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Stoner/Doom Bassists Thread, Part 90: Maxed Out

Huh, I had no clue, but it doesn't really surprise me the way corps unearth something from somewhere to capture more $$$ from whatever niche group, no matter how small they might be.

The Sunns I owned were pretty meh, one was a Sonaro and the other was a Beta Bass. The Sonaro had a rectifier in it so it could have been better but I flipped it for some reason. The Beta was real midrangey and wouldn't flap your pant leg hardly at all. $3200 for a new 200s is spicy, if it's hand built in the US, it might be alright.
 
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I saw some of their Instagram posts, seemed like a kinda fishy crowdfunding scheme. How Fender never turned the brand around on their own is something I don't really get. Model T remains the most iconic amplifier in doom and is more well known than ever but they still had to license it out? The current licensing is pretty opaque just citing the owners as "experienced music and electronics industry executives" and they very blatantly just added their marketing blurb to the Sunn Wikipedia page. If they're actually delivering that's great, but I'm so sketched out by this whole story. Hope they keep delivering and re-establish the brand.

Huh, I had no clue, but it doesn't really surprise me the way corps unearth something from somewhere to capture more $$$ from whatever niche group, no matter how small they might be.

The Sunns I owned were pretty meh, one was a Sonaro and the other was a Beta Bass. The Sonaro had a rectifier in it so it could have been better but I flipped it for some reason. The Beta was real midrangey and wouldn't flap your pant leg hardly at all. $3200 for a new 200s is spicy, if it's hand built in the US, it might be alright.

So some of its leaders are the guy responsible for growing Fender's custom shop from the small outfit to the massive line that it is today, and somebody (I think lead engineer) from mission engineering. Yeah from what I've read and understood, all the amps are made in California, I think in Mission's shop. The price on the Beta amps doesn't seem bad at all, the rest are for sure collector pieces. Sucks, but I guess that kinda seems going rate for small volume production big tube amps

If I understand right, the guy from Fender had been pushing to resurrect Sunn for some time, but they wouldn't, so they decided to try it on their own once they convinced Fender to license it to them.

Sunn, just like SWR and many others (no different than the same things happening to brands bought out by Gibson), often just get milked dry while also being slimmed to nothing to maximize margin and efficiencies. This ends up collapsing them because what was working was drastically changed and stuff just ends up getting messed up operationally, quality & design wise, distribution, target market, and everything else.


Edit: Not saying that its not just a cash grab or that it's not sketchy, but seems pretty legit as far as passion and wanting to truly revive it. The marketing and whatnot is cringe worthy, but I do hope to see them revive the brand. I dig the speakers I've tried, but they are massive.
 
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Two examples of the being bought out, besides tons of others, are epiphone and squier. Though they are both very successful brands, epiphone is supposedly a shadow of its former self, squier I'm not too sure if they made high quality or introductory level instruments before being bought.

Epiphone though, if I recall right, was a straight competitor to Gibson. Making high quality, top tier as well as various other priced tiers. When Gibson acquired them, they dropped those and became what we know now. I don't know any details or how fast and whatnot, but yeah.

I'm certainly far from being an expert, but have read some interviews and other articles over the years and that's kinda the summary of what I recall.
 
So some of its leaders are the guy responsible for growing Fender's custom shop from the small outfit to the massive line that it is today, and somebody (I think lead engineer) from mission engineering. Yeah from what I've read and understood, all the amps are made in California, I think in Mission's shop. The price on the Beta amps doesn't seem bad at all, the rest are for sure collector pieces. Sucks, but I guess that kinda seems going rate for small volume production big tube amps

If I understand right, the guy from Fender had been pushing to resurrect Sunn for some time, but they wouldn't, so they decided to try it on their own once they convinced Fender to license it to them.

Sunn, just like SWR and many others (no different than the same things happening to brands bought out by Gibson), often just get milked dry while also being slimmed to nothing to maximize margin and efficiencies. This ends up collapsing them because what was working was drastically changed and stuff just ends up getting messed up operationally, quality & design wise, distribution, target market, and everything else.


Edit: Not saying that its not just a cash grab or that it's not sketchy, but seems pretty legit as far as passion and wanting to truly revive it. The marketing and whatnot is cringe worthy, but I do hope to see them revive the brand. I dig the speakers I've tried, but they are massive.
Yeah, seems like Fender did with Sunn Model T like the 'resurrected' Magnatone amps (are these owned by Gibson?) and went all the way to the "ultra premium" price tags. Thankfully the betas are decently priced. Though they should sell them at the Orange Crush 120 /Super Crush 100 price point and watch them sell out faster than they could make them.
 
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Ended up scoring a 1001rb mark 2 mounted in a 2x10. I've been trying to find any other examples of one of these. I've seen lots of mark 1s but so far this is the only one with a mark 2 I've found. It seems like alot of amp fir a 2x10. Gonna sound sick in the new project.

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Ended up scoring a 1001rb mark 2 mounted in a 2x10. I've been trying to find any other examples of one of these. I've seen lots of mark 1s but so far this is the only one with a mark 2 I've found. It seems like alot of amp fir a 2x10. Gonna sound sick in the new project.

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I've been looking for a decent priced version of that with a 400RB. Would be a great small rig.
 
I've been looking for a decent priced version of that with a 400RB. Would be a great small rig.

I've been loving this one even for at home practice. It sounds good even at relatively low volume. It does sound better louder though because the power amp saturation. I've got a tronographic rusty box ordered to push it a little. It sounds good with some extra gain into the front. Right now I'm using the ocd with almost zero drive to push the front end.
 
I've been loving this one even for at home practice. It sounds good even at relatively low volume. It does sound better louder though because the power amp saturation. I've got a tronographic rusty box ordered to push it a little. It sounds good with some extra gain into the front. Right now I'm using the ocd with almost zero drive to push the front end.
I have a 400RB-IV and a 700RB-II, but my issue is the cabs. I only have 410s, which I absolutely love, but don't do quiet well. I'd practice more if the rest of my house didn't have to suffer through it. I've been looking for a long while for either a decent GK 210 or 112 for a good price. Failing that, I was looking for a combo like you've found. Glad it sounds that good - just means it'll be better for me when I finally get one!
 
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What's happening, Doom Room? Haven't played much bass lately, though I have done a decent amount of guitar. Nothing doomy, though - more in the Germanic Thrash tradition. (Besides my recent Muff shootout.) But loving it! Other than that, been enjoying the summer trying to get in shape by swimming and jogging, and have taken a break from reading to re-visit Fallout 3, which is probably my favorite game of all time. (Not that I actively keep up with gaming, but still.) Anyway, I feel that itch has nearly been scratched, and I'll probably start reading again. May try and record something on my guitar and put a bass line to it. We'll see what happens. Hope everyone is having as good a few weeks as I have been lately!
 
I've been looking for a decent priced version of that with a 400RB. Would be a great small rig.

There are a few at MF, cheapest being $399. I've been passively searching for either an old 400 or 800 that I definitely don't need but want sooooo badly.
 
There are a few at MF, cheapest being $399. I've been passively searching for either an old 400 or 800 that I definitely don't need but want sooooo badly.
"Passively searching" is the right term for me as well. I'd like a 400RB combo, but also still can't justify it for $400. So if it drops in my lap, or happens to be in a random search when I search it, and for a GREAT price, I'd very much consider doing it. For now, I'll have to live with turning my 400RB-IV down low when playing through my 410. Or maybe settling for my makeshift headphone rig.
 
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Don’t know if it’s been mentioned here, but I’ve been on a big Chat Pile kick lately. I feel like these dudes are one of the most unique and heavy bands of the last decade. I can’t get enough and their expression of a wide blend of influences with cohesion is crazy to me…
 
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Don’t know if it’s been mentioned here, but I’ve been on a big Chat Pile kick lately. I feel like these dudes are one of the most unique and heavy bands of the last decade. I can’t get enough and their expression of a wide blend of influences with cohesion is crazy to me…

Never even heard of em, good look, I gotta check em out.

Yeah, seems like Fender did with Sunn Model T like the 'resurrected' Magnatone amps (are these owned by Gibson?) and went all the way to the "ultra premium" price tags. Thankfully the betas are decently priced. Though they should sell them at the Orange Crush 120 /Super Crush 100 price point and watch them sell out faster than they could make them.

Yeah, I wonder if once they get established they do something of that end and have an import line. I'd imagine if they either had a legit production line they could do a lot to drop price point and still be built in US, but yeah, honestly I'll take it. They seem to be into it to really bring it back, not just for a cash grab.

I have no clue on the magnatone, I saw the same. I wonder if it's guided or controlled by Gibson vs just being licensed by them.

I think something might give, the market for high point stuff has got to be aging out. I recall the crisis of this being talked about a decade ago, but it seems to have only progressed more, not fallen off.

What's happening, Doom Room? Haven't played much bass lately, though I have done a decent amount of guitar. Nothing doomy, though - more in the Germanic Thrash tradition. (Besides my recent Muff shootout.) But loving it! Other than that, been enjoying the summer trying to get in shape by swimming and jogging, and have taken a break from reading to re-visit Fallout 3, which is probably my favorite game of all time. (Not that I actively keep up with gaming, but still.) Anyway, I feel that itch has nearly been scratched, and I'll probably start reading again. May try and record something on my guitar and put a bass line to it. We'll see what happens. Hope everyone is having as good a few weeks as I have been lately!

I'll take your 3 and raise you NV. Though I will say that 3, NV, and Morrowind are 3 of my all time favorite games, not counting anything pre 2k. I don't keep up on gaming either and the only functional gaming equipment I have is my SNES.
 
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Morrowind is up there for me. I put sooo many hours into that game back in the day. I kinda want to go back and play it again now that I have a laptop again.

Skyrim Doing another playthrough right now (AE on Switch). It's gaming comfort food. Lol. I worry that the shortcomings of Morrowind might make me enjoy it less now. (The lack of waypoints, vague directions, terrible journal/quest tracking). Though Morrowind was fun to absolutely break in ways even Skyrim couldn't be broken, lol. It's part of the charm.

I played a bunch of Oblivion too, but Morrowind hit at the right time of my life. I wasn't gaming much when Oblivion came out so I have way less into that game.
 
Two examples of the being bought out, besides tons of others, are epiphone and squier. Though they are both very successful brands, epiphone is supposedly a shadow of its former self, squier I'm not too sure if they made high quality or introductory level instruments before being bought.

Epiphone though, if I recall right, was a straight competitor to Gibson. Making high quality, top tier as well as various other priced tiers. When Gibson acquired them, they dropped those and became what we know now. I don't know any details or how fast and whatnot, but yeah.

I'm certainly far from being an expert, but have read some interviews and other articles over the years and that's kinda the summary of what I recall.
Gibson initially kept the Epiphone quality high, as sort of a mirror brand, plus offered features/models that Gibson didn’t have. I don’t know what the marketing/import quirks were, but that is why you’d see many British Invasion bands use them instead of Gibson. About 1970, Gibson reverted the name to Japanese made budget models that had a vague resemblance to the older stuff, but still looked cheesy. This was in addition to the US made Melody Maker beginner/budget line(the equivalent of Duo Sonic/Mustang) which was being phased out. There was another related budget brand, Kalamazoo, which I never quite figured out where they fit in. The Epiphone brand eventially faded away until the name was revived in the 80’s/90’s, and applied to Korean made instruments(initially)that mimiced the classic Gibson designs and were of a higher quality, the counterpart of what Fender was doing with Squier. Then there is the Orville line, which, like Fender Japan, is of high quality, but not meant to be marketed in the US and Europe(I think).
 
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I'll take your 3 and raise you NV. Though I will say that 3, NV, and Morrowind are 3 of my all time favorite games, not counting anything pre 2k. I don't keep up on gaming either and the only functional gaming equipment I have is my SNES.

NV was good, but I absolutely loved the depth of Fallout 3. So many little Easter eggs and random (alternate) historical tidbits. I played Morrowind for a LONG while, but mostly just running around. My time playing was disjointed enough that I could never remember what I was actually supposed to be doing, and just explored. I remember I managed to make a spell that permanently increased my strength or something, so I literally just looted everything and when I became over-encumbered, I just cast that spell a few times and went on my way. I had a similar spell with jump, but if I remember correctly, when I did that, I'd jump so high I'd die from fall damage... By the time I figured out what I was supposed to be doing on the main quest, it was a massive series of courier missions, and I was done with that.

Anyway, Oblivion was amazing, and I think Skyrim was even better (mostly because of its "Norse" setting), but I think Fallout 3 is still my favorite. I guess I'm still a sci-fi geek before fantasy - that Star Wars got in deep way back when. That being said, I've only beaten Oblivion and Skyrim once, and have debated starting those up again in the near future. We'll see what happens, as these days I'm certainly more fantasy that sci-fi.
 
Cross-posted from the Fuzz Addicts page:

Well, the CMC Elk/Hizumitas and Ram's Head Muffs came in. Here are my initial thoughts after ~30 minutes of tweaking:

Short version - neither of them is replacing my #1 Muffs on bass (CMC Bubble Font) OR guitar (CMC Civil War). But they are both great additions to my Muff arsenal, with enough differences in tone to keep any/all of them, especially given the price. I preferred them both on Silicon diodes, and only ran through my "Big Rig" - a GK 700RB-II with a matching 410 Neo cab.

And here are some details:

Ram's Head: Not shy on the lows, but not as much lows (or maybe low mids?) as the Bubble Font (or Tall Font). It's definitely gainier than the Bubble Font, as even at 8:00 the Sustain knob had considerably more gain than the BF's Sustain at 9:00. The "feel" of this is similar to the Pharaoh I have, but not quite the same. I prefer the Pharaoh's "feel" slightly, as it seems a bit tighter in the distortion, though this is definitely brighter and able to cut more. However, it sacrifices some of the "heftiness" of the Pharaoh and Bubble Font to do so. It worked when I jammed along to Sabbath, but doesn't have the "oomph" in the lows/low mids. I ended up cranking the Shape knob, keeping Tone right at noon (or slightly before), and Sustain at about 8:00. This gave me similar EQ to the Bubble Font (minus the previously mentioned "oomph" of the BF), but more gain and cut. The dirt "feel" is also looser than the BF and Pharaoh, which I initially thought I'd want, but I think I prefer the slightly tighter distortion and overall more full range spectrum of the BF. The Ram's Head seems like it may do better for slower, looser, and sludgier tones, which I also enjoy. So it's certainly a worthwhile addition, and one I'll keep, but not going to replace my CMC Bubble Font for everyday usage.

Elk/Hizumitas: This one surprised me, mostly because I thought I wasn't going to like it much on bass and prefer it on guitar by a wider margin. The opposite proved true. Out of the mix, I was not impressed. It seemed way too gainy and with too many brittle highs and extended, loose lows. In the mix, however, it really worked. The lows were looser than I'd prefer, but not to extremes (probably similar to my CMC Tall Font, but I haven't A/B'ed them yet) and the highs were crisp, with the brittleness seemingly mixing into the guitar tone. All that being said, to get those extra lows and highs, you are giving up much of the midrange. There is a definite scoop happening, and while it works in the mix, I don't necessarily like that the mids the definition give are being lost. It's not a bad tone by any stretch, but loses some of the body of your tone. It seems that in the mix, this one "cleans up" a bit as it doesn't sound as dirty as it does solo, but still has audible dirt. One final note before settings - this one was LOUD. I had the volume at 8:00 or so, whereas I typically have the other CMC Muffs about 1:00. The settings ended up being Tone about 11:00, Sustain at 9:00, and Shape at 3:00.

I also gave them a quick run through on my main guitar rig, competing with my current favorite guitar Muff - the CMC Civil War. I didn't take as much time to do this one, so I don't have as definitive results yet. Short version is that the Ram's Head can get really close to that Civil War tone, but always slightly looser feeling. Not sure how I feel about that at the moment, but I like them both. The Elk ended up being a bit too loose and almost brittle for me on guitar so far, but we'll see what I think as I keep tweaking.

Tomorrow I plan on comparing the Elk/Hizumitas, Ram's Head, and Swollen Pickle on my #2 bass rig (that is currently running the Swollen Pickle). We'll see what happens.