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Subs volume Q?

DWBass

DWBass

The Funkfather
Jan 24, 2003
24,632
1
22,479
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Newport News, VA via NYC
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#1
Just wondering how loud should subs get? I have a set of Community XLT55's (dual 15's) running off one side of a Crown XLS2500 in crossover mode (2ohm load/sharing 1550w). The volume is up all the way and the subs seem like they are barely kicking. :confused:

They may be set up wrong as the drummer set them up in his garage and he has a minimal understanding of how PA's are to be setup. But I'm just wondering.
 
#2
Just like a bass rig vs a guitar rig, you need more power to the subs then going to the mains (probably at least double).

When I ran my own PA, I used two 1800 watt power amps.

The first was split (like yours) using one side for monitors and the other for mains (900 watts each side).

The second power amp was bridged for 1800 watts to the subs.
 
#4
thumbknuckle said:
Are you lighting up the clip limiters on the amp? There are ways you can massage the signal to move that point around, but hitting the limiters is the only way you know you are getting the amp to put out as much as it's got. Where you have the volume knob set doesn't mean anything.
Click to expand...
I was about to ask about that. I read something somewhere where these 'limiters' can be manipulated or defeated. It's a supposedly pretty powerful amp and I was wondering where all the 'power' was!! :confused:
 
#5
DWBass said:
I was about to ask about that. I read something somewhere where these 'limiters' can be manipulated or defeated. It's a supposedly pretty powerful amp and I was wondering where all the 'power' was!! :confused:
Click to expand...

Are you sure all cables to and from the amp are good? Maybe a dumb question, but always the place to start.
If you know the cables are good, looking at the manual for your amp, the meters are supposedly output meters, so what level are you seeing on the meters? Are you at least seeing the -19dB LED light? Even at -19dB it should be thumping. Also the limiter can only be turned on or off, there's no adjustable threshold from what I see so that shouldn't be affecting the volume.
 
#6
DWBass said:
I was about to ask about that. I read something somewhere where these 'limiters' can be manipulated or defeated. It's a supposedly pretty powerful amp and I was wondering where all the 'power' was!! :confused:
Click to expand...

I have no idea about that amp in particular, but with any amp you run out of power at some point and usually a light flashes.

Kick drum is a great test case, have your drummer play steady quarter notes and push up the fader. Eventually you will see the clip light start flashing. That's as loud as that kick drum, with that mic, that processing, and those subs, gets.
 
#8
It's possible that a lot of the amp's power is being wasted on frequencies you can't really hear. If you have a graphic EQ available try putting it between the mixer and amp, and cut the lowest frequencies all the way down. Anything below 60 requires a ton of power, and anything below 40 isn't audible to most adults.

Also, how do you have it connected? It's possible the amp just isn't getting a very strong signal.
 
#9
DWBass said:
Just wondering how loud should subs get? I have a set of Community XLT55's (dual 15's) running off one side of a Crown XLS2500 in crossover mode (2ohm load/sharing 1550w). The volume is up all the way and the subs seem like they are barely kicking. :confused:

They may be set up wrong as the drummer set them up in his garage and he has a minimal understanding of how PA's are to be setup. But I'm just wondering.
Click to expand...

I see a couple of potential problems with your setup so let's look at it step by step: first, the amp should be put into bridge mono mode. Once you're in bridge-mono mode you need to select Low Pass Filter mode, not Crossover mode. Once you're in LPF mode you can choose your cutoff / x-over frequency (100 Hz is a safe place to start but you'll need to do some experimenting to see how they interact with your top boxes, which should be hi-passed at the same frequency).

Next, you should only be using the channel 1 input and output of the amp. In bridge mode the amp is only stable to 4 ohms according to page 4 of the manual. This means you should only run one speaker in bridge mode or switch the amp to parallel mode and run 1 sub at 4 ohms per side.

Finally, make sure the input meters on the front of the amp are showing plenty of signal is coming from the mixer. You should be hovering around -20 to -10 on the input meters for your initial testing which should be plenty loud.

Final note: since you are not using an external x-over/driverack you will need to balance the subs & the top box levels by ear using the gain controls on the amps.

Invalid Link Removed
 
#11
testing1two said:
I see a couple of potential problems with your setup so let's look at it step by step: first, the amp should be put into bridge mono mode. Once you're in bridge-mono mode you need to select Low Pass Filter mode, not Crossover mode. Once you're in LPF mode you can choose your cutoff / x-over frequency (100 Hz is a safe place to start but you'll need to do some experimenting to see how they interact with your top boxes, which should be hi-passed at the same frequency).

Next, you should only be using the channel 1 input and output of the amp. In bridge mode the amp is only stable to 4 ohms according to page 4 of the manual.

Finally, make sure the input meters on the front of the amp are showing plenty of signal is coming from the mixer. You should be hovering around -20 to -10 on the input meters for your initial testing which should be plenty loud.

Final note: since you are not using an external x-over/driverack you will need to balance the subs & the top box levels by ear using the gain controls on the amps.

Invalid Link Removed
Click to expand...

I think this is probably a very bad idea. That amp is marginal at 2 ohms just using one side, you could well fry the thing trying to drive that load bridged.

Tops off one side, subs off the other like you are running now is fine. Tops off a different amp and subs one off each side in parallel is probably better. Both subs bridged is a bad idea.
 
#12
thumbknuckle said:
I think this is probably a very bad idea. That amp is marginal at 2 ohms just using one side, you could well fry the thing trying to drive that load bridged.

Tops off one side, subs off the other like you are running now is fine. Tops off a different amp and subs one off each side in parallel is probably better. Both subs bridged is a bad idea.
Click to expand...

Ah, you reminded me of one very important sentence I forgot to type...fixed.
 
#14
This amp has a 'Crossover mode'. You connect only 1 side of the mixer into the amp. Then side 1 is sent to the subs and side 2 is sent to the mains. The amp can run down to 2 ohms in this mode. The subs are 4ohms each and are daisy chained. Crossover point chosen (the amps asks) is 100hz. Mains are 8ohms each and are also daisy chained. The volume of the mains were fine. The subs were pumping but I was just wondering how 'loud' they should be. With close to 1500w available, split between each sub, I thought they would be a little louder.

For further reference, please see page 4 of that manual linked above. I'm going to recheck the connections and turn the limiter off and see if that helps.
 

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