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The Bass is too loud.

R

Robroy

Guest
Jun 21, 2006
3,551
3,605
#1
My first experience playing bass (I went from trombone to bass) was in my church band. I had a Yamaha five string with a carvin bass amp plugged into an ACME Bass 2x10. The guitar player had a stack of two 4x12’s plugged into a Peavey electronic effects loaded 200 watt head. And because he could only strum chords while actually in front of a crowd that is all he ever did. And he did it with a lot of bass in his mix. I politely complained about it a few times that he was getting into my “space” in the sound, but nothing was ever done.
Also, the leader didn’t really like me because I was the only “free spirit” in the band that didn’t just do what she said. I’d sometimes push back – always smiling. The sound man was also her husband, wasn’t very good at it, and the sound booth was in a “bass standing wave” hot spot.
So, they were always complaining that the bass was too loud and it finally came to a head – for all of us. What happened was, I turned it down. And it was still too loud. So I turned down some more. It was still too loud.

I then turned it all the way off and continued playing. It was STILL too loud.
At that point I explained that the bass was turned off and what they were hearing was the guitar.

The problem was solved. Permanently, if for no other reason that they listened to me from that day on when I brought up issues.
 
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#3
tangentmusic said:
I'm glad you were able to prove your point.
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The leader was a huge type "A" woman and I have always been a "class clown". But I've also been professionally trained in live sound. I'd quietly offer suggestions to improve various problems but she would never have any of it. I finally had to just "shame them" into reality. It made me feel really good in one way, but like a heel in another.

An interesting epilog was that when a better drummer came along, they kicked out the old drummer - long time church member and not really bad - and then when they wanted a larger church, the entire band quit and moved to a different church - without even asking me along. ;-)

I became the music leader and got a great worship team together comprised of me and kids from the high school age kids and early 20 somethings together. It was really great. Things do seem to always work out in the end.
 
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#4
Robroy said:
My first experience playing bass (I went from trombone to bass) was in my church band. I had a Yamaha five string with a carvin bass amp plugged into an ACME Bass 2x10. The guitar player had a stack of two 4x12’s plugged into a Peavey electronic effects loaded 200 watt head. And because he could only strum chords while actually in front of a crowd that is all he ever did. And he did it with a lot of bass in his mix. I politely complained about it a few times that he was getting into my “space” in the sound, but nothing was ever done.
Also, the leader didn’t really like me because I was the only “free spirit” in the band that didn’t just do what she said. I’d sometimes push back – always smiling. The sound man was also her husband, wasn’t very good at it, and the sound booth was in a “bass standing wave” hot spot.
So, they were always complaining that the bass was too loud and it finally came to a head – for all of us. What happened was, I turned it down. And it was still too loud. So I turned down some more. It was still too loud.

I then turned it all the way off and continued playing. It was STILL too loud.
At that point I explained that the bass was turned off and what they were hearing was the guitar.

The problem was solved. Permanently, if for no other reason that they listened to me from that day on when I brought up issues.
Click to expand...

I've done this too, but gone a step further and not even bothered plugging in. Really creates a scene when you can walk offstage with your bass.

Lonnybass
 
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#6
Lonnybass said:
I've done this too, but gone a step further and not even bothered plugging in. Really creates a scene when you can walk offstage with your bass.

Lonnybass
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HAHAHA! That would be hilarious. Would really drive the point home, too.

I'm the sound man in all three of my bands here. When I plug keys into the PA, I'm careful to keep their bass turned down a bit, depending on their style and the band's style. If they are constantly fighting me as though they were a second bass, I'll turn the bass down quite a bit. They still cut through but without the sound of duelling basses.
 
#10
M0ses said:
What kind of fu***** moron would plug into 8x12 speakers at a church gig in the first place.
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Yeah. I didn't really want to get into that. But I literally started playing bass in this band and didn't have any background of any sort gigging in a band. (and I was 44 at the time). The longer I was in the band and the more I read (at sites like this) the more I wondered what the heck he was doing with such a rig in the church.

A side note: He'd bring in these amazing cassette recordings of him shredding at home, but in front of a crowd, all he ever did was timidly strum chords. He also had a family and his dining room was dedicated to his musical stuff. Two years after I joined the band he was divorced.
 
