. On guitar, I actually like quite a few settings, but for the tones mentioned earlier, I preferred Clip at 9:00. Voice remained maxed. Scoop is maxed, Crunch is at 10:30, Sustain is at 1:30, and Filter is just a hair past noon. Plenty of sustain, great note articulation, full body, and wooly enough to know it's a Muff. This ended up being the winner for my "small rig" mostly due to what I disliked about the Widogast. The Pickle had none of that, but does take a while to dial in. The Pickle, however, could also do plenty of other tones. At one point I have had this sounding nearly identical to my FatMetal, various other Muffs, the Fat Sandwich, and even something similar to an HM-2. If you adjust the Clip knob, it really opens up the versatility on this pedal for guitar, and I actually think that the stock settings are better on bass than guitar. But if you want heavy distortion, crank that clip knob - at least to noon!

#3 - Supercollider '71 - This one just didn't do much for me. It was gainy enough, and had articulation, but not quite the full body I could get from others. I didn't play with it much, because it just wasn't working for me today. I could get similar tones to the Civil War, but they sounded anemic in comparison and almost brittle in the highs. I was surprised, as this used to be a go-to for a long time. But then again, I think that I was wanting lower gain at that point, and this would work better for that I think.

#4 - Pharaoh Supreme (Clone) - Oh, how the mighty have fallen! This used to be my #1 go-to fuzz overall, but since I've found CMC offerings, this has been toppled relatively quickly. Don't get me wrong, it's still an excellent Muff, but it's whole niche has been not being too extreme. It's marketed as working with your rig to get tones, and it does that 100%. But because of that, it's not too gainy or bright. Considering I am currently wanting pedals that can do it all on their own without changing my amp settings, the Pharaoh Supreme just wasn't cutting it (or the mix) today. It was sort of the opposite of the Supercollider '71 - the Pharaoh had plenty of body, but wasn't gainy enough or cutting the mix. It filled up the tone well, was plenty versatile with the various clipping options, but none of them quite got the job done. It would likely have performed better with a boost in front to juice it a bit, but I don't typically like to stack gains like that (and if I do, it's got to be a pedal that can do double-duty on identical settings). On guitar, if I need a bit "more", I just switch on my DOD BiFET Boost for a bit more cut and volume.

Anyway, that's what I did for a good chunk of the day. Hope this helps someone, and I can't wait for my other CMC Muffs to arrive!

I gotta read through the rest of it, but if you have any interest through trade or otherwise, I have a Wren and Cuff violet caprid that I'm looking to move if exploring more Ram's heads are in the future. It's killer, but I think I'm more of an elk or all the other funky muffs with weird tone stacks and whatnot.
 
I gotta read through the rest of it, but if you have any interest through trade or otherwise, I have a Wren and Cuff violet caprid that I'm looking to move if exploring more Ram's heads are in the future. It's killer, but I think I'm more of an elk or all the other funky muffs with weird tone stacks and whatnot.
Maybe? Does the Violet Caprid do anything "special" Muff-wise? We'll see what I think of the CMC and my other current stash of Muffs. As of right now, I'm not really searching for any other pedals... We'll see how long that lasts, but my GAS has mostly subsided recently. Just one or two things, upgrading my basses/guitars, but nothing urgent or that I really need. I just figured for as much as I love Muffs, and as affordable and high-quality the CMC offerings have been, I should try out those other variants.
 
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Maybe? Does the Violet Caprid do anything "special" Muff-wise? We'll see what I think of the CMC and my other current stash of Muffs. As of right now, I'm not really searching for any other pedals... We'll see how long that lasts, but my GAS has mostly subsided recently. Just one or two things, upgrading my basses/guitars, but nothing urgent or that I really need. I just figured for as much as I love Muffs, and as affordable and high-quality the CMC offerings have been, I should try out those other variants.

Yes and no, kinda like the diff between a triangle and an Elk I'm guessing. Same overall circuit iteration as a Ram's Head, but with a few minor but noticeable differences. I didn't have them at the same time, but I've had both of the caprid small boxes. The violet one did have more gain range I felt and broke up differently, but hard to describe. I've never looked, but I wonder if there's comparison demos.
 
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Yes and no, kinda like the diff between a triangle and an Elk I'm guessing. Same overall circuit iteration as a Ram's Head, but with a few minor but noticeable differences. I didn't have them at the same time, but I've had both of the caprid small boxes. The violet one did have more gain range I felt and broke up differently, but hard to describe. I've never looked, but I wonder if there's comparison demos.

We'll see what happens. At this point, it's completely possible I'll be totally satisfied with the array of CMC Muffs. I'll theoretically have pretty much every style of Muff available, and with slight upgrades to the originals like clipping options, true bypass, and of course a mids control. Each one really has been pretty great. Certainly all in the same Muff family, but also different, and each has been absolute simplicity to dial in. Plus small enclosures and top jacks! I really couldn't think of a way to improve them as a group. Or even as individual pedals!
 
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It's here! I don't understand how Guild ahips these things with roundwound strings. Still waiting for the strings to arrive, it could be a a few more weeks before I really get to hear what it sounds like.

string spacing will take some getting used to and the neck is chunkier than i expected but overall it feels quite good. may sand down the back of the neck as tbe finish is a bit too thick.

How does it feel to play a hollow body bass? Does it make much of difference in tone or feeling? Looks gorgeous either way :)
 
How does it feel to play a hollow body bass? Does it make much of difference in tone or feeling? Looks gorgeous either way :)


I haven't plugged it in yet. the starfire is semi-hollow but it definitely resonates differently than my solid body basses. neck is proving more difficult to play than i thought but i'm sure i will eventually get comfortable with it.
 
I haven't plugged it in yet. the starfire is semi-hollow but it definitely resonates differently than my solid body basses. neck is proving more difficult to play than i thought but i'm sure i will eventually get comfortable with it.

Thanks kinda why I've thought about grabbing one of the starcaster or Coronado fender basses. Get that nice fender style neck vs the thicker styles on a lot of other similar basses.
 
It's here! I don't understand how Guild ahips these things with roundwound strings. Still waiting for the strings to arrive, it could be a a few more weeks before I really get to hear what it sounds like.

string spacing will take some getting used to and the neck is chunkier than i expected but overall it feels quite good. may sand down the back of the neck as tbe finish is a bit too thick.

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Getting the intonation right on that bridge looks very time consuming. Loosen string, loosen screw, move a bit, tighten everything, test, repeat.
 
I didn't even know they were resurrecting Sunn...
I saw some of their Instagram posts, seemed like a kinda fishy crowdfunding scheme. How Fender never turned the brand around on their own is something I don't really get. Model T remains the most iconic amplifier in doom and is more well known than ever but they still had to license it out? The current licensing is pretty opaque just citing the owners as "experienced music and electronics industry executives" and they very blatantly just added their marketing blurb to the Sunn Wikipedia page. If they're actually delivering that's great, but I'm so sketched out by this whole story. Hope they keep delivering and re-establish the brand.
 
I saw some of their Instagram posts, seemed like a kinda fishy crowdfunding scheme. How Fender never turned the brand around on their own is something I don't really get. Model T remains the most iconic amplifier in doom and is more well known than ever but they still had to license it out? The current licensing is pretty opaque just citing the owners as "experienced music and electronics industry executives" and they very blatantly just added their marketing blurb to the Sunn Wikipedia page. If they're actually delivering that's great, but I'm so sketched out by this whole story. Hope they keep delivering and re-establish the brand.
I have no horse in this race - never played Sunn, have no desire to do so. I love my GK rigs. But I know they're iconic, and apparently with good reason. I'd hope that they get the treatment they deserve.