#11
I ran into the same situation with a piano player. Sunday morning my levels were perfect, no confilcts, the low sonic space was all mine. Sunday night at practice with a different piano player suddenly I'm too loud. Funny thing is nothing had changed from that morning. No one had touched anything and now I'm too loud. I suffered through practice and the next Sunday some people were sick and missing so I ended up running the projection computer for singing instead of playing bass. One of the missing happened to be our worship leader so when I caught up with him later I had him listen to the recording of that Sundays service. I asked him how my bass sounded and he replied that I sounded great and I was really on my game that morning. Funny, I told him, I was sitting in the sound booth running the computer, that bass you hear was all piano. Now he has a much better handle on sonic space!
 
#12
Kamikaze3955 said:
Now he has a much better handle on sonic space!
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In pretty much every band I'm in I have to give some sort of primer on "sonic space". I compare a band to a basketball team. It has a couple of important paralells.
1. If everyone plays in the same space, they are gonna suck.
2. Even if every player is a pro, if they don't rehearse together they will not play as a team, and they will suck. When you know each other's moves, intuitively, you are a force to be reconed with.
 
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#15
Done the same before but I simply unplugged my wireless and left the angle jack hanging through my strap so everyone could see it if/when they turned around to give me the bulldog face.
 
#16
Robroy said:
In pretty much every band I'm in I have to give some sort of primer on "sonic space". I compare a band to a basketball team. It has a couple of important paralells.
1. If everyone plays in the same space, they are gonna suck.
2. Even if every player is a pro, if they don't rehearse together they will not play as a team, and they will suck. When you know each other's moves, intuitively, you are a force to be reconed with.
Click to expand...

Same here. The band I'm in now (and have been for 10 years) had an original they had been working on for years. It was a tune that had the potential to be a cool, funky groove, but it was way too busy. I couldn't get a handle on a bass line that would fit. It seemed like each of the other guys in the band thought that THEY were the one who would provide the "funk", and each of them had a different idea of what that funk was. I finally told them, "Let's just strip this thing down to the bare essence, and quit overplaying." We started building the song from the ground up, and suddenly, it started to take form. We play it out now. I settled on the bass line when we recorded the basic tracks, and now each person has their part to play, and no one is overplaying.

We've had those discussions about sonic space. And we've had those discussions about "the bass is too loud", usually in the context of situations where I could not hear my bass. Part of the problem was solved when I started using the fEARful 15/6 I built. Cleaned up the whole bottom end of the band, and now I get compliments from the other band members (and other bass players in the audience) on how clean and clear my bass sound is. No more complaints about "too loud".

I played in a band with a keyboard player that tended to have too much bass in his sound, and on more than one occasion, I told him that he was going to have to decide whether he was the bass player, or I was the bass player, because we can't both be the bass player. A couple of times, I told him, "if you're going to play what you're playing down there, I'll play guitar on this song" (I played both guitar and bass in the band, depending on what the song needed). He claimed that if he didn't play bass notes with his left hand, his right hand wouldn't know what to do...I told him, "That's just a habit. You can learn to do it without the bass notes". He eventually did.
 
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#17
What kind of "music director" or "sound man" could listen to an ensemble and be incapable of recognizing whether or not a bass line is happening? Even with a frequency-range hog of a rhythm guitar player, that is so amateur hour it almost defies belief. You weren't a heel, you just unintentionally exposed that couple as being utterly unqualified and incompetent. Good thing for you, your church, and the music that they left!
 
#19
Wow that is a new one on me "bass is too loud" :) It is everyone's favorite line until they fine out the the guitarist is sitting in your sonic space in the mix happen too me many many times. A owner complained one time I stopped playing mid song and put my bass on the stand and walked over to him and said do you still think it is me? He didn't know where to hide after that.
 
#20
REV said:
What sometimes gets lost in a praise band is, what is their purpose? It's not about the musicians, they are there to serve. The music is there to inspire.
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There is no reason everyone can't be professional and respectful of each other while they are serving. Every performance is serving someone, there is no need to be a doormat regardless of the venue.
 

